New TSA Undergraduate Student Tells All

Dear Bill (wfready):

Greetings! You remembered my TSA plans: I'm touched!

I'm replying to you in this new thread, rather than risk subjugating the other thread. As I'm sure you'll agree, your inquiry as to my progress with Technikon SA (www.tsa.ac.za) was not really on-topic. Hope you don't mind.

Regarding your question:

One must obtain a "National Diploma" (or obtain credit for one via TSA's RPL (Recognition of Prior Learning) scheme) before one can be admitted to the "B Tech" program. (In effect, TSA segregates the initial part of a BS degree from the concluding part.) So I'm not officially pursuing a "B Tech" degree, although I am pursuing pursuing one. <g> (i.e. I'm a registered TSA student seeking a ND in "Engineering:Electrical".)

I must say that the registration process has been a great deal of fun! I've been able to email, and even speak*. to people in a completely different country, on a completely different continent!

Despite the theoretically lower cost, the quality of service I've received thus far has been far better than what I recall receiving at the B&M NYC college I formerly attended. One woman at TSA emailed me with registration information on a SA national holiday. She had apparently gone to work of her own volition, which is not quite the way NYC employees operate. <g>

Although I encountered difficulties at every turn, starting with a delay at Ohio University, and continuing across half the world, the only problem I was unable to resolve was having my course material "couriered" (i.e. express mailed) to me. (Thus far I've enrolled in only one course, "Mathematics I." I have every confidence of being able to apply it, and its brothers "Mathematics II" and "Mathematics III", to my COSC degree.)

TSA requires that a student make his own arrangements to have the material picked-up and delivered. Before I could do that, my course materials were relegated to the South African Postal Service, which seems to be about as swift as the USPS. Since then, according to SAPO's online "Track & Trace" system, my course materials have taken up residence at a place called "Witspos", from which they seem disinclined to leave. <g> For this reason, I can't comment on the quality of the support material.

I have been able to check on the progress of my course material, as well as on other details, via TSA's "COOL" virtual campus. While I loathe the idea of "online" courses -- computers are spiffy, but not nearly as spiffy as paper! -- I have no complaint with having optional online support. So far, the "COOL" campus has been pretty cool! <g> A demo is available at http://www.tsa.ac.za/cooldemo/welcome.htm.

I have received the text book for my course, which is (also) published in the US/UK, and which is sold by Amazon.com. Regardless of the quality of the course, I'm sure the text book will prove useful. It is more than thick enough to stop bullets, even those fired at short range. I think it could also be used, in lieu of cement, as the foundation of a one car garage. <g>

I also have had no feedback on my RPL requests, other than a very pleasant note to say that they were received. (I am attempting to substitute my not inconsiderable vocational & educational electronics experience for the non-credit, but still mandatory, supervised, "hands on" work TSA requires.) I can't complain, however, as their next registration cycle isn't until next year, and there is no advantage to having the RPL processed early. Also, their RPL scheme is far less bureaucratic that either COSC's or Ohio University's. (It's probably not productive to compare TSA's RPL scheme with OU's, as I suspect that OU's scheme is the most bureaucratic anywhere.) TSA seems far more focused on whether one qualifies for RPL credit, rather than making one jump through hoops to complete the request. Of course, I reserve the right to rescind these complements should things turn nasty with my RPL. <g>


Cordially,
Richard Kanarek



*Tip: When calling, use a PRE-PAID calling card! MCI charged me something like an average of $5 a minute when I dialed direct, and ATT would have charged me even more if I had used my ATT non-prepaid calling card, but MCI only charged me 90-something cents a minute when I used their pre-paid calling card!

 

Buy an MCI Minute plus prepaid card calls to SA are 60 cents/minute http://www.minutepass.com/IntlRates.asp
If you buy your card from Costco you may find a cheaper rate.

 

Did you find out what the math components (I, II, and III) consisted of (is it close to calc I, II, and ordinary differential?)

So, are you taking courses there just to satisfy a COSC degree (I am guessing engineering studies or were you doing the interdisciplinary studies)?

The program sounds very interesting (please keep us informed). Good luck in your studies.. Goodluck getting your materials! All I can imagine when you mention "Witspos" is some place in the middle of Africa w/ grass huts and all! They are using your materials for fire wood (LOL.. sorry)!

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Witspos is the sorting center in Joburg.

I have been mailing materials to and from SA for 25 years, and have never ceased to be amazed at how long it can take.

I have friends who use a commercial shipping service to send their mail in bulk from SA to Singapore, and then remail to individual recipients from there. Quicker and more reliable.

 

Dear Bill:

Hello again! Regarding your last post:

Judging by the text book, the extremely terse syllabus, and my unsubstantiated intuition, I SUSPECT the following:
Mathematics I: A cornucopia of pre-calc math subjects
Mathematics II: Calc I & Calc II, and other assorted math
subjects.
Mathematics III:More advanced math, calculus & other.
Since all must be done, I really haven't worried about which contains what. Similarly, as a group, they can hardly help but satisfy most of the few COSC mathematics requirements I still need to satisfy. (If only I can pass them, I'll let the foreign credentials evaluator figure out the details. <g>)

My current intention is to pursue a degree from both COSC (www.cosc.edu) & TSA (www.tsa.ac.za). My concentration at COSC hasn't been officially approved yet, but I'm planning on pursuing a "Computer Science Studies" concentration. (Back in 2000, when I joined COSC, I had intended to pursue a dual EE'ish/CS'ish "degree"/Concentration. Who could have guessed that I'd be pursuing it at dual institutions, on dual continents!)
I had intended to pursue an "Engineering Studies" concentration at COSC, but there were too many obstacles to overcome. I'm quite happy, actually, as I think TSA is a far better choice for a quasi-engineering degree than COSC. Engineering isn't an after thought for TSA, they have an established degree path, they supply all the courses -- and more -- one might need for an engineering'ish degree, they offer "proper" distance learning (i.e. paper-based correspondence, my favorite), they will officially record me as having "lab" work (assuming my RPLs are approved); in short (yes, too late <g>) if everything works out well, TSA might be one of the best options for distance EE'ish EET studies available anywhere!

Okay, here are two other bits of info someone might find useful:
1) I've checked with Ohio University, which evaluates foreign transfer credits itself, and COSC, which uses an unknown third party. Neither has expressed any objections to transferring in credits from TSA. While SA colleges are only mentioned here in relation to their graduate degree programs, they (particularly UNISA) might be a swell source of undergraduate credit, if not degrees, too!
2) According to the very rough estimate I obtained from a representative of USQ (www.usq.edu.au), transferring to USQ with a TSA BTECH Engineering:Electrical degree would be likely to take a significant bite out of the number of classes one would need to (re)take in order to obtain a USQ BEng (Bachelor of Engineering). This alone would make TSA worth considering as a way to sidle towards an EE degree without overly committing ones self. What I haven't confirmed, and won't for some time, is if TSA's distance lab work would allow one to avoid the necessity of traveling to Australia for USQ's mandatory lab work.

Thanks!

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Dear Mr. Anderson:

Thanks for the calling card tip! Unfortunately, now I have another problem: I doubt I'll need to call SA again, so what will I do with the remaining minutes on my current card? <g> Does anyone know the number of an Iraqi pizza parlor? Perhaps I'll call up and have a dozen pizzas delivered to Sadam, collect? <g>

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Dear "oxpecker":

Clearly, research needs to be done as to why delivering mail/parcels damages brain cells, and what can be done about it.

UPS used to deliver my packages to a location several miles away from me. I was unable to have them stop doing this, as they had no record that they were doing it. <g>

More recently, and more relevantly, I sent one document packet to SA via USPS "Global Express Mail". The tracked the package from the post office I delivered dropped it off at, to the exit of the post office I dropped it off at. Gee, thanks USPS!

Before I discovered it was too late to have my materials "couriered", I tried making arrangements by emailing "Speed Services" (www.speedservices.co.za), the express mail service that has been (apparently) spun-off from the SA Post Office. "Chris" never replied. If the premium priced express service is unresponsive...

Then again, my air-mailed envelope from SAQA, delivered via the SAPO arrived rather promptly. Perhaps they are only slow to deliver parcels?

------------------------

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Ha, I thought I was the only electronics tech on here that was going the CS route. That was my original major when I first started community college in '92. I forgot how fun it was to make programs, until I started programming courses again.

Is that the impression you are getting with the curriculum in the BTech? Me too. I think it probably is pretty "EE'ish" because of it having both applied and theoretical coursework (that and, if your right about the math courses, it has a bit more math than a typical ET degree). I believe the US doesn't recognize the technologist as being something more close to another engineer than a tech. I see a few BSET grads working as techs where I work (I guess because they don't get enough math and the courses are somewhat more applied than the engineer's curriculum).

Best Regards,
Bill

 

Greetings.

Having just received my study materials for my TSA math class (MAT181Q, yeah!), I thought I'd share more of my experiences.

First, SAPO (South African Post Office) didn't do that poorly: the package took about 22-24 days total to arrive. I was actually quite worried as SAPO kept reporting my package as being at their main post office. Apparently, they fail to track international packages out of the country, just like our own USPS. (I wonder if the marksmanship of SAPO postmen compares to our own too? <g>) As long as I register early for my next TSA class(es), there should be no need for me to make special arrangements for express shipping.

And speaking of my study materials package, what a package! Since the text book, which I obtained from Amazon.com (US), was well suited for self-study (it even includes a tutorial CDROM, which I've not tried yet), I was not expecting much in the way of support materials. Boy, was I wrong! 3.2Kg wrong! There were about 2 inches (yikes!) of A4-size paper, plus a (seemingly) long running PAL video!

Interesting (???) Aside: Staples.com has a very limited selection of A4 binders, and plastic sheet protectors, but no filler paper. Oh well, with all that documentation who needs more paper for notes! <g>

It also seems that I have underestimated the syllabus of MAT181Q. I thought it consisted of an assortment of pre-calc math topics, but it covers differentiation & integration TOO! Remarkable, considering that this is "ONLY" 1/4 of the math studies TSA requires for a lowly BTECH degree. It will be months before I sample my first directly "Engineering:Electrical" related course, but, if the engineering studies are as extensive as the math, the "E:E" BTECH may truly be more BSEE than BSEET (to revisit an earlier topic).

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Richard,

So, they are independant study, correct? I noticed you talking about COOL.. Is it an online independant study course?

 

Dear wfready:

Greetings.

AFAIK, Technikon SA (www.tsa.ac.za/) has a both traditional campuses (plural), and an extensive range of distance courses. Indeed, one of their campuses won an award for "best technikon garden"! Go TSA! <g> (I wonder if they would send me a flower? <g>)

Possibly unique to TSA is their willingness to accept hands on laboratory work by distance. (Grantham College of Engineering used to have a similar policy for their BSEE degree, but, since they switched to offering a BSEET, I've lost interest in them.) The way TSA's program works is that you select a local mentor (presumably someone at your place of employment), who then supervises you "lab" work. This way, for those courses that require it, you get both "real world, hands-on" experience, as well as (as I can attest) more than 3.2Kg of book-learn'in. <g>

The "Cool" I mentioned, and you asked about, refers to TSA's rather accurate, if not particularly modest <g>, description of their "Virtual Campus." The virtual campus offers a vanity of student support services; online classes are not conducted via the virtual campus. Thankfully, I believe that the number of exclusively online courses offered by TSA is extremely low.

If you want to give the virtual campus a test run, visit http://www.tsa.ac.za/cooldemo/welcome.htm. Note that for the purposes of the demo, you'll be "Mr. Fanie Scott", as you'll discover when you reach the pre-filled-out log-on page (click on the appropriate link on the right side of the screen).

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Glad to Hear About Your TSA Experience

I'm glad to hear about your experience with TSA and could not agree more. I am enrolled in the Chemical Engineering Technology MTECH. It is basically through research. I could not agree with you more about how the people accomadating the people at the school are.

 

eketus502,

So, how is the MTECH program there? Did you have an undergraduate degree in chemical engineering or technology? Would you say it has more of a management focus than an undergraduate degree in engineering technology?

Best Regards,
Bill

 

News from your humble chronicler

Yippie! My educational plans have now been cast asunder on two separate continents! <g>

I have just found out that you cannot pursue the higher/next level of a TSA course until you *complete* the lower/previous level of a course. In my immediate case, I cannot move on to "Mathematics II" until I complete "Mathematics I". (And, judging by the slightly testy reply I received from my lecturer, they are *not* open to making exceptions. <g>)

Now this might seem perfectly reasonable to you, and indeed it would be were it not for the caveat about which I'm going to warn you. TSA "Registration Cycles" (of which there are two per year) and TSA final exams overlap; "Registration Cycles" end before finals are given. This means that it is impossible to take the various levels of a subject sequentially: their must be half a year between subjects at a minimum. This rule also limits the speed with which a clever chap (obviously not me <g>) can complete a TSA "National Certificate", "National Diploma", or BTECH (Bachelor's degree). If one were to take a large number of subjects during one registration cycle, there would be very few subjects one would be allowed to take during the next registration cycle.

Am I alone in supposing that this rule is daft, or is there some wisdom to it that I'm too thick to notice?


Grrr...

 

My experience in South Africa (admittedly about 25 years ago) was that they were far more rigid about prerequisites than universities tend to be in the U.S. In my program (chemical engineering) the network of prerequisites was so complex that one had to plan 3 years in advance. The median time to complete a 4-year degree was 5 years because 1 failed course (and they failed many people in each course) could throw your graduation off by 1 or 2 years.

Another point is that in my case results were not available promptly after the exams (as is the case in the U.S.). Because of the external examiner system, results would only be available a month or more after the end of the final exam period. I'm not sure whether the Technikons use external examiners.

 

Dear "oxpecker":

Thanks for the reply and for sharing your experiences!

What strikes me as remarkably odd is not TSA's prerequisites for their classes, but the fact that satisfying a prerequisite for a class may prevent you from taking that class next.

You South Africans must be a pretty clever lot if you can retain & capitalize on an education given in dribs and drabs. Certainly more clever than me. :-(

Cordially,
Richard Kanarek

 

Status of Mtech

Bill,

I am busy working trough my Mtech in Chemical Engineering. I have fallen behind a bit, but hope to get caught up. To answer your question, "the proposal was pure technical and so is all the work." I will try to defend the thesis (in person) some time at the end of this year or begining of next.

It was designed around things I learned, will learn, or needed to learn associated with a significant Chem E Process Change at work. (I would give the details, but out of boredom yopu would most likely log off.)

I am planning to take my family and spend a few weeks in SA, before or after the defense. Looks like Iberia Airlines for the cheap...

If you are intersted in a copy of the orginal proposal..(or thesis when it is done) just let me know.

Thanks,

[email protected]