Foreign Service Officer Test (FSOT)

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Dustin, Jun 9, 2023.

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  1. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Too heavy? That's not easy to correct.
     
  2. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    They have a pilot program for this particular issue.

     
  3. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I just skipped through with audio off, but the military has always had a version of this.

    The Marine Corps calls it the Physical Conditioning Platoon (aka porkchop platoon) while the Army calls it the FTU, Fitness Training Unit.

    The difference with this new program is that instead of reporting to basic training, failing a PT test and being reassigned (and dealing with DI/DS and the threat of being chaptered out if you don't improve), this 3 week pilot program is outside of basic training entirely so that hopefully you report to Basic ready and if you aren't, you're at least much more prepared.
     
  4. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    This program is for those who would be disqualified based on weight before being allowed to join. There's also an academic track for those who have low ASVAB scores.
     
  5. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    The Navy started discharging overweight sailors while I was at sea. I lost some very competent people that way too. I watched members do everything they could but they were doomed by the nature of weight loss. Very few can keep it off for long.
     
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  6. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    This was years ago, so not relevant today, perhaps, but it's good story, so you all get it anyway.

    A friend grew up under adverse circumstances that he was keen to escape, so he went to an US Army recruiter to enlist. He was very big, and they were like, yeah sure, lose a hundred pounds and we'll let you in. So he didn't eat until he'd lost 100 pounds and went back and they were agog, but sure enough they enlisted him. It wasn't long after he got in that he realized that he'd made a horrible mistake, that at least for him being in the Army was even worse than what he had left behind. So he ate his way out of it, gaining enough weight again to eventually get discharged.
     
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  7. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I'm reminded of James Joseph Dresnok. He grew up in an abusive home. He was abandoned by his family repeatedly, including his mother, his aunt, and his father (as he was shuffled to each trying to get rid of him.) He married and joined the Army, being deployed to West Germany where he was treated harshly by higher-ranking soldiers. His wife cheated on him while he was gone and divorced him when he returned. He re-enlisted and was sent to Korea. He forged a leave pass and was going to be court-martialed. He noted that he never felt wanted anywhere (not by his family, not by his wife and certainly not by the Army.) So he chose to defect.

    Joining the military to get away from something backfires as often as it works out.
     
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  8. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Fortunately my friend's story end an awful lot differently! :eek:
     
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  9. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    Fortunately, the military is now using a more accurate electronic method of measuring body fat percentage for those who don't meet BMI requirements. Using the tape measure method assumes that everyone has the same body proportions when they're fit. Side note: BMI is one of the dumbest concepts in medicine.
     
  10. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Hear hear!
     
  11. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I think for the vast majority of people, BMI is a useful signpost. The stories of people with a BMI of 35 who are in great shape are very uncommon for how often people try to cite them as proof that your average non-bodybuilder should ignore their weight. At the same time, there can be enough variation that setting a strict cut-off for one's BMI (such as refusing entry to training) is rarely useful.
     
  12. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    I think it's pointless when you could just measure body fat percentage. BMI underestimates obesity in Asians and overestimates obesity in Black people of West African descent. BMI was normed by a statistician using White people in the 1800s and was not intended for use in healthcare.
     
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  13. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    Taping and calipers can't measure body fat either. They're a proxy like BMI is a proxy.

    Either way this is a pointless argument. There are numerous tools for estimating one's health risk on every metric. Use the ones that work for you.
     
  14. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    IIRC, solely based on male (French) peasants. The further you are from being a potentially malnourished male (French) peasant in 1860 (or so), the less valid BMI is for you.
     
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  15. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    They're a closer proximation than BMI. For example, Black women, in general, have smaller measurements than White women with the same BMI. That is because muscle is denser than fat and, therefore, has less volume at the same weight. Additionally, Black women start seeing weight-related health problems at a higher BMI than White women. It is already the case that healthcare professionals are advised to start talking to Asians about their diabetes risk at a lower BMI than other groups. Some healthcare professionals won't even check a person's A1C level if their BMI is normal, so there are "healthy" people walking around with diabetes and pre-diabetes.

    The military using BMI, and even the tape test, has caused unnecessary stress, eating disorders, and crash dieting for certain ethnic groups and body types.
     
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  16. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    Perhaps TMI, but for those who were curious about my Army Reserve journey it ended as quick as it started.

    My wife, in no uncertain terms said it was her and the Army, so her it is. Once my kids are grown she might entertain the Reserves, though by early 40s only the Air Force Reserve may be available, waiver permitting.

    Federal law sets the maximum age at 42, non-waiverable.
     
  17. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    If that's off the table, and you want to serve in a way that calls for physical courage, there's always becoming a volunteer firefighter.
     
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  18. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Going to sea is hard on marriages too. Ask me how I know.
     
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  19. Jonathan Whatley

    Jonathan Whatley Well-Known Member

    A wonderful suggestion. Also, EMT (basic) training is relatively short. Sometimes pay isn't far from volunteering, but it can be part-time.
     
  20. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I live in an exurb that surprisingly only has a paid ambulance service. If I ever move, I'll definitely be keeping my eye out for a volunteer EMT service to join. Lots of colleges around here offer the EMT Basic (or whatever they're calling it nowadays) during night school for ~$1200. Becoming an EMT is on my bucket list.
     
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