I'm a little upset

Lack of disclosure.

 

CNN is reporting (according to "sources") that Paul Manafort's phones were indeed tapped both before and after the election. Manafort was Trump's campaign manager for a short time.

According to the story, the Obama administration originally got a FISA warrant in 2014 for Manafort based on his work for a firm that was representing the then-government of Ukraine (democratically elected, hugely corrupt, somewhat pro-Russian and subsequently overthrown by street violence in the so-called 'Maidan revolution'.) That warrant eventually expired due to 'lack of evidence' according to the "sources".

Manafort was Donald Trump's campaign manager from May to August 2016 (during some of the primaries). Supposedly he wasn't being surveiled at that time. (If you believe CNN.) But sometime subsequent to August, a new FISA warrant was requested and granted. His communications were apparently being intercepted until early this year some time.

See Kizmet, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean your phone isn't tapped.

US government wiretapped former Trump campaign chairman - CNNPolitics

 

I believe that you're smart enough to know the difference between having one person legally wiretapped and having Trump Tower illegally wiretapped

 

I wouldn't be so sure. Supporting Trump takes its toll.

As I've alluded before, given what Manafort does for a living, would you really believe he was never wiretapped? That would be a very blatant omission by the intelligence community. Of course he was investigated, including by technical means - as he should be. I personally hope he rots in jail.

 

The initial wiretapping of Manafort was dropped because the FBI had nothing on him.

But then...

But then he became Trump's campaign chair and a new warrant was obtained for another wiretap. Because he was Trump's campaign chair. Because he would be talking to Trump. The wiretap was not for Manafort but for Trump, indirectly.

The Obama administration bugged the campaign of the opposition party.

 

Paul Manafort is going to prison. The only thing in question is, will he opt for a reduced sentence by flipping on Trumps & Co? I know you don't read the news but don't worry, I'll keep you updated.

 

For what?

Update me about Podesta?

 

Where was Manafort living when he was tapped by the Obama administration?

 

Note that it says Manafort was tapped before and after the election, when Trump was POTUS.

 

For some reason I could not read that article linked earlier in the thread. It gets a little hard to follow with each side spiking the football every time the wind blows.

 

trailer park?

 

Ouch, salty.

 

For what?

In order to be convicted of a crime, a crime needs to have been committed. At some point somebody will have to specify what it allegedly was. Until somebody does, this whole 'investigation' is straight out of Kafka.

The only thing? What about naming the crime that Manafort will be charged with? All that the news I posted yesterday told us (assuming it was true) was that the Trump campaign was indeed wiretapped by the outgoing administration (which supposedly was a laughably crazy allegation earlier in this thread). It seems to me that a partisan administration using the police powers of the state against political opponents might arguably be a potential crime too. That suggests additional questions that might be asked.

Which introduces the additional assumption that "Trump and Co" are guilty of anything, except derailing Obama's divinely-inspired (except there's no God) revolution of 2008 and the irrevocable march leftwards towards 'progress' and utopia, which Obama's election supposedly symbolized.

And that's what it's really about, isn't it? Undoing the 2016 election by non-democratic means. Basically the overthrow of the elected United States government.

I don't foresee it happening, since once again, nobody has even gotten to step one yet, an alleged impeachable offense. This is where the whole thing is likely to remain for the next 8 years, a criminal investigation in search of a crime, a source of constant fascination for desperate Democrats.

Democrats would be better advised deciding on the future of their own party and clarifying their own vision for the future of the country. Right now, 'Democrat' just means 'fuck Trump' (and by implication 'fuck the half of America that voted for Trump'). Which seems to me to be the party's fundamental problem, since you aren't likely to win elections by telling half the electorate that they suck. The Democrats have to listen to those people's concerns and then address them in attractive ways.

Bill Clinton won in 1992 by listening to the concerns of the so-called 'Reagan Democrats'. Is there anyone in the Democratic party willing and able to do that today? Or would it cause mass defection of the left-base, splitting the party?

The really interesting thing to me about current US domestic political events is the political reorganization that might be currently underway, something that hasn't happened in the US for 150 years. Both the Democrats and Republicans are likely to fracture into new parties. If that happened, the moderate Democrats might merge with the establishment never-Trump Republicans and create a new party, centered between a socialist party on the left and a populist party on the right.

 

Manafort was tapped under a FISA warrant, meaning someone presented evidence that suggested he is an agent of a foreign power. Which, since we're talking about a problem-solver for the international worst of the worst and a principal consiglieri for criminal Yanukovych cabal (for a decade), sounds like a dispatch from Captain Obvious. Now, as a part of Mueller's probe, a judge gave a warrant for an early-morning lock-picking raid on his house, removing documents. He will be indicted, specific crime depending on what part of his shady operation is readily provable. Pretending he's not dirty really strains credibility. Which invites this question: Manafort had a reputation for working for third-world despots for a long time now. Did Trump campaign saw something in him to hire despite the shadiness, or was he hired because of it? Seeing how they also worked with Carter Page, Felix Sater, and the Agalarovs, I believe there's a pattern here.

 

"Democrat" increasingly means getting to universal health coverage, raising minimum wage, and working to make college affordable, while pushing for women, minority, and LGBT rights. Most of this stuff, individually, are popular policy stances. But you knew that already, didn't you?

 

IOW, Venezuela, where all is promised and none is true. At this point of time, it is incomprehensible that anyone would fall for this crap, that anyone would hand their life over to their government.

 

IOW, Canada. US Democratic Party is slightly to the right of the ruling Liberals, while Bernie is to the left of Liberals and will fit squarely in the NDP. "Venezuela" is such a dumb scarecrow.

 

Patience grasshopper. It will all happen in it's own time. I'd like to know all the details as well but if some sort of deal is made there may be some things that never come all the way out of the shadows. The funny thing to me is the people who, on the one hand, decry "the leakers" but then complain when there are no leaks.

 

MAY???!!!!! Next time you'll say there's no evidence of Russian troops in Eastern Ukraine.

Manafort is a professional evil minion for hire. He just is. Do you really believe he paid all the taxes on the dirty cash he got from Yanukovich, Lyovochkin, Firtash, Deripaska, as well as the slew of African and Asian despots he served over the years? Also, elections he most recently worked on before joining Trump were all rigged, both outright and by using lies ("dark PR") - the latter with his direct help. Draw your own conclusions.