Classified documents discovered at home of former VP Mike Pence

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by Rich Douglas, Jan 24, 2023 at 7:01 PM.

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  1. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

  2. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Maybe they should be stamping "CLASSIFIED" in a larger font size, or something? Geez.
     
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  3. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    From the descriptions of the classified documents found there and at Biden's house, I got the impression that it was mostly just a few pages out of a full classified document that was there. I assume that the folks preparing information for the White House write a memo and then attach a few pages out of a classified document to it?

    The Pence and Biden examples are in sharp contrast to the Trump example where Trump obstructed justice and refused to give back documents, including lying about having them.
     
  4. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    It is quite possible that neither Biden nor Pence had any personal knowledge or possession of government documents--classified or not. (It is not clear about Trump on this narrow issue). In each of their offices there were one or more custodians designated to handle classified materials. Those were the people who should have archived the materials, not Pence or Biden. (Or, more likely, retained them until their expiration dates, at which time they would be destroyed.) But there is often a huge lack of continuity in these offices when administrations change--and Trump made it far worse by refusing to cooperate with Biden's incoming team. This almost certainly affected the outgoing Pence, too. And Trump, for that matter. But....

    Trump is a bit different since he's taken responsibility for taking government documents, claiming that they were his, he declassified them with his mind, etc. Even if you give him that one, there's still the fact that he didn't return the documents voluntarily, upon request, or even under subpoena. This turned what might (generously) be considered an administrative error into a crime. Not a national security issue--although his sloppy handling sure made that a possibility--but one of obstructing justice and disobeying a court order. And not just him; his staff is certainly culpable in this.
     
  5. JBjunior

    JBjunior Active Member

    This may indicate a potential higher level issue with how senior level officials view (literally and culturally) classified material. In my area of work the care of classified information is engrained and enforced. That our elected officials appear to so commonly bring classified documents home without an accountability system to make sure it is returned, or maintained when outside of classified work spaces, is concerning.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2023 at 12:13 AM
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  6. JBjunior

    JBjunior Active Member

    It almost appears different than solely being attributed to the transition, especially in President Biden’s case of being found in multiple locations. I envision they are given a classified brief and then package it away to read at home over the weekend then store it in their house instead of returning it. I would much prefer it be 100% attributable to each transition period because it is much easier to comprehend from my perspective.
     
  7. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I don't disagree with your conclusion. I think it's important to point out though that the President and Vice President are in a different situation than any other folks that have access to classified information. The difference is that the President and the Vice President live in secure environments. For them taking documents "home" is probably considered acceptable. I'm talking about their official Washington DC homes, not their personal homes. Also, they probably don't pack their own boxes when leaving office.
     
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  8. JBjunior

    JBjunior Active Member

    Agreed, certainly. To be clear, I don’t think there is anything wrong with them viewing the documents in almost any setting they deem necessary. The issue I am pointing out is the accountability mechanism that appears to be broken where classified documents are not accounted for, in some cases years after the fact, as they sit in boxes outside of “control.”
     
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  9. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I definitely agree with that. The control structure for classified documents used at the President and Vice President's office apparently needs to be improved.
     
  10. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    I guess the thing is in the air. Everyone's doing it. Has anyone searched Bo Obama's kennel?
     
  11. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    Probably should expend to Senators as well.
    Didn't the classified documents found range different eras not only VP but also Senator?
    When they checkout classified documents all they need to do is make sure they are locked properly in the bag or briefcase.
    And self report in some cases.
    I'm far from being expert on this.
    Does the Pence and Biden scandals in the minds of voters now cancel things out and means the effort to use it to disqualify Trump ?
    I get the difference per Rich's explanation.
     

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