Any Distance Learning Graduates Leaders in Their Fields?

I was wondering... Does anyone know of any people possesing distance learning degrees who are leaders in their respective areas of expertise? I know that their are plenty of folks out they who have distance learning degrees, but are any of them viewed as leaders in their fields?

Should someone realistically consider distance education if one's goal is to become a respected leader in his or her chosen profession?

Thanks!

Eddie Hodge

 

What an interesting question. I've never seen it addressed, other than by the University of South Africa, whose distance learning degree earners include Nelson Mandela and Robert Mugabe, both of them earning advanced degrees while in prison.

The PR departments of many schools keep track of distinguished graduates, but I don't know if this has ever been done at Excelsior, Edison, etc. And I'd bet that many schools with both distance and on-campus programs, like the University of Iowa or Indiana University don't even note, on their own records, whether the degree was earned on or off campus.

Surely Phoenix must have some titans of industry, or prominent plutocrats? Has anyone ever asked them?

John Bear

 

With all due respect Ed is there any real correlation between any University and the quailties and traits you describe ?
I tend to think respect , accomplisment and leadership have more to do with personal traits than where you went to school.

 

Eddie, you've asked some great questions here. My takes:

Not many, but here are a few:

- Archbishop Emeritus and 1984 Nobel Laureate Desmond Tutu, who earned a bachelor's from UNISA in 1954. I strongly suspect that this degree was earned by correspondence, but haven't confirmed that.

- Jungian mythologist Clarissa Pinkola Estes ("Women Who Run With the Wolves") earned her Ph.D. through the Union Institute.

- Novelist/essayist Rita Mae Brown holds a Ph.D. through the Union Institute, but I think she earned it after becoming a well-known novelist rather than before.

- Steve Moraff of MoraffWare fame is a Regents graduate.

In my opinion, yes; not on the basis of precedents, but in spite of them. I'd say this of advanced degrees in general, not necessarily just nontraditional ones.


Peace,

Tom

 

I've always found it mildly amusing that Dr. John Bear, a leader in distance learning, earned all of his degrees traditionally. But I find almost everthing amusing so that really doesn't mean much.

I think the reason there aren't more well known people with distance learning degrees is because it is still realitively new. Now for some academic studies very expensive equipment is required like the hard sciences. I'd think it will take longer to see leaders in those kind of areas that earned their degrees via distance learning.

 

And his Ph.D. is in communication, to boot. If you get a chance, you might get a copy of "Send This Jerk the Bedbug Letter" -- I seem to remember somebody saying that this was actually based to some extent on his dissertation work, and it's a delightful read.

Totally agreed. What's more, the folks who did earn their degrees through one of the distance learning channels that has been around for longer than 30 years -- say, London's or UNISA's programs -- probably don't go around bragging about the fact.

In "The Morrow Anthology of Younger American Poets," I remember at least one somewhat well-known poet being described as "earning [his/her] M.F.A. through a low-residency program at..." (Warren Wilson, or somewhere like that). Meant to bookmark it, lost my place, and can't find it again, but I'll run across it eventually.


Peace,

Tom

 

I assume from the previous threads that it is assumed that the college or university had something to do with success that a person had in some field. On the whole I would doubt it.
Did the degree that Dr. Bear receive have much to do with the respect he now deserves?
He is respected because of what he does. Not because of the college he went to or because of the degrees that he has?

Perhaps i have a different view of higher education, distance learning or not.
I have attended 4 different colleges or university's (had a few false starts when I was younger) and earned 3 degrees. AA,BS and MA. My experience is that a college is a place were you sit in a classroom, read a book and take lecture notes . A few weeks later you get a test and spit it back In time you get better at spitting it back. Usually there is little room for ideas or for being creative. It is difficult to be creative when you are knee deep in organic chemistry ,calculus and biology, besides some classes at major universities can have several hundred students in a single class. Maybe if your lucky a professor or two will take an interest.

However despite that, a college gives you some useful and essential tools you need in your endeavor. The degrees and perhaps the name of the college can open some doors. If your a med student you can finally name the parts of a human body and if a psych student can name the pathology. Upon graduation you are neither a doctor or a psychologist. You go into the world and work with people and finally become what you will become.
I know colleges and universities like to take credit for someone's accomplishments. But except for some exceptions i believe their contribution is really minimal. Personal abilities and attributes of the person themselves is the defining feature.
Taking a driver education course at Harvard will not get you to Daytona. A few things have to happen between those two events and what happens has mostly to do with the person, not Harvard.

Anyway thanks for letting me rant and rave on this topic.

mark

 

Bill Huffman wrote, I've always found it mildly amusing that Dr. John Bear, a leader in distance learning, earned all of his degrees traditionally.

But that's exactly what got me into this field, Bill. It was while living in England in the early 70s that I met people from the U of London, and was amazed to learn about their nonresident degrees. Why, I mused, didn't someone tell me about this the time I had to drop out of school for a year to earn enough money to drop back in? "Not our fault, Yank," they replied. "We've got 50,000 students from all over the world, but precious few Americans."

So I proposed to them that I write a little book for Americans on how to deal with the U of London, and they agreed to cooperate, letting me reproduce sample text questions, etc. The 80-page typewritten monograph that emerged was (in retrospect) the first edition of Bears' Guide.

 

And then there was the time when a potential Heriot-Watt MBA student asked us for a list of famous HW alumni. We asked the university's public relations department, got a nice list of non-world-famous people (a prince of Norway, a former top administrator at MIT, Muriel Spark) -- but then the man laughed and said that "Of course our most famous graduate doesn't exist."

He went on to explain that several places in the Ian Fleming oeuvre, it is mentioned that James Bond was a graduate of Heriot-Watt. It certainly is logical that a high-tech Scottish spy would have gone to Scotland's high tech university.

This, of course, brings up the topic of famous fake alumni. Didn't Gatsby go to Princeton?

 

OK, this might not rank among the "greats" depending on your viewpoint, but Lou Pearlman of Backstreet Boys fame and other pop outfits is somehting of a "leader in his field" (even if only lawsuits), has ammassed assets approaching $1 billion apparently by his own efforts - and a correndence PhD in Business Adminstration from .... Century University !!!!
http://www.envy.nu/otowners/articles/tangled.htm

 

The Union Institute has among its graduates a number of academics who are quite prominent within their areas of expertise. These include Stanley Aronowitz of the City University of New York Graduate Center (leading politically progressive academic) and Philip Lopate of Hofstra University (authority on the essay form of writing).

Columbia Pacific University served as a sort of credential provider for a lot of people in the therapy/self-help field, including John Gray and Barbara DeAngelis. However, I have read news accounts that call into question their use of the "Dr." title because of the CPU connection.

In terms of traditional measures of prominence and preeminence, however, I think we must concede that prestigious, residential degree programs are the fastest educational track to those ends. Even those of us who understand the value of distance learning must acknowledge that one of the biggest advantages of residential education is not so much the in-class experience, but rather the networking, contacts, and friendships that are established in that setting and that pay all sorts of benefits in the years to follow.

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David Yamada, [email protected]

 

This is probably a good time to debunk an urban legend I've been hearing for years:

Dr. Drew Pinsky of "MTV Loveline" fame holds an M.D. from the University of South Carolina and is a licensed physician. He does not hold a California-approved correspondence Ph.D., as some folks once suggested in other forums -- or if he does, it's a second doctorate.


Peace,

Tom

 

Neil Hynd reported that one of his fellow Ph.D.s from Century is associated with the Backstreet Boys.

I am fascinated by the process by which this knowledge came to you, Neil. Surely an Englishman living in the Middle East does not regularly read the Portland, Maine Sunday Telegram.

So was this information reported, perhaps, in the Century alumni news? And if so, who else?

John

 

David,

This seems to be the case, and it bugs me to no end. It is tough for DL holders to become prominent in fields where they are barely tolerated; such as marketing, finance, consulting, etc.

Tracy <><

 

Thanks Tom. I am not an expert on distance learning, but I do hope to contribute something worthwhile to the forum every once in awhile.

It seems to me that whether one's degree was obtained traditionally or non-traditionally wouldn't matter in a perfect world. However, I see the expressions on the faces of some people when I tell them I am pursuing a degree through distance learning. They seem to be less impressed than they would be if I were pursuing a seminary degree in-residence.

As a general rule, I wonder if distance learning graduates often find themselves defending the choice to go the non-traditional route? I have had to do this on a couple of occasions since I do live within driving distance of New Orleans Baptist Theological Seminary.

Also, as students utilizing distance education should we, generally speaking, believe that our level of academic work (quality and quantity) favorably compares with that of in-residence programs? In other words, are we folks at home working just as hard academically as our in-residence counterparts, generally speaking? From my personal experience there seems to be a perception by many folks that distance learning is the way to go not only for people who cannot attend in-residence programs because of family, job, etc., but also for folks who are looking for a less rigorous way to obtain a degree (“less rigorous” used here as a euphemism for “easy”).

For example, I have noticed that the seminaries held in highest esteem such as Dallas Theological Seminary, Trinity Evangelical Divinity School, Westminster Theological Seminary, and other heavyweights do not offer low-residence, in-home study programs like the one I'm in at Liberty.

Now, let's be honest for a moment. If my goal is to take a prominent place in the field of theological scholarship (or in any field for that matter), would I enroll in the External Degree Program of Liberty University? Of course not! My desire would be to sit in the classrooms of some of our country's greatest theological thinkers. Fortunately, though, my goal is simply to become a competent bible teacher.

I may be wrong, but generally speaking, I would think that anyone who is seeking professional preeminence would want to be in a classroom picking the brain of a well-respected scholar; not at home experiencing very little face-to-face interaction with faculty and other students.

Just sharing some of my thoughts...if I'm way out in left field please be gentle!


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Have a Great Day!

Eddie Hodge

 

Obviously, the people who react this way have never pursued a degree through distance learning. For some of them, the issue is honest skepticism. For others, it's jealously - the "I paid my dues, you should, too" syndrome. I wouldn't sweat it.

I never had to. Moreover, I was able to do my internship at an ATS-accredited seminary, taught at two regionally accredited schools, etc. Again, watch out for the jealousy syndrome - these days, many schools, including very traditional and even prestigious schools, are in the distance market.

This is anecdotal, but you can assume that half of the students doing a distance program are doing work that is more comprehensive than what they would do in a residential program, and the other half is attempting to sluff their way to an easy degree. However, the "dumbing down" of academe has occurred across the board, not jus in distance programs.

They sure do. Westminster is not in the distance market, to my knowledge, but DTS has been in the distance market for several years (as well as having several extension campuses), and TEDS was one of the early leaders in Christian distance education. (In fact, the former distance ed coordinator at TEDS is now the head honcho of distance studies at Moody and has been active in ACCESS, the Associatuion of Christian Continuing Education Schools & Seminaries, since its inception.)

For what it's worth, I received my first major book contract (for Christian Counseling and the Law, from Moody Press) as a direct result of my Ph.D. from Union. Ditto my next major contract (for Street Smarts, from Baker Book House). Granted, it was the concepts that sold, not the degree. But having the degree established my academic credibility, and there was never a question as to the integrity of my credentials.

That depends on what you mean by professional preeminence. A person becomes a great preach by style, not education. Even a pop psychologist does not need a prestigious degree to make millions (just as John Gray or Barbara DiAngelis).

Moreover, one does not need to spend time in a classroom to pick the brain of a well-respected scholar. I had two well-respected scholars on my doctoral committee and picked their brains on a regular basis. Additionally, when I did my doctorate, I went to several seminars, workshops, professional conferences, etc., and engaged in "brain picking" whenever I got the chance.

Finally, just because you are in a class taught by a well-respected scholar does not necessarily mean that you get any more benefit than from reading their work. Before I did my M.A. at Vermont College of Norwich University, I did a semester at the then-Simon Greenleaf School of Law in Anaheim, California (now, like TEDS, a part of Trinity International University). At the time, the SGSL faculty had several "preeminent scholars" (including such evangelical superstars as John Warwick Montgomery, Harold Lindsell, Walter Martin, and Rod Rosenblatt). I gotta be honest with you - for me, it wasn't worth hanging out there. But I ha already been exposed to nontraditional education, and found that I could get far more out of being in the real world. To someone who needed classroom instruction, guidance, direction, and interaction, I'm sure that it would be preferable to the distance route.

Actually, Eddie, since you're at Liberty, I would think that you're a bit more in right field, so to speak . . .

 

Steve said:

C'mon Steve, what's wrong with a little fundamentalism...

Thanks for the response!




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Have a Great Day!

Eddie Hodge

 

Tracy, this is one reason why I've come to believe that DL institutions have to work very hard at community and network building. Short-residency programs, as opposed to completely non-resident and Internet-based programs, also have the advantage of encouraging face-to-face interaction.



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David Yamada, [email protected]

 

The need for face-to-face interaction and networking can also be met by working towards a degree in a subject related to your occupation or hobby. I think such an arrangement can be superior to the networking done in an academic environment. This, of course, is why DL works better for working adults than for others.

Tracy <><