Is a Associate Degree useless?

It took me about 9 weeks with no studying at all. I was 19 at the time, and earned my AA entirely by testing.

 

"It's notable that CCSF has discontinued the associate's degree programs in transfer subjects that they once offered. They still offer coherent programs of lower division study designed to meet CSU and UC transfer requirements, but no longer grant associate's degrees for completing them."

Could you explain the programs that were discountinued a little more? Were these programs you could transfer into?

Also, any degree is only as worthwhile as the person who was awarded the degree makes it out to be. I know penniless PHD's and non-degree holders that are doing quite well. Many companies in this area will want an assocaite's degree minimum for many positions and won't even look at your resume without one. These same positions maybe ten years ago didn't require one, but today the employer can get degreed people for those positions.

 

CCSF has transfer curricula in dozens of fields. The intent here is for the student to complete the first two years of a four-year bachelors curriculum at CCSF, then to transfer as a junior into a four-year college or university of the student's choice, and to complete the last two years there. The resulting bachelors degree is awarded by the four-year school.

My point is that, as I recall, at one time you could earn an associates degree in many of these subjects. Now you can't. You can still transfer the credits you earn at CCSF into a bachelors program, but you don't get an associates degree as you walk out the door.

CCSF's transfer curricula (compare this list to the list of associates degree curricula I posted earlier):

Accounting
Agriculture
Anthropology
Art History
Art Practice
Astronomy
Banking
Biology/Anatomy and Physiology
Biology/Bacteriology
Biology/Biochemistry
Biology/Botany
Biology/Genetics
Biology/Zoology
Broadcasting
Business Administration
Chemistry
Chicano Studies
Computer and Information Science
Consumer Arts and Sciences/Home Economics
Criminology/Administration of Justice
Earth Sciences/Geography
Earth Sciences/Geology
Earth Sciences/Meteorology
Earth Sciences/Oceanography
Earth Sciences/Paleontology
Economics
Engineering/Agricultural
Engineering/Biological
Engineering/Chemical
Engineering/Civil
Engineering/Electrical
Engineering/Industrial
Engineering/Materials
Engineering/Mechanical
Engineering/Metallurgy
Engineering/Nuclear
Engineering/Petroleum
Engineering Technology/Construction
Engineering Technology/Electrical
Engineering Technology/Mechanical
English
Environmental Design/Architecture
Environmental Design/City and Regional Planning
Environmental Design/Interior Design
Environmental Design/Landscape Architecture
Environmental Design/Urban Studies
Foreign Languages/Chinese
Foreign Languages/French
Foreign Languages/German
Foreign Languages/Italian
Foreign Languages/Japanese
Foreign Languages/Pilipino
Foreign Languages/Russian
Foreign Languages/Spanish
Health Sciences
History
Humanities
Journalism
Labor and Industrial Relations
Law/Pre-Law
Library Science
Mathematics
Medicine/Pre-Medicine
Music History
Music Performance
Natural Resources/Biological Resource Science
Natural Resources/Forestry
Natural Resources/Forest Products
Nursing
Personnel Management
Pharmacy/Pre-Pharmacy
Philosophy
Physical Education
Physics
Political Science
Psychology
Public Administration
Sociology
Speech Communication/Rhetoric
Statistics
Teaching/Education
Theatre Art/Drama

 

Associate degrees soon to be listed on AQF

Associate degrees are a topic of heated debate here in Australia at the moment. It looks likely that they shall be listed on the Australian Qualifications Framework (http://www.aqf.edu.au), basically to service the VET sector.

Cheers,

George

 

Wow, this thread is burning a hole in DegreeInfo.com.

I have an Associates degree!!!

 

It really depends on what type of associate's degree it is and what field/position you work in. I know an associate's degree in electronics will get your foot in the door in the semiconductor industry (well maybe not now with the economy and all ). An associate's degree in electronics and a few years of experience can get you further as well. It's utility gets less as you progress into your career, however (as does most degrees.. except a PHD I guess).

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Fair warning: My post is gonna go off on a tangent, but I'm guessing there are other members of the USAF following this thread very closely. For those not familiar with it, the Community College of the Air Force (CCAF) offers highly specialized Associate's Degrees.

For example, I have an A.A.S in Aircraft Systems Maintenance Technology and a buddy, who also works on aircraft, might have an A.A.S in Aircraft Maintenance Technology. What's the difference? Well, for promotion, my specialty requires that I'm versed in aircraft electrical, environmental, hydraulic, and egress (ejection) systems. But my buddy is expected to be knowledgeable on general aircraft servicing practices (crew chief). In case you didn't know, the USAF is highly specialized, sometimes to a fault.

Unfortunately or fortunately, CCAF puts enlisted airmen on track to earn a highly specialized AAS that is terminal in most cases. They make such a huge deal about getting your CCAF degree. But the fact is, in most cases, the degree only serves you as long as you're in the Air Force. And if you're wondering, airmen have no choice in the A.A.S they pursue, as it is directly related to the job they presently do. Nor can you complete your job-related A.A.S, then go for one in an Air Force field you're really interested in, say, Electronic Engineering Technology. Unless, of course, you actually retrain into a specialty that feeds people into that A.A.S. It would be so nice if the CCAF would:

A. Change its name or better yet, somehow step under the
umbrella of the USAF's Air University. Sounds much more
credible than Community College of the Air Force.

B. Offer bachelors' degrees or at least put more emphasis on
pusuing one. Too often I see talented enlisted people retire
after 20 or 30 years with only a CCAF degree. I scares me to
think of the job prospects of these experienced leaders who
only possess a specialized, yet largely unknown A.A.S from
CCAF.

Ironically, these days it is impossible to earn a promotion beyond E-7 without a CCAF degree. Yet those who have education beyond CCAF, especially Master's degrees, are subject to being percieved "career students" (a no-no in the military) by some promotion boards. In those cases, it's actually harmful to go beyond the CCAF associates. Go figure. Of course, officers are generally expected to have a masters degree as they compete for promotion to 0-4. I find that so interesting...

So based on my experience, associates degrees do have utility as long as one remains employed in a specialized field that directly relates to it. And like Roysavia mentioned earlier, the CCAF (or any associate's can be a stepping stone to a bachelor's degree, depending on how a particular 4-year college views it, especially since it IS a regionally accredited degree. That was certainly the case with me, as TESC accepted the CCAF the same as the first 60 hours of the BA, no questions asked.

4Q out.

 

Obviously English classes were not a requirement for either degree. Sorry, I don't mean to be petty, but for someone receiving two degrees, your grammar sucks.

Christian
CGEN, USQ 2002 <-- Far short of an AA!
SCMP, Stanford 2003
JD, Concord (in progress)

 

As a retired Air Force officer, one who spent his enlisted time as an educational specialist putting people into CCAF degree programs, I want to personally endorse everything that 4Q says, and thank him for it. Nice post. Aim High.

IMHO, the Air Force's leadership will never go for a bachelor's-awarding program a la CCAF. That would create a huge portion of well-educated enlisted people. That in and of itself is no big deal, but a lot of them will want to become officers. And I'm convinced that--largely speaking--prior service officers are tolerated more than they are cultivated. Exceptions abound, sure, but you probably get my drift.

 

A difference also exist between "the Reserves" and "active-duty."

When I was a second lieutenant in the National Guard, I went to an active-duty formal function and when the younger Regular Army officers saw my National Guard patch, I was treated with a disgusting contemptuous tolerance that seemed barely able to stand my miserable presence. I was given the silent treatment and was treated like a third world citizen.

Yes, prejudice exist in many forms.

 

Associate Degree and the high school senior

Hello, I will comment in a different perspective. I see daily 17 and 18 year olds who only currently have the option of the associate degree. We have an excellent community college with a partner program with many of the BIG NAMES. I think the kids are unhappy with the thought of living at home or thinking it is grade 13. Many parents don't give the academic nudge that I gave and keep giving my kids. We also have a local hospitol that sends kids through school with the contract to work for a year -post graduation. Education is great and is the key. Hille

 

There are some real advantages to community colleges and associate degrees. First and foremost is cost! If a person wants to earn a bachelors degree a lot of money can be saved by going to the community college and then transferring to the 4 year institution. It also makes for easier transition for returning adult students and for some high school students. My experience with a number of community colleges has been an intense focus on students succeeding. I think there is a real place in the market for the associate degree.

 

Now I know they must be useless!


Just kidding, I have one but have never listed it on a resume or anything as it was really just a stepping stone to my Bachelor's degree.

 

I figured I'd weigh in with my 50 cents worth. I received an AA in Liberal Arts as part of a transfer program. In that respect, my AA was the first half of my BS degree. At my community college, they offered three types of degrees, AA's (Associate in Arts), AS's (Associate in Science) and AAS's (Associate in Applied Science). The first two were considered "transfer" programs, designed to be the first half of a bachelor's degree. The third, the AAS, was considered a "terminal" degree, designed to prepare the student for immediate employment.

Here are two examples of the "usefulness" of the Associate's Degree.

1. My father worked many years for a major food retail chain. Management refused to promote him to store manager because he only had a high school education. The highest title he ever received was Grocery Manager, essentially 2nd in command. At the same time, there was another guy that worked for the same chain. He received his AA in Management and, within a short period of time, was promoted to Store Manager. It was well known throughout the company, that my father was a much better manager than the other guy, but without a degree, he would never make it to the top in-store level.

2. When I was completing my undergraduate studies in Virginia, my spouse went to work at the local animal hospital. She worked with a woman who had been hired after completing her BS in Biology from William & Mary. Shortly after she was hired the hospital sent her to Camden County College in New Jersey to undertake the AAS in Animal Science Technology program. Upon completion of the AAS, she was promoted to "Vet Tech" and received a nice increase in salary. So, in this case, the AAS was the more "useful" degree.

 

Rich,

I would understand why that would scare them into not wanting enlisted men/women pursuing a higher education. However, it's not like these guys/gals get a 4 year degree and PRESTO they are commisioned. They have to go in front of a board and prove to them that they are better than the other Airmen that stood before them. There is alot of competition in getting a commisioned status. So, if there is more enlisted people out there with bachelor's degrees then they CAN'T rely on their education to win the board. They will have to work harder, which makes them better Airmen/Soldiers/Marines/Squids, which makes the military happy right?

On the other hand, these educated enlisted people are now qualified for high paying jobs out in the civillian sector. This may bring down the number of "career military" they once had.


4Q,

I have seen a few schools (usually at the same schools that support the Navy College Program and EArmyU) that will take your CCAF credits and apply it towards a bachelor's degree. I don't remember if they applied the technical credits towards the major or if they were electives. I have an AAS my self (that was composed around my MOS) and thought it would be close to impossible to transfer over to a bachelor's (because of AAS's being terminal in nature), however, I am finding alot of school programs that accept most/all my credits. Usually, it's on a "course by course" basis.

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Yes, I know. To wit:

1. I was enlisted.
2. I was an education specialist who worked with people to get into commissioning programs.
3. I earned two bachelor's degrees during my first enlistment.
4. I got out when the career opportunities for a college graduate didn't compare to the civilian sector. Two years later...

5. I was accepted into Officer Training School and commissioned.
6. I was an education and training officer.
7. I was a commmandant of cadets at an AFROTC unit, where we commissioned many officers with prior enlisted service.
8. I was a commander, who worked with a lot of enlisted men and women dealing with career opportunities.

I didn't say it was automatic, that getting a degree gets you a commission. What I said was that more enlisted people with degrees will pressure the Air Force to commission more of them instead of NPS (non-prior service) candidates. But I don't think the Air Force would take up the opportunity to "promote from within." Thus, these highly educated--and somewhat underpaid--enlisted personnel will be more inclined to get out and futher their careers in the civilian sector. Getting a degree is a prime reason for getting out of the service. I know, I did that, too.

 

I think you should list an associates degree on your resume especially if it concentrates on a different area than your bachelors degree.

If your AS in in CJ and your BS is in Psychology you may have just the right combination to fill a perfect job. The employer would never know unless you list all of your educational experience.

 

My husband got an AA from a community college, then a bachelor's in Architecture at USC. I asked him why he did the AA - he said for several reasons (there were many classes required that he did not need or fulfill requirements for his BS).

1. He was working as he was in school, when he got the AA, he got a promotion and it "started his professional career".

2. USC was a very difficult program, many dropping out, he wanted to have a degree going in, so if he did drop out, he at least had a degree for the resume.

and the most honest.....

3. He wanted to be at the community college as ong as possible as he transitioned to a very difficult program, so he took the extra classes for the AA.

It worked for him, and I think between a high school grad and an AA holder, the AA holder will get the job.

I went the community college route, but no AA. Looking back I could have gotten a raise for the AA, but didn't want to take the extra classes, though it took me 8 years as a night student, I knew I would die before quitting - would not marry or kids before that threshold of a Bachelor's - just my goals, not to knock an AA, it is all just prferences.

 

I thought that was what I already said. Are you agreeing or disagreeing with my thoughts? Not sure.

 

Good call. I often consider that approach. I'm hoping my A.A.S. combined with my BLS and MBA will make the impression that I'm well-rounded. However, I will apply this on a case-by-case basis since there will be times that approach might do more harm than good.