The case for making college mandatory

In some states, Texas for example, you can become a master plumber in just five years (this is after an associates or apprenticing for two years). I just remember my attorney telling me that they both have about the same years of training, but the plumber made more money than he did.

 

New City & Guilds Qualifications

Speaking of trades qualifications, there was a fascinating announcement from the forward-looking City & Guilds in the UK:

 

Thanks, Caldog. You and Dr. Bear (Hitler & Einstein thread) have made this a very interesting and humorous April 1st! And - ahem - given me a chance for a 2,000th post.

:smile: :smile:

Johann

 

Uh, this isn't so. Almost every nation on the planet has a tertiary educational system.

 

Not "Wizard of Id."

Take a look at very technically educated and wealthy societies. They import much of that labor, or outsource it. (The U.S. does this, but is in danger of becoming one of the "feeder" nations that supplies cheap labor. See Honda and Toyota.)

 

I have a nephew that did it and graduate with both a diploma and an A.A. His younger brother is in the same program.

Another pathway is through credit via examination. I graduated from H.S. at 16, then worked for 2 years. After joining the Air Force, I tested out of an A.A. at 19, then almost all of my B.S. and B.A. at 20. I wish I'd known about those exams when I was still in high school.... :smile:

 

I do not recall stating the opposite. Let me elucidate. I am suggesting that in the past graduates from 12th grade were able to read, write and do basic arithmetic in the US. They could name neighboring states, could distinguish between various federal government branches, and understood rudimentary economics.

This is no longer the case. What changed in the students, educators, curricula or something else that prevents such fundamental education?

 

jhp is right. And then some! In some other countries, not only do secondary grads have a firm grasp on the basics, they have skills and knowledge of a more advanced nature. Many countries expect considerably more than basic knowledge of secondary grads, including, but not limited to math, science and tech. subjects.

I heard a news report this morning. Our Provincial Government's - Ontario's stated goal is 70% of Ontarians having post-secondary education, with number-emphasis on the Community Colleges (largely non-degree-granting).

My take: The US system over-emphasizes degrees, at the expense of other recognition. Degrees are common as canned peas. Career, Vocational and Tech schools all teach degree programs? Why?

Some of the big US names in career schools have set up in Canada - e.g. Herzing and Everest Colleges. But they aren't allowed to teach degree programs here - diplomas only. ICS Canada teaches certificate and diploma courses only, although Canadians can sign up for degrees with their US counterpart, Penn Foster, if they wish.

There are more places to learn than the University. Plenty of valid credentials are not degrees. Why does practically every course in the US have to be a degree? Perhaps a partial answer lies in too-easy money. We've avoided granting "ninja loan" mortgages here in Canada. The US has already come through a "ninja loan" mortgage meltdown and perhaps there is a "ninja student loan" meltdown still to come...or has it already started?

Johann

 

I hope you're joking, Maniac...even if April First is over! That, in itself, is the most unconscionably - even revoltingly - elitist statement I've ever read on these forums. And there have been some dandies!

Please tell me that wasn't for real! :shock:

As to the accountant analogy - there's no difference here. One now requires a degree to belong to a professional accounting body. Some Canadian accounting organizations did not make that mandatory until perhaps 20-25 years ago. Degrees are still not mandatory here, with quite as many occupations as in the US.

Johann

 

Yeah - mine too. Wow! :smile:

Social status? Lifted from a 2013 article, referenced on DI:

-In the United States today, approximately 365,000 cashiers have college degrees.
-In the United States today, 317,000 waiters and waitresses have college degrees.
-In the United States today, there are more than 100,000 janitors that have college degrees.

Different category of human being? U.S. degree-obsession? What I said.

Johann

 

The Affordable College Act!:stups:

 

Yes, it could be, but whatever happens inside my head...STAYS inside my head! :smile:

Johann

 

Wait - can this be the same Maniac who wrote elsewhere that he was going to latch onto a trade / skill certification or two, as part of his master plan to be forever working and wealthy, etc. etc. ? Hey, I read this stuff! Sometimes (not often) I even read it with comprehension, when that's possible! :smile:

"As God is my witness, as God is my witness they're not going to beat me. I'm going to live through this and when it's all over, I'll never be hungry again. No, nor any of my folk. If I have to lie, steal, cheat or kill. As God is my witness, I'll never be hungry again! :smile:

-Scarlett O'Hara

Johann

 

Yes, Maniac, you did indeed say exactly that, (and I knew you did) about poverty -- and I applaud your successful efforts to avoid it. The "Scarlett O'Hara" quote was perhaps, in poor taste. If you feel it was, I'm sorry. And right again, you never said "wealthy" - my bad.

I was just "pressing the button" about "degrees putting people into a different category of human being" ...and yes, not only your clients are discriminatory about that. Sorry I "pressed the button" too much. Now, my imaginary girlfriend will have to punish me for that, tonight! :smile:

I'm looking forward to it!

Johann