TUI once again

Here it is:

http://www.cwpost.liu.edu/cwis/cwp/colofman/jdmba/index2.html

 

Please Provide Explanation

I was told by a Touro University faculty member as well as a Ph.D. advisor that the issues that resulted in accreditation concerns by Middle States have been resolved. Touro University, they said, is still fully accredited under Touro College - an accreditation which runs for several more years before it's up for renewal.

Yet, I've heard a few comments on this Board about a requirement that Touro seek WASC accreditation. Could you please disregard those who will take it personally and update me on what you know about this accreditation issue?

Frankly, I have plans to begin the Ph.D. Business Administration in a few weeks, and I would appreciate knowing if there is something I overlooked. I do NOT want to spend perhaps $30K or more only to discover that there is an accreditation issue with Touro. Overcoming the DL perceptions is tough enough. So please, if there is something you or others know about Touro's accreditation status or some requirement that they secure WASC accreditation, I would really appreciate knowing. Thanks.

 

This link takes you to the B&M New York campus, TUI is the child college under the parent Touro University (B&M). Maybe I am missing it, but I think this is the Touro University, not TUI.

 

You are right. It is the Touro College not TUI. Nevertheless, the fact that TU - the father - has co-programs with AACSB schools is a good sign for TUI - child - too.

Certainly, Touro' s best programs are in Law and Health. Even though the Business programs are not yet well-known I assume that they will be in the near future. Look at the TUI's BA faculties! Most of them are from the first B&M faculties. They can create a good second-tier business school/brand.

 

Re: Please Provide Explanation

From the research I have done, the issues are resolved, and the outcome is that TUI is required to go and get their own accreditation and they will not be a part of Touro (B&M) University anymore. I contacted all parties, when people said here I was being baised. I have a letter from:

TUI, bascially stating "we are working the issues and will have a statement shortly) - nothing further came from this letter last year.

The current RA - Stating all of the findings - about 10 pages. If you do a search, you can find the entire letter findings section (the thread may have been removed due to vulgar content that followed), but basically it said that they feel that TUI has grown considerably, and needs it own accreditation under Western States. It had specific references to the PhD program, and specifically the admission standards, as well as a few other specific findings in this.

Western States - They said they had no knowledge of TUI going for accreditation. This was about a week after this happened, and I received a follow up e-mail from them about 4 weeks later stating they are working with TUI for accreditation and it is in work for them to apply.

At the time, TUI did not put any of this on their website, they stopped taking admissions for their PhD, stating it was "at capacity", and no news out of them yet. I have seen postings from students who say they have heard from an adminsitrator, or a professor, or a friend that everything is fine, but being someone who teaches PR and crisis mangement, they needed to handle this much better, in my opinion.

When I was looking for the PhD, I took many posting here to heart that stated TUI would be going for AACSB soon. It doesn't seem that is in the near future. I almost applied based on those postings.

I would personally not chance it, why go with a school that is having accreditation issues, whether you think the issue is just transfering accreditation, or if you think they have a chance not securing it. I find it awefully strange that they have no comments coming from the school. In life, a secret is usually not a good thing, and I have found this in business as well.

It seems that there are changes coming down (do a search, some students are experiencing them), and there are just simply too many unknowns in my opinion. Many students are fine with that risk, as they see it as small, but I just agree to disagree with them.

If you are seriously considering them, I would write to both accreditation agencies, as well as Touro and TUI. See what answers you get. I remember a posting about a month ago from an applicant who could not get a straight answer from TUI, and came here for advice on what to do. I recommend you get all your own data, do not go by what others have researched (like me, or any other person). If you do this research, I would like to hear about what the answers were though, my research was right when it happened, and some time has gone by. I thought there would have been some new news by now.

Good luck.

 

Is there any connection???

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/ripoff131241.htm

I took a total of '6' difficult courses from Touro University Online.(PhD level). The instructors had no problem with the content of the work performed until they fell under scrutiny for their accreditation. All I got was compliments on my work. I was getting good grades. (ESTIMATED COST PER CLASS $1600 OR GREATER MORE OR LESS)

I was only a few courses away from completing the program Suddenly, nothing I did was correct and everything was questioned by two instructors: Dr. Debrxxx Connellxxx and Dr. A Luc**.

This instructors went out of there way to grade me the worst possible on everything and anything, which most instructors at the University did not have a problem. Even though they would start me off with decent grades and get worse as I would move on to the next module.

I filed for a grade dispute and was told what I had to do. I submitted the required information and heard nothing. When I looked into it, they said that I never filed. I provided proof that I did, but the dean decided not to review my work.

In the end I was told to I had to retake my previous course. I began the course and decided to make a test. I submitted exactly the same work that I submitted to my previous professor. All of a sudden I got much higher grades. In the middle of the semester, they told me I was dismissed from the school. Even though I had already went through 3 out of 5 modules. My grades were going up and before I could have a chance, I was cut.

It appeared the instructors and the school did not want me to complete my degree. I was placed in probation and told. You going to have to spend more money to complete the course by challenging the grade from Dr. Connellexxx and Dr. Luc**.

It would appear to me, if I had that many problems to begin with, how did I get to the 7th out of 11 classes. The class I was taking was one of the easier classes.

This University was just ripping me off for my financial aid money and contesting the grade was just a part of the scam.

Also I was one of many who have had this problem. I would love to take these people to court. If anyone is interested please email me at [email protected]

BEWARE OF THIS ONLINE-UNIVERSITY

Todd
Flushing, New York
U.S.A.

 

Re: Re: Please Provide Explanation

Thank you, I appreciate your candor. You've given me food for thought. Any ideas on NCU and/or Capella?

 

TOURO IS STILL ACCREDITED BY MIDDLE STATES COMMISSION ON HIGHER EDUCATION. YEAR REACCREDITED: 2004!
http://www.msache.org/


Directory

Touro College Executive Offices
www.touro.edu Glossary of Terms

Address 27 West 23rd Street


New York, NY 10010

Phone (212) 463-0400 Fax (212) 627-9542
CEO Name Dr. Bernard Lander CEO Title President
CAO Name Dr. Stanley Boylan CAO Title V.P. for Undergraduate Edu & Dean of Faculties
Type of Institution Master's I Distance Learning Y
Control Private (Non-Profit) Affiliation None
Adjusted Enrollment 13148 HeadCount 16961
First Accredited Year 1976 Year Reaccredited 2004
Last Accredited Method Self-Study Review Next Self Study Review 2013 - 14
Next Periodic Review 2009 CHE Staff RDA
Degrees A, B, C, D, M, P Campuses Bay Shore, Flatbush, Touro University Coll of Osteo Medicine, Berlin, Huntington Township, Jerusalem, Moscow, Touro University International, Touro University College of Osteopathic Medicine - Nevada

 

Yes, but the point is that when that Touro College was re-accredited in June of last year, reaccreditation was contingent upon Touro University International and Touro University California seeking their own individual accreditation with WASC. Their accreditation under Touro College lapses at the end of June this year.

You'll find the accreditation report in the post from Han that starts the thread linked to below. I would however warn you that the thread in question is quite incredibly acrimonious.

http://forums.degreeinfo.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=14845&highlight=Touro+accreditation

Angela

 

There is a new thread that there was a meeting and the decision will be made in a few weeks. I think all should not speculate until the decision gets closer, but be aware and educated on the situtation. Hopefully we all will know soon.

For the good of DL, I hope that TUI gets the Western States accreditation with no problems.

 

Angela - Oh too right you are But funny note that this was the one left, as it was pretty civil, and I thought a good discussion thread, the other got down right crude and vulgar.

I think there are many who disagree and this thread that is referenced is a great example of degreeinfo, and the power of GOOD discussion. Anyway, just thought it was nice you put the thread for reference.

 

What about the 37 year old guy with the same experience that worked his way through a solid (online, for-profit -- read: it can't possibly mean he actually learned anything ) DL MBA program?

This kind of post is a waste of my time to read. Yeah for you for taking time to go to a B&M grad school in your twenties! Now that said, you can go on with your career and shun those who didn't follow in your footsteps. In my opinion, if all you are offering is a B&M MBA with entry level work experience, I wouldn't hire you for the position either.

The bottom line is; an MBA does not equate to managerial experience. Managerial experience cannot be taught, so an MBA, regardless of where it was earned, is only dressing on a resume. What disappoints me the most is that there are many people like you in hiring manager positions that share your misguided opinion on DL degrees.


To be quite honest; if you are only going to hire the above guy as a driver, then I wouldn’t waste my time applying.

 

As much as I hate reality television shows; maybe the latest version of "The Apprentice" will change the way hiring managers view prestigious college degree holders.

Being a college graduate, I hate to admit it, but those prestigious college degree grads aren't doing very well against the seasoned high-school grads.

 

I don't think little fauss is attacking DL degrees but virtual schools that offer fast track DL MBA programs. I still cannot understand how some schools can compress a two year full time study into a one year part time online program. I understand that B&M and DL programs should be equivalent but I don't understand why DL should be faster. I would also be concerned as a hiring manager if an MBA graduate earned his degree in one year part time while working full time and raising a family. If managerial experience is all it takes to get a business job, then why to bother with the MBA. is it just a brand name on your resume? What is the real value of one year part time of training online? What about the more technical business jobs that require a solid foundation of finance or statistics that cannot be built in one year part time?

 

I agree B&M and DL programs should be equivalent and for that to be possible, DL programs cannot be compressed into a shorter amount of time. But little fauss is clear that a solid DL program can only come from a non-profit, B&M school. I don't agree. To label for-profit, online schools as inferior is the same as judging a book by its cover.

 

Just to clarify, I was not suggesting that the 37 yr old guy with a DL MBA should be good only to work as my driver. I assume you were making a pun--which I think was clever--but in case not, I meant "driver" as in "go-getter."

There are SOME for-profits out there that are little more than diploma printers. I have a real problem with them, they demean the reputation of online degrees. Online degrees can be stringent and outstanding, they are not all jokes. I can assure you that the program I'm attending online is anything but a hand-out diploma. I'm working harder than I did in B&M law school!

My problem is with those McDegrees that poison the water for all online degrees. Most people outside of this forum think the whole world of online is for-profit, they're often astonished to discover that there are real B&M universities, top-ranked, offering online educations. I get irritated that I must explain my degree, it's a job removing that taint in people's minds because of some of the abuses of many for-profits.

As for my broad brush with regard to for-profits, let me make this clear: I do not believe that all for-profits are merely diploma printers or degree mills. The problem that I have with most for-profits is that they are so infernally expensive considering their reputation and want of accreditation, at least in the business field. When your cost per credit hour is roughly the same for an online MBA at The University of Indiana's top-25 AACSB-accredited Kelley school as it is for the UoP, something isn't just wrong, something's absolutely insane!

If you happen to be pursuing a degree that isn't offered DL by a B&M institution in the U.S., such as a PhD in Management, and you can't afford to put your life on hold for 4 years and take out a second mortgage to do the traditional B&M PhD program, then I'd say you're doing the best you can with the situation you have, and I have no issues with you (as if it mattered one way or the other if I did).

If, however, you're proudly matriculating at Walden to get your MBA or MS in Egineering or EdD online--in other words, areas where there are ample opportunities to get that same DL education at B&M schools--and you're getting hostile at me for suggesting that perhaps you didn't make the best choice for online, then I'd say you're the one who's fooling yourself, and your hostility is a measure of your insecurity.

When there are real options B&M, take them, you're crazy not to; when there are not, then go for-profit if you will, it's your only choice. I assume you're part of the latter group, and thus we have no personal issues.

 

Yes I meant that as a pun. It was a failed attempt at humor.

And yes I am part of the latter group. I am glad to see that you understand that everyone does not have to opportunity to complete a B&M degree program at night. I was fortunate with Florida Tech that they had a satellite campus close by and I was able to take night courses to get my masters. Now that I am looking at a doctorate, my satellite [local] B&M choices have dwindled down to two choices (I live in a rural area), neither one of which corresponds with my career.

Please don't take offense to my post, but I felt as though the fightn' gloves went on...

 

It is more incredible when you find out the money that faculty is making at for profits like UoP. You get something between 1200 to 1800 USD per course when teaching at for profit schools (not all but the vast majority) while B&M normally use full time faculty that teaches not more than 7 courses per year at a salary of at least 50K/year. So as a student, your money doesn't go into faculty but into marketing so you are not getting direct benefit from the money invested in your education.

The other issue is that for profits are competing with B&M by offering fast track options. The messages is "yes, we are not Harvard but you can get your MBA in a shortest time and get the benefit of the MBA club membership with little time invested". So they are selling more opportunity cost rather than prestige or solid foundation.

I agree that for many management jobs, experience is more important and the MBA is just dressing in the resume, but some jobs require a good background in hard sciences as finance, accounting, stats and this cannot be absorbed at a microwave pace.

 

No, it wasn't that bad...for a pun.

Nahh, no offense taken. BTW, in what area are you studying? I assume you're pursuing a PhD online, or planning to do so one day based on your handle.

Cheers!

 

Any student who sacrifices 30,000 for an RA degree deserves a chance to be considered. Some students are not that academically smart and probably were rejected by more competitive schools. The fact that they still perservered and got a RA degree means something.

And btw, For-profits are also tax-paying, not-for-profits are tax exempt.

-S