How do you do it? (DL Ph.D)

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by italiansupernova, May 24, 2005.

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  1. italiansupernova

    italiansupernova New Member

    I guess you could call me a Ph.D prospect. I've always dreamt of obtaining of obtaining my Ph.D, but I was never sure if it was worth it.... until.

    Here's my situation: For years I've searched within myself for the answer to the ultimate question "What do I want do to with my life?". I think I've finally come to a conclusion... counseling. The problem lies in the fact that virtually every "professional" couneling position requires at least a master's degree. I've browsed the curriculums of several MS and Ph.D DL counseling programs and, quite honestly, I'm not sure how I'm going to be able to do it. Now, most states require practicum hours for licensing which is understable. Colleges and universities require that you perform these practicum hours as part of the curriculum. The least amount of minimum hours that I've seen is 100 hours (The required amount for my state of Ohio).

    So, it understand the logic behind this, but it makes me wonder how I can complete all of this. I know that it essentially boils down to "wanting it bad enough", but I just question how much of a toll it's going to take on me mentally, physically, & emotional. Also, how much of a damper will this put on my personal life.

    I'd really appreciate some tips/advice from those that have "been there".
     
  2. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    Hi Nova - Still in the Boston area? Salem State has the cheapest MSW program around. If you've moved South then look at the UConn Social Work program. Neither one is DL. An MSW is the most versatile mental health/counseling degree in the country (the NASW has a great political lobby). When you're looking for a job in mental health Social Work trumps counseling, and psychology (for different reasons). I don't know anything about your personal circumstances but if you can get yourself into an MSW program (none of them are DL) then you will be set. No need for a PhD. Licensure reciprocity will allow you to work anywhere you want. While I am a strong advocate of DL, I will be among the first to admit that there's still a few things that you can't do with DL. An MSW is one of them. Beyond that, the listing of Maters in Counseling/Psychology programs are available from the usual sources (you know what they are).
    MSW programs in the Boston area:
    Boston College
    Boston University
    Simmons College*
    Salem State
    Smith College**
    Springfield College**
    Rhode Island College**
    UConn**
    Good luck.
    Jack
    * my alma mater
    ** not really in the Boston area
     
  3. swoerner

    swoerner New Member

     
  4. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    I don't mind describing my thinking but I guess that I should preface my remarks by stating that I am a Clinical Social Worker and so have a bit of a built-in bias. Also, my opinions are based on my experiences working in New England and I can easily imagine that others may have different experiences living elswhere. First, an MSW is a more versatile degree. You can find Social Workers working in virtually all treatment environments. If someone is contemplating a relatively long career in Human Services, the versatility pays off because it will allow you take advantage of opportunities that others may not be able to pursue. Second, licensure is more universally accepted. When I moved from one state to another I simply filled out a few forms and my license was transferred. Also, more insurance plans cover treatment by MSWs than other Masters degrees. This is not as true as it used to be but still true to some extent. In this regard, you are seen as being a more attractive employment prospect. In my current job, the agency no longer hires people with Masters in Counseling degrees. I personally think this is a bad policy but that hasn't changed anything (yet). I have known a number of people with Masters degrees in Counseling (or a similar designation) and have found them to be extremely well educated and talented Clinicians. I believe that in general these training programs are excellent, perhaps even superior to MSW programs in their clinical training (MSWs spend a lot of time learning about things like Social Policy, etc.) Despite this MSWs enjoy generally better employment prospects and virtually universal acceptance of their degree and license across the country and the world. You can easily find people with MSWs running a wide variety of Human Services organizations but I don't believe that's as true for the people with the other Masters degree. Unfortunately, there are no DL MSW programs. If I was in a position where I needed to earn my degree through DL then I would choose a Masters in Counseling program and not lose any sleep over it. If you've got no choice then there's no room for regret. If there is a way to buy into a part-time MSW program then I believe that you would be better served in the long run. You can be fully licensed at the Masters level, you can still earn a PhD if you want in any number of disciplines such as Social Work, Psychology, Human Services, organizational Leadership, etc. if you want to teach at the university level. Others with their own experiences in Masters in Counseling programs may disagree. I'd actually be happy to hear that these Masters in Counseling degrees are becoming better accepted through a wider range of employment settings. There are a few of these programs offered through DL and so access is certainly better. Good luck at Seton Hall. If you're enjoying the program then please don't switch out simply because of something I've said. It's a very good school and your degree will serve you well.
    Jack
     
  5. swoerner

    swoerner New Member

    Jack, I remember you well from my earlier correspondence on these topics, and as you stated, this particular program works well for me in NJ as it is the shortest DL path to licensure (and DL is really a requirement at this point).

    I could see then moving on to getting a doctorate in Psych, probably DL as well. Since at that point I would be well on the road to licensure and probably working in the field, I'm not sure it would be professionally necessary to go through another internship. I'm thinking this could be useful sincen I can see I love research and writing, and it could be good to teach; universities seem to want PHD's.

    In the academic setting, are DL doctorates frowned upon? And I'm concerned that much of what I will be learning now will not be transferrable into a Phd program and I'd be looking at another 5 years....

    Hope this is clear...

    thx

    Scott
     
  6. swoerner

    swoerner New Member

    Sorry, a little more
    First, I forgot to thank you very much for the comprehensive response.
    Second, if I were to go on for a doctorate, then having already gotten licensed, would it make sense to do something like developmental psych, that doesn't require an internship? I'd still want to teach counseling psych theory, but can't see taking time off for unpaid schoolwork doing another internship (I have 2 kids in elementary school....)

    Thanks
    Scott
     
  7. swoerner

    swoerner New Member

    Sorry, a little more
    First, I forgot to thank you very much for the comprehensive response.
    Second, if I were to go on for a doctorate, then having already gotten licensed, would it make sense to do something like developmental psych, that doesn't require an internship? I'd still want to teach counseling psych theory, but can't see taking time off for unpaid schoolwork doing another internship (I have 2 kids in elementary school....)

    Thanks
    Scott
     

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