The "commoditization" of higher education

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The "commoditization" of higher education

Ok Lawrie - are you saying that Harvard (and the Harvard MBA) doesn't have a "brand"? How about Stanford or University of Chicago? All of these schools have a brand. Perhaps some of the DL schools you promote lack a brand image - but the top end is hardly a commodity.

I think I "gotcha" here in your own words. Don't be embarrassed, I won't hold your feet to fire. Move on.

By the way - how about your "ferrari" comment? I think I "gotcha" there, too.

Regards - Andy

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: The "commoditization" of higher education

Lawrie writes:
Andy, you would do well to consider Denis Healy's First Law of Holes: when you're in one, stop digging.


Andy:
Ok Lawrie - are you saying that Harvard (and the Harvard MBA) doesn't have a "brand"?

Lawrie responds:
No! Of course they have a brand name. Corn is a commodity but Kellogg's Corn Flakes is a brand name and carries a premium. Simply because the DL market, which, if you remember is the focus of this thread, is becoming commoditized, it does not mean all providers including all elite traditional providers are commodities. That is asinine.

Andy:
How about Stanford or University of Chicago?

Lawrie:
Uh, they're not commodities either.

Andy:
All of these schools have a brand.

Lawrie:
You got it.

Andy:
Perhaps some of the DL schools you promote lack a brand image -but the top end is hardly a commodity.

Lawrie:
Congratulations! You are right. Good. The thread is about the DL market.

Andy:
I think I "gotcha" here in your own words.

Lawrie:
Andy, you are an unconscious comedian. I'm missing the keys on the keyboard. I can hardly hold it together. Yeah, sure, you got me.

. . . .

lAWRIE:
All rightie then. Which words led you to believe I thought elite universities were commodities? Be very precise here, and show your working. The reader should be in no doubt that you understand the processes and the underlying concepts.

Here was your proposition:- BORCHERS MAXIM: "If you can differentiate a product - the product isn't a commodity."

If you remember, you started this in relation to institutions having AACSB accreditation, and a cheap shot that followed. My point was clear. In relation to the DL market, the fact of AACSB accreditation does not mean a school is not a commodity. That is, it is possible to have AACSB accreditation and yet still be a commodity, albeit commanding a premium price. As in, say, premium coffee.

You countered (and this was your attempt at a "gotcha", i.e., a cheap shot) that "commodity" meant all elements were the same in terms of quality. You gave the example of 100 bushels of wheat, to prove your case. unfortunately for you, you included the phrase, "of a certain grade", clearly implying that there are differences in wheat quality.


Here is your precise statement:
"What is a commodity? Consider 100 bushels of a certain grade of wheat on the Kansas City exchange. As a commodity - you can't tell the difference between one bushel and the next. There is a difference between MBA programs - in fact people like Business Week and USNews rank them.


Dissecting your argument we have: ANDY'S ANALYSIS AND CONCLUSIONS

1. Consider a subset of a set. All elements of the subset are identical, and the elements of the subset are a commodity of a particular grade. The subset is a member of a set of the elements of the same commodity but which differ in grade (the set contains subsets which are not identical in grade - clearly).

2. Consider a second set. There is a difference between the elements of the set, therefore set is not the set of a commodity.

That is your proposition. It gets worse if we take the fat off of it.

1. Wheat is a commodity which differs in quality. Wheat is ordered by this quality.

2. MBA programs differ in quality, therefore they are not a commodity.

That is your argument. I didn't make this up.
---------------------------

Andy:
Don't be embarrassed, I won't hold your feet to fire. Move on.

By the way - how about your "ferrari" comment? I think I "gotcha" there, too.


Lawrie concludes:
Good grief.

 

I'll dig just one more time. There is a key point in your "jive" that we differ on.

You seem to think that DL MBA programs are a separate market from MBA programs in general. I maintain that MBA programs are a big market. Yes, there are some "commodity" programs at the bottom of the pile that aren't terribly differentiated. But there are some very differentiated programs at the top of the pile. And these top end programs aren't "Ferrari's", they take a significant chunk of the market.

I argue for one market because the outcome - a degree labelled "MBA" doesn't come with with a "DL" or "traditional label". Further, some programs, like Indiana's (or even UoPs) can be earned in either on-ground or on-line format. DL MBAs and part-time MBAs earned on-site are easily substituted for one another. I'd argue that any market distinction between DL and on-ground is fuzzy at best.

Is there a difference between wheat and MBA degrees? Yes, there is. If you are honest with this NG Lawrie you'll have to agree. Wheat maybe graded - but within a grade buyers assume that one bushel is exactly the same as another.

MBA programs aren't this similar. Even within the "commodity" class we see lots of conversation about programs and their pros and cons. Someone will comment on how responsive the program administrator is - or how challenging the classes are. This conversation suggests that we aren't talking about a true commodity.

How often do people in Kansas City argue about the relative merit of bushels of a single grade?

The market definition point shows up in other cases. If you are Bill Gates, you'll argue that your firm only controls 20% of the software industry. If you're Bill's competitor you'll note he has 95% of the desktop operating system market. What's the relevant market definition? Good question.

Regards - Andy

 

I need to interject a point of semantics and clarification here. While I understand Laurie's broad meaning in saying that education is certification, meaning, in a sense, the Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval, in the strictest sense it's important to differentiate the two. Education is learning a subject or discipline through study and/or instruction, or in contributing new knowledge to the field. At the master's level, a degree such as the MS, MBA, MEd, etc. evidences completion of formal education. A "certifcate program" at the bachelor's level or an "advanced certificate" at the master's level is not certification per se, but rather an abridged education in a field or discipline culminating in a certificate rather than a full degree.

True certification is conferred by professional institutes. Generally, certification requirements include prior attainment of a degree, experience (i.e., years) in the discipline, professional references, and several proctored examinations. The successful candidate is then granted the CPA, CMA, CAM, CM, CPM, CFA, CRM, CFM, CCP, CCIM, CLU, CFP, or whatever. While it's true that preparing for a particular certification can be educational, i.e., reading texts and articles or even attending seminars, a professional certifcation or designation is a recognized professional credential, not an academic degree. Possessing certifications can also sometimes allow students entering master's degree programs to waive foundation courses and move on directly to advanced courses.

People's views concerning the value of degrees and certiications in their professional lives differ markedly. Some take a degree and never consider certification. Others believe that a BA or BS plus the certification substitute for a master's degree. (I very much disagree.) And some of us take both degrees and certifications to gain a competitive edge.

I don't mean to split hairs here. But there is so much blurring between academic and professional doctorates these days, that I would hate to start seeing a blurring occur where people begin believing that a certification is a degree or vise versa. It simply isn't the case and never will be.

David April
BA, University of Massachusetts at Amherst
MBA, Boston College
ACM, Boston College
DBA, California Pacific University
CAM, Institute of Certified Professional Managers
CM, Institute of Certified Professional Managers
CRM, Institute of Certified Records Managers

 

I'm not invested in either side of this debate but I'd like to point out that the UMass MBA program (which is "certified" by whoever certifies such things - I forget) can be earned by either 100% in-class methods or 100% DL methods as well as any combination of both. The resulting diploma is no different in any case. Let the chips fall.
Jack

 

While your point is generally clear, your use of the "Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval" metaphoris unfortunate as it has long been known that the only thing that a company needed to do in order to receive this "approval" was to buy advertising space in Better Homes And Gardens magazine. In the real world, this "Seal Of Approval" meant nothing in terms of quality or value. Sorry to nitpick, but you were the one hung up on semantics and clarification.
Jack

 

Jack, you make an excellent point. I would only say that "certifying" education beyond RA accreditation and program endorsements by the APA, AACSB, etc. also adds no discernable quality or value either, being a mere redundancy. Thus, the effort is as meaningless as the Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval.

Dave

 

Yes, well you may be right about that but as someone who pays little or no attention to MBA programs I can only give my impression. There are a zillion MBA programs, most are in-class and some are DL. Some of each of these groups are certified (by AACSB, I guess) and some aren't. Those that are AACSB certified possess some quality(ies) that the others lack. I don't know what AACSB looks for but I'm guessing that they're not just taking pay-offs from the schools they certify. If I'm correct in this then I would say that while the AACSB certification does not actually add value, what it does do is illuminate the consumer and other interested parties (such as employers) that a certain group of programs have been "certified" as to possessing this set of qualities. In this way the label "AACSB Certified" does not add value but rather it indicates added value that was already present. It might be similar to the kid who gets all A's in school. (S)he might not be the smartest kid in the class (although it would be the safest bet) and the A's on the report card don't MAKE the kid the smartest, they merely indicate who has achieved that level of accomplishment according to specific standards. The A's don't add value, they indicate value.
Jack

 

AACSB looks for a number of things. Most are input related - e.g. % of faculty with PhDs, % of faculty that are active in research, library resources, admission standards (such as the GMAT), and the like. For example, the AACSB website in their FAQ says:

"Red flags and questions will be raised about any faculty members with no intellectual contributions within the five-year review period."

Another big "gotcha" requirement is that AACSB expects half the credit hours offered by a business program to be taught by full-time faculty.

AACSB accredits some 350 schools - about 17% of the institutions that award business degrees. Without exception (almost without exception?) all of the top business schools in the U.S. are AACSB accredited. Most of the "commodity" grade programs are incapable of being AACSB accredited.

AACSB does require program evaluation - that is examination of outcomes - but they don't seem to focus on it.

Regards - Andy

 

The Carpathian peasant, whose bloodlines are admittedly contaminated by all sorts of odd bits, asks Professor Kennedy and Lawrie Miller, to whom he may in a quite distant sense be a kinsman: in the anthropomorphic conception of the U.K., what exactly is Northern Ireland?

Go Rangers anyway!

 

Andy:
You seem to think that DL MBA programs are a separate market from MBA programs in general.

Lawrie:
No, but it is one subset of the general market when that market is differentiated by method of mediation.

Andy:
I maintain that MBA programs are a big market. Yes, there are some "commodity" programs at the bottom of the pile that aren't terribly differentiated. But there are some very differentiated programs at the top of the pile. And these top end programs aren't "Ferrari's", they take a significant chunk of the market.

Lawrie:
Could be, but that is not inconsistent with segmenting the market in terms of mediation, and analyzing one subset. That is what I have done in the opening preamble to this thread. What we are examining is the commoditization of the DL market, and at the end of the piece, extrapolating this phenomenon to the rest of the market over the next fifty years.


Andy:
some programs, like Indiana's (or even UoPs) can be earned in either on-ground or on-line format. DL MBAs and part-time MBAs earned on-site are easily substituted for one another.


Well, you cite exceptions to prove the rule. Schools provide any number of DL offerings not offered in their suite of traditional programs, if indeed the institution offers traditional programs at all. Even if they are offered traditionally, that in no way alters or negates anything within the original proposition delineated in my opening piece. It is possible to have commoditized traditional programs. I have never said that the traditional segment of the education market has no commoditized products. Equally, I have not said it comprises entirely commoditized products. Whether it does or doesn't or is somewhere in between, it does not effect our analysis of the subset of the market known as DL.

Andy:
I'd argue that any market distinction between DL and on-ground is fuzzy at best.


Lawrie:
Well, it is an imperfect world with no definite boundaries, nevertheless, this is a new position for you. I'd remind you that you are posting to a DL internet bulletin board. DL is recognized as a subset of the higher education market that differs in many ways from the traditional market. I do not see that that could be a debatable point.

At graduate level, many working adults choose DL programs. Most of those working adults seeking trade degrees are, it seems, looking for certification to help them in their career. Few, I suspect, are making time in a very busy schedule, and financial sacrifices within their tight budgets, for love of learning.

Andy:
How often do people in Kansas City argue about the relative merit of bushels of a single grade?

Lawrie:
How often do people in Kansas City argue about the relative utility of an MBA from Upper Iowa University one from Morehead State University?

Andy:
How often do people in Kansas City argue about the relative merit of bushels of a single grade?

Lawrie:
You know, come to think of it, I suspect the wheatie cognoscenti in Kansas do exactly that. "This shouldn't be grade this, it should be graded that", 'What planet did you beam in from? It is clear it is in the right grade', and so on.

It seems to me you change your focus and position as your arguments have fizzled and expired. You Earlier wrote:

Andy earlier wrote:
"I recognized that the commoditization of education is happening - in part of the higher education world. Schools like UoP with 125,000 students and TESC with 18,000 students aren't small. They serve part of the higher education market - but they aren't the entire market. "

Lawrie:
I agree that they are not the entire market. My original piece address conditions in the DL market. It seems you did not disagree too much with that proposition then. Would maintaining some consistency further your argument, do you think?

 

Lawrie - would answering a question further your argument? You write a lot of words - but you don't seem to answer simple questions.

1. Is there a difference between wheat and MBA degrees? ... If you are honest with this NG Lawrie you'll have to agree. Wheat maybe graded - but within a grade buyers assume that one bushel is exactly the same as another.

MBA programs aren't this similar. Even within the "commodity" class we see lots of conversation about programs and their pros and cons. Someone will comment on how responsive the program administrator is - or how challenging the classes are. This conversation suggests that we aren't talking about a true commodity.

2. Have you submitted your BA in 4 weeks for peer review? Have you ever served as a reviewer for a journal?

.... never mind with #2 - most of us figure the answer to both questions in "No". Sorry Lawrie - couldn't resist the opportunity...

Regards - Andy

 

A couple of questions Lawrie.

Regards - Andy

---------------------


Andy:
You seem to think that DL MBA programs are a separate market from MBA programs in general.

Lawrie:
No, but it is one subset of the general market when that market is differentiated by method of mediation

Andy: So, there is one market (the MBA market)? It seems you are saying there isn't a DL MBA market, but rather a general MBA market. This is interesting because you contradict yourself below.

But is mediation a relevant dimension to segment the market? Does UoP focus on the DL market? Or do they focus on adult learners - whether DL or on-ground? As for UoP (#1 in DL MBA) and Indiana being exceptions - increasingly combining DL and on-ground offerings is becoming the norm. Consider Baker College (#2 in DL MBA), UMass, UMDearborn, UMFlint and a growing host of others. Such programs aim at adult learners - wherever they can find them. Some of these programs are going to blended delivery - part of a degree program face to face and part on-line.

Yet for most working adults the choice includes DL and traditional programs. The ultimate decision is based on more factors than media.

There are some 800 part-time MBA students at the University of Michigan and a similar number at the Univesity of Chicago. These are just a few examples of challenging MBA programs that mid-career folks choose to pursue. Are these folks looking for a cheap and easy way to earn "certification"??? Hardly - these two programs are world class - and tough as nails to get into and complete.

But Lawrie - didn't you just agree there is no "DL market"? I'm confused.

 

Hey, Uncle. This is from memory, we'll see how good it is.

1. The British Isles comprises the large island of Britain, the smaller island of Ireland, the Shetland Islands in the far north, the Isle of Man, the Channel Islands, and loads of other smaller bits and bobs.

2. The UK is, "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland".

3. Great Britain comprises Scotland, England and Wales.

4. The whole of the island of Ireland was once part of the United Kingdom, "The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland".

5. Somewhere around 1921, a deal was brokered whereby the Ireland would gain independence as the "Free State" from the UK, excepting six counties in the north of Ireland.

6. The population in the six counties, were predominantly Protestants. The rest of the island of Ireland was overwhelmingly Catholic.

7. That division had arisen because of British emigration to the north of Ireland in the preceding centuries. That cohort of new immigrants controlled the levers of local government and eschewed assimilation or integration with the indigenous population.

8. Northern Ireland then, may be viewed as a vestige of empire where the colonists became an entrenched enclave. Perhaps there is a corollary in the history of the French in Algeria.

9. In the late Sixties, early Seventies, there was a move by Catholics in Londonderry and/or Belfast to gain basic civil rights. The protestant majority in the north, had so arranged things such that a local city ward in a protestant area of this city would comprise 1,500 inhabitants or so, and a local ward in a Catholic area would comprise 10,000. By this method (gerrymandering) the Protestants who were a minority in the city, nevertheless controlled things.

10. British troops were called in originally, as I remember it, to protect the Catholic protesters, but soon became to be viewed as an army of occupation by them. The Provisional IRA grew out of a perceived need by some to protect the Catholic population.

11. The protestant view the six counties as their land, their country. The North was part of the UK and the rule of law must be maintained.

12. Glasgow, Scotland contains many people with ethnic and historical ties to both the Catholics and protestants in the six counties. Rangers is a soccer team with 98% protestant support and Celtic another soccer team with 98% Catholic support. When they play each other, it is a proxy for centuries of rivalry and antipathy.

 

Lawrie:
You want to see who can pee higher, go elsewhere.


Andy:
2. Have you submitted your BA in 4 weeks for peer review? Have you ever served as a reviewer for a journal?

Lawrie:
I truly do not understand this. Unable to make a relevant contribution on the issues, you doing what, exactly?

Could you tell me why you think your questions on this issue would either embarrass or annoy me? Why would I care?

So far as the journal review goes, it was never a problem for me. I really thought I'd answered by saying if the conclusions of any review were based on empirical evidence, then I'm all for it. I then asked you to provide details of the process and likely procedure, a request you ignored.

There is nothing I fear related to examining the veracity of BA in 4 Weeks, it works. That has been demonstrated time after time. You have read the testimony of those who have posted here. I am 100% confident that any review based on empirical evidence and sound scientific interpretation of the data, will come to the same conclusion. It works.

If however, any review is based on opinion, then why would I be interested? Is the opinion of a group going to assist or impede the progress of even one learner following the guides? It is beyond me why you think the Beavis and Butthead remarks about a review have impact or relevance.

BA in 4 Weeks assists the many. It helps people help themselves. Those who write, tell me the impact of obtaining a degree, or realizing they can obtain a degree, has changed their lives. On say, a monthly basis, related to your published work, how many people tell you that?

 

Dr Dave wrote:
I need to interject a point of semantics and clarification here. While I understand Laurie's broad meaning in saying that education is certification, meaning, in a sense, the Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval, in the strictest sense it's important to differentiate the two. Education is learning a subject or discipline through study and/or instruction, or in contributing new knowledge to the field. At the master's level, a degree such as the MS, MBA, MEd, etc. evidences completion of formal education. A "certifcate program" at the bachelor's level or an "advanced certificate" at the master's level is not certification per se, but rather an abridged education in a field or discipline culminating in a certificate rather than a full degree.

Lawrie replies:
Hi Dave,

As you know, in the original piece, in that reference, we were exploring the attitudes and motivations of the customer, namely:

"For the vast majority of higher ed customers, certification is education."

I then spend a deal of time defining the terms used in the body of the text:

"Learning is assessed in terms of demonstrable outcomes, and
certification is the mark by which the conferring institution attests
that the student has learned. That is, that the student has qualified at
a specific level, indicated by the award. Isn't that what qualifications
are, attestations as to the accomplishment and learning of the student?
"

"Certification" may be defined in the very narrow sense you cite, but I think you will agree, it is clear in my piece what I mean by certification. There is no ambiguity, and the word is correctly used within the context in which it appears. It fits within every dictionary
definition I can find. The fact that we are discussing the products of education does not preclude the use of the word in senses other than the very narrow one you cite.

A bachelor's degree is indeed a certificate, as is a master's degree, or a parking permit, or security clearance, or any other attestation to
some truth, right, or fitness, and again, I spelled out my meaning in the original article so there would be no confusion.

DR Dave:
Education is learning a subject or discipline through study and/or instruction, or in contributing new knowledge to the field.

Lawrie:
Yes, that is true, but that is not its only meaning, nor indeed, its only common meaning. It is also defined as the knowledge and development
resulting from an educational process, as in "an education". Customers of those offering trade degrees (MBA, LLM, MEd) may rightly feel there
is no difference between the act of fulfilling learning requirements for the degree (i.e. getting and education) and getting the degree paper,
i.e., the certification that they have fulfilled degree requirements. If the program is properly structured the two should be the same in terms of learning outcomes. That is, whether you go after certification, or an education, you will end up in the same place.

Some here have voiced concern that others are more interested in obtaining certification (attestation as to fitness and right) than an
education. If holders of the certificate really do possess the required level of competence, attested to by the certificate, then it is of no
importance what the motivation of the holder may have been. In terms of outcomes, there is no measurable difference among the certificate holders of either type (i.e. on either extreme. Those whose exclusive motivation was to learn and those whose exclusive motivation was certification).

If however, it is the case that some holders of the certificate have not in fact reached the level of competence attested to by the certificate, then the issue is one of fraud, not one of pedagogy or learner motivations.

 

Andy:
Lawrie - would answering a question further your argument? You write a lot of words - but you don't seem to answer simple questions.

Lawrie:
You have got to be kidding me!

Andy:
1. Is there a difference between wheat and MBA degrees?

Lawrie:
Yes. One is a certificate of fitness in Business disciplines at the master's degree level, the other is a type of grain.

Andy:
... If you are honest with this NG Lawrie you'll have to agree. Wheat maybe graded

Lawrie:
Yes.

Andy:
- but within a grade buyers assume that one bushel is exactly the same as another.

Lawrie:
In terms of its many attributes, probably they do. However there is no requirement that they do, or that it is. "Commodity" does not mean "all the same in all respects". It means, with respect to its use in this thread, a mass market product, where one is as good as the other in terms of function or utility. Here is a quote from my original article:

"As noted, DL market is overwhelmingly about certification, convenience and utility. Generic MBAs, MPAs, M.Ed., LLMs, and other trade degrees abound. The mass of the market is already "commoditized". "

Reprising Andy's quote:
- but within a grade buyers assume that one bushel is exactly the same as another. MBA programs aren't this similar.


Lawrie:
No. MBA programs are not that similar and neither are bushels of wheat. Commodity does not mean "all elements identical", as you contend. How about you quote your reference that defines the word this way? I know of none.


Andy:
Even within the "commodity" class we see lots of conversation about programs and their pros and cons. Someone will comment on how responsive the program administrator is - or how challenging the classes are. This conversation suggests that we aren't talking about a true commodity.

Lawrie:
(This is getting nutty) What is important to the consumer is functionality. No two products in this world is exactly the same. Commodity in the context of this thread means mass market products that are more or less interchangeable. It does not mean, "exactly the same as another". Again, find me an external reference? When exactly did you make this one up? Commodity does not mean identical, it means "as good as" in function, so as to be interchangeable.


EXAMPLE
I want to buy plain vanilla candles to be kept in the event of a power outage. These types of candles are a commodity. I want them to last 6 hours, and at a price around $5 for a bunch. There are several different candle bunches offered that meet requirements. Across manufacturers, and bunches, and even candles within the same bunch, there are differences between one candle and another. There are candles that are a bit thinner and longer than average, and there are candles that are shorter and fatter than average. They do not all have exactly the same composition, and offerings are not all exactly the same price. However, they are still all the same commodity.

Continuing:- They will all last about 6 hours. None will last for exactly the same time as any other, and it is likely none will last for exactly 6 hours, but all fall within the acceptable range of "close enough", with respect to requirements. These candles are a subset of the universal set of candles. It is a subset for the parameters that interest us. If some other characteristics interested us, we would likely not have all or perhaps any of the same members in our subset.

Non specialized (not designer, not incense etc.), plain vanilla candles are a commodity. We buy them to fulfill a function, and as long as the candles do fulfill their intended function, we don't care whether they are brand x or brand y. To us, the consumer, "they are all the same" in terms of our needs. They are a commodity item, yet we know they are not "all the same" in of all of their characteristics, in fact there are quite major differences.

1, Not all DL master's programs are commodity items, but this does not necessarily mean that no group of DL master's are a commodity (as you had previously argued).

2. Not all (or any) DL master's programs are exactly the same in every respect. This does not mean that no group of master's degrees (or a subset of MBA degrees) are a commodity. Like the candles, they can be different but still be a commodity. Like the candles they only have to be (and must be), "good enough", in terms of fulfilling our needs.

Now, I have spent an inordinate amount of time explaining the obvious. What more is left.




Andy:
You write a lot of words - but you don't seem to answer simple questions.


Lawrie:
In this thread, I have gone out of my way to answer your questions. Many, I consider irrelevant to the issue and more than a little retarded in construction, but I have answered them nevertheless. When your proposition is shown to be invalid, you simply try something else. This thread is replete with your re-starts and redefinition's. As we have moved on, your room for maneuver has decreased, till we come to this point and the thinnest thread of an implausible proposition.

 

Hi Lawrie,

I don't disagree that in the very broadest and most general sense "education is certification". However, I remain more comfortable with the more precise phraseology that an educational degree represents attestation (as you suggest), affirmation, or validation. Clearly, my views on education and certification are more narrowly drawn in terms of the distinctions as you noted, principally because of the rise of professional certification in particular. In that light I believe that an academic degree should not properly be termed a certification, (though again attestation is perfectly fine), nor can a professional certification be considered a degree (although there are many out there who would dearly wish it to be true), albeit both are, technically, inscribed on certificates. But again, I do understand the overarching concept and intended connotation of your argument. Incidentally, I probably should not have tried to define "education", as it has been debated continuously ever since Plato's time. Perhaps the merit badge should be the working metaphore here!

Dave