Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Tom Head, May 22, 2003.
From the UCSF Medical Center:
A very satisfying letter from Southwest Airlines
I've written a couple of times to Southwest Airlines, suggesting that they are not doing their customers a favor by running big color ads from terrible schools in their in-flight magazine.
They have never replied or done anything.
Today I got a letter from an HR executive of Southwest Airlines, saying that they have an applicant with a degree from one of the very former Louisiana schools that advertises in their magazine, and he couldn't find it in any directory, and did I have any opinions.
As a matter of fact I did.
And after explaining what I knew about the schools, and its equally dreadful accrediting agency, I suggested that if he did decide not to accept it, he might want to mention that to the folks at his company's magazine.
We shall see.
Surely John Bear's Southwest Airlines report is somewhat out of place under "Buddhism works"? Unless Dr Bear sees himself
as a reincarnation of the Buddha?
Anyhow it seems to me that from his discussions with the Airline HR person that the perceived view might well be that Dr Bear sees himself as Judge, Jury and Executioner of the applicant?
Besides his subjective belief that the applicant had a qualification from a degree mill/unaccredited/bogus institution perhaps he could let us know what other qualifications the applicant had in his CV?
Are you kidding me?? It is so obvious. This was a very satisfying letter for him which made him HAPPY. Therefore, he must be a BUDDHIST (spelling?)!
Letter from Southwest
Dear Dr. Bear:
As a preface please note that I do not endorse non accreditted schools without the proper disclosure by a job applicant. But, All things being equal I would be more apt to hire someone that actually disclosed a less than wonderful degree rather than not hire him/her for having it.
As you are no doubt aware, it is EXTREMELY dangerous to give a bad or otherwise biased opinion regarding anyone or anything related to a job applicant to a prospective employer. The law is a minefield in this area. ( at least in California)
I hope that you tempered your comments regarding the less than wonderful school and the dreadful accrediting agency with " You should however, look further into the applicants talents and experience and see if the school he selected has indeed verified those qualifications as they apply to the position that he/she is applying for and not rely solely on my opinions".
I have seen this non endorsement of applicants backfire a few times in the form of a complaint and or lawsuit.
I actually hired someone that claimed on his application that he had a " Self taught MBA". This was light years before I discovered this forum and I don't remember the school he listed but I hired him and he has done quite well. Was he completely forthcoming? Well, maybe not totally but it would have been a shame to reject him outright due to his school possibly having been a mill.
Heck, I HAVE an MBA and I could design the same course and study it.
Anyway, just a bit of friendly advice being given without knowing the full set of circumstances. Thanks for all the hard work.
BS Western state University, Fullerton, CA
JD " " ( ABA )
MBA Pepperdine, Malibu, CA
MS Kansas State University, KS ( 2004 )
DBA ( looking )
I have got to be honest. I would not care what the rest of his alleged qualifications were. Dr. Bear does not call schools like CCU "dreadful" so whatever school and accrediting agency Dr. B. is talking about is not simply a marginal CA approved UnA school (I am not referrring to CCU in this context) but er.........really 'less than wonderful.
Why would I hire a candidate who showed up with bogus credentials that lead me to question whether the person is i) deceitful ......i.e unethical or ii) too incompetent to find a legit school or iii) too lazy or iv) downright stupid.
Remember, we are not talking about a guy with a CA approved UnA degree. Although, where I work someone with a CA UnA degree would never be employed either as they check credentials and will not accept anything not RA or NA. If is a foreign degree it would have to go through one of a list of foreign credential evaluators that HR provides.
Okay North, say,
The application with Southwest Airlines is for a test pilot engineering position; the applicant has
1. An RA BS in Aeronautical Engineering
2. An MS from the National Flight Test Institute
3. Twenty years experience as a commercial pilot
4. Five years in a senior engineering position with Boeing
5. A PhD from K-W
6. Comes with impeccable credentials
7. Is a family man and goes to church every Sunday
I suspect based on Bear's statement that this was not the case. When you hire you generally look at all facets of a persons credentials and includes things like frequent changing of jobs, do they come to an interview late & with no explanation, etc. These discriminating factors determine hiring on a matrix. If I have a candidate who has a bogus degree that is a big discriminating factor. Is the person dishonest? Are they stupid? Are they lazy? Are they really niave? These things generally do not contribute to a good feeling when you project a potential employee out over time. Where else does this potential employees decision making skills break down. Will it blow up in my face when they make aqnother winning move.
Not a problem where I work because if a degree is needed for the job it must be accredited (RA, NA). Now, if this large organization were hiring a janitor or Secretary it may not matter. Or if it were really **bogus** and showed up on an application it may raise concerns. I worked for someone who had a good Bull Stuffing detector and if she knew it was a bogus degree she would probably toss the application as indicative of personality problems. But that has never happened & HR does a good job of screening apps.
Separate names with a comma.