Warning on Some USA Theology Degrees

Re: Re: Re: Warning on Some USA Theology Degrees

My apologies for the misunderstanding, Bill.

 

Ed,

A few questions about your DTS experience:

1) Did you take any courses with Ryrie or Pentecost? If so, how were they as teachers?

I've been reading these guys for years and have thoroughly enjoyed their work. Just wondering how they are in person.

2) Did Chuck Swindoll do any teaching there?

3) Was the "Lordship vs. Free Grace" debate hot issue? I hear that John McArthur's name is not greatly respected there

One other question ...

How are you furthering your studies? A doc?

Thanks.

Roscoe

P.S. I'm sure you're familiar with Bob Wilkin of the Grace Evangelical Society. His newsletter, Grace in Focus, will carry one of my articles in March.

 

ROSCOE: Did you take any courses with Ryrie or Pentecost? If so, how were they as teachers?

ED: No. Ryrie no longer teaches at DTS. Pentecost teaches an occasional class in the Bible Exposition department, but I received advanced standing or validation for many of those classes. I did, however, hear Pentecost speak in chapel, and like Walvoord, age has not diminished mental acuity. Neither teach or speak with notes, and both frequently quote entire passages from the portion of the Bible they are teaching. In fact, a friend of mine who took a course with Pentecost said the electricity went out one day during class, and Pentecost continued although the classroom was too dark to see anything. He quoted chapter and verse from memory, and finished his lecture as planned. It left a deep impression on the students in the class.

ROSCOE: Did Chuck Swindoll do any teaching there?

ED: No. Chuck spoke frequently in chapel and made appearances in various classes, but to my knowledge never taught a course himself. He is now involved in a D.Min. course, but he is co-teaching it with Dr. Mark Young of the World Missions department. Incidentally, I had the opportunity to spend some time alone with Chuck, and he is one of the most authentic persons I've ever met.

ROSCOE: Was the "Lordship vs. Free Grace" debate hot issue? I hear that John McArthur's name is not greatly respected there

ED: It's not a hot issue, though it is discussed. I think many people have mistakenly pitted DTS against the Master's Seminary with regard to this topic, as if the schools stand on opposite ends of the spectrum. DTS has no official stance on the issue, and different faculty members hold different views. In fact, when I was a student Bob Wilkin came to campus for a formal debate with New Testament professor Darrell Bock. Bock holds to what he calls a "soft lordship" position, finding problems with the views of both Wilkin and MacArthur.

ROSCOE: How are you furthering your studies? A doc?

ED: Yes. I've successfully completed a dissertation proposal for a U.K. school, and have taken D.Min. courses at a U.S. school.

ROSCOE: I'm sure you're familiar with Bob Wilkin of the Grace Evangelical Society. His newsletter, Grace in Focus, will carry one of my articles in March.

ED: I'm on the mailing list; I look forward to seeing your article!

 

balance is the answer

I believe the issue is not getting closer to God, but growing spiritually. One who just studies theology is can be as dry as a bone. One who just reaches out and trys to minister without study is as shollow as a puddle. The issue to me is that we need to study theology but not forget that it is not the end in and of itself. Theology must be lived in order for growth to take place in the life of a follower of God.

 

I don't think so. Some of the most spiritual people that I have ever met were relatively simple individuals, at least in an academic sense. I don't think that there is a lot of causal correlation between the two.

Of course, it's obvious that they aren't exclusive either. There are theologians and religious scholars who speak from the heart as well as from the head.

The common denominator could be that their religion has become a fundamental practice with them, a basic part of their lives, growing on multiple levels simultaneously.

 

On the Dept. of Ed. website is a listing of equivalent graduate degrees (which I first found about on DegreeInfo). It lists the M.Div. in the category of First Professional Degree. All other degrees in this category are doctorates (M.D., J.D., D.C., D.D.S., O.D., Pharm.D., D.O., D.P.M. & D.V.M.)

http://www.ed.gov/NLE/USNEI/us/professional-studies.html

Tony

 

This is true, Tony. The M.Div. is of course an 88-96 hour program, depending on where it is earned. The same website also has a list of degrees it calls equivalent to the Ph.D.---the D.Min. being one of them.

 

I don't have any unmet research needs at the moment, but I'm always willing to look at another CV. Though we employ a core staff on a full-time basis, a good chunk of our research is conducted by work-for-hire specialists. When a need for special research arises, I search each CV on file looking for the best candidate to do the job. Anyone with accredited graduate level training in Old Testament, New Testament, theology, philosophy or apologetics, and who agrees with the basic doctrinal statement of Campus Crusade for Christ International, is welcome to contact me privately.

 

A few thoughts

Thanks for posting this, Ed. I'm still looking into doing more master's level work in theology before I go on for a PhD, and John Sailhamer is, perhaps, the evangelical scholar I respect the most in the old testament community. Ive seen his intuition work correctly on too many issues to ignore this comment.

Thanks for posting this question, Dave. I appreciate this question tremendously because I think an evangelical theology with no mention of spirituality is like an evangelical theology with no mention of redemption. I have seen far, far too many theologians without any grip on their spirituality. Not only that, but my personal research in the Old Testament has grown exponentially more significant (IMHO) and insightful since I began integrating it closely with spirituality issues.

Chris