NA Accreditation

Maybe we need to change this whole outlook of the "it's not RA" to maybe "it's not NA." For all the people that think NA is substandard to RA need to take a closer look at the NA accreditation bodies (this was in response to another posting regarding someone saying that RA is the "accepted US standard in education.")

This is a partial listing of national accreditation and specialized accreditation.

http://www.ed.gov/admins/finaid/acc...tation_pg8.html

If you read closely you'll notice that Medical Doctor's are NA accredited:

Liaison Committee on Medical Education
1952/2002/S2007 Scope of recognition: the accreditation of medical education programs within the United States leading to the M.D. degree.

Individuals studying to become Dentists are NA accredited:

American Dental Association, Commission on Dental Accreditation
1952/2001/S2006 Scope of recognition: the accreditation of predoctoral dental education programs (leading to the D.D.S or D.M.D degree); advanced dental education programs and allied dental education programs that are fully operational or have attained "accreditation eligible" status, and for its accreditation of programs offered via distance education.

Individuals studying to become lawyers are NA accredited:

American Bar Association, Council of the Section of Legal Education and Admissions to the Bar
1952/2001/F2005
Scope of recognition: the accreditation throughout the United States of programs in legal education that lead to the first professional degree in law, as well as freestanding law schools offering such programs.

Individuals studying in nuclear medicine are NA accredited:

Joint Review Committee on Educational Programs in Nuclear Medicine Technology
1974/2001/S2006
Scope of recognition: the accreditation of higher education programs for the nuclear medicine technologist.

Individuals studying to become optometrists are NA accredited:

American Optometric Association, Accreditation Council on Optometric Education
1952/2002/F2007
Scope of recognition: the accreditation in the United States of professional optometric degree programs, optometric technician (associate degree) programs, and optometric residency programs and for the preaccreditation categories of Preliminary Approval and Reasonable Assurance for professional optometric degree programs and Candidacy Pending for optometric residency programs in Veterans' Administration facilities.

If you look at this website you'll notice about 55 Nationally Accredited Bodies, including the DETC.

Hmmm, one would think national accreditation is pretty well recognized here in the U.S.

 

I do see your point, however, generally whenever "NA" is mentioned on this board we're talking about the DETC or possibly the ACICS. I'm by no means an expert, but NA is usually looked down upon because up until just about 30 years ago the DETC (formerly the Home Study Council) only accredited non-degree correspondence schools and unfortunately it's been difficult for the DETC to shake that image at least from my perspective.

Remember the American Bar Association only accredits regionally accredited institutions.

 

I don't think anybody would confuse the DETC as being on the same level as the American Bar Association as accreditors. Or maybe they are, and it's a matter of perspective. If that's the case, the DETC has to work harder to make it more acceptable as an accrediting body by both other schools and employers.

I realize it's currently up to each individual school, but perhaps if the DETC required that the schools they accredit have all of their courses reviewed by ACE that would go a long way toward transferability of credits. I think the DETC also needs to do more to let the general public know that they are indeed a valid accrediting body.

 

jagmct1,

You make a very good point regarding the recognition of accreditation outside the scope of the regional accrediting agencies. However, a few clarifications need to be made:

1. Academic programs, not individuals are accredited. It is incorrect to state that "Individuals studying to become ____ are NA accredited." The programs that train the individuals are accredited.

2. The agencies that you mention are discipline specific professional associations that evaluate and approve specific academic programs within a college or university, not the entire college or university itself. If the American Dental Association accredits a university's D.D.S. or D.M.D. program, it has no effect whatsoever upon that university's Ph.D. programs in mathematics, sociology, history, education, business, etc.

Regional accrediting agencies accredit entire institutions, not just a single program within the institution. A few national accrediting agencies, such as the Distance Educational & Training Council (DETC) and the American Assoication of Liberal Education (AALE) accredit the entire institution, but most of the NA accrediting bodies only deal with a single program or discipline.

3. With very few (if any) exemptions, the professional accrediting bodies that you list accredit programs that exist in colleges and universities that are already RA. It is not a case of "NA in place of RA", it is a case of "NA in addition to RA", RA almost always occurring first.

Accreditation by a discipline's professional association may very well been seen as more important than the institution's regional accreditation by the faculty and administrators of that program. However, I cannot think of an instance where the ADA, AMA, APA, etc. accredits a non-RA university. Perhaps someone on the board knows of such an instance.

It is important, as italiansupernova suggests, that you differentiate between professional associations that evaluate a single academic program and accrediting agencies (the six regionals, DETC, AALE, etc.) that accredit entire colleges and universities.

Good topic...thanks for starting it.

 

Most of the national accreditors offer their accreditation to programs that are already RA. For instance, the only NucMed program that I can think of in Connecticut is a community college program. The community college is RA, and the Nuc Med program is Joint Review Committee on Educational Programs in Nuclear Medicine Technology accredited.

The DETC could offer their accreditation in addition to RA, but who would want it? That's the difference, the other NA accreditors that you mention have a niche purpose that can enhance the prestige of an RA institution's program. DETC, not so much.

Edit: Dr. Pina just communicated what I would have liked to, and he did it better, and before I could submit my reply. Drat!

 

Kinda....

They will also accredit free standing law schools. In that case, the ABA serves as both the institutional and professional accreditor. I think that Ave Maria Law School, Florida Coastal School of Law, and Appalachian School of Law are three examples of ABA approved law schools that lack RA.

Therefore, if one existed, I don’t see why they would refuse to accredit a bricks and mortar law school only because it was part of a larger NA university. I'll search the ABA (www.abanet.org) website to see if I can find out for sure.

 

I certainly agree with that. When people want to find legal scholarship, they look to ABA law schools. What do people look to DETC schools for?

As things stand, DETC is known as a vocational 'home-study' accreditor that expanded into university programs not too long ago. Today it accredits a bunch of relatively unknown schools (with iffy histories occasionally) that have few academic accomplishments to speak of. None of them really jump off the page and make people exclaim "that's a good one!".

(The Australians might, but they don't depend on DETC for their primary accreditation any more than the Wharton School of Finance depends on its CA-approval.)

DETC schools might have real, albeit stealthy, excellence. But if nobody knows that, then it doesn't do anybody much good.

DETC probably should start a project to upgrade the profiles of its degree-granting schools, particularly those operating graduate programs that have future doctoral aspirations. Start some DETC research units. Publish, present, collaborate and fly the DETC flag a little in scholarly and professional circles.

That's what put the RA universities on the map and the emerging DETC graduate programs need to play the game too. DETC should be pushing it and insisting that they do. Make it a condition of doctoral program accreditation or something.

 

People look at DETC schools as affordable, accredited online degree programs, as well as vocational programs. DETC schools do not have as much overhead verses the RA counterparts and these savings are beneficial to the students (lower tuition). Read about what DETC is all about on their website (http://www.detc.org).

Honestly, I'm unsure as to when the DETC started accrediting degree granting programs. And yes, they do need to constantly prove themselves, but isn't that a sign of continuing excellence? I wouldn't really view that as a negative and in fact, applaude the DETC.

 

AMU?

 

Am I missing something?

All you mentioned is not NA but PA - Professional Accreditation and in majority of cases RA is prerequisite in order to get PA.

AMA, APA, ABET to name a few are Professional Accrediting boards / associations of already Regionally Accredited Universities and Colleges.

NA Universities and Colleges are not qualified for AMA, APA, ABET, and many other PA accrediting associations/boards.

For example CCU - Cal Coast Univ can't qualify for APA accreditation. (APA - American Psychological Association).

APA accredited PsyD pr Ph.D programs are of the highest recognition.

But if they were RA then they can apply.

No disrespect to NA.
Maybe with future legislations this can be changes but at this time NA seems not to be equal to RA

Learner

 

On CHEA web site you can see that all the national accrediting agencies are:
NATIONAL ACCREDITING ORGANIZATIONS
Accrediting Bureau of Health Education Schools — •
Accrediting Commission of Career Schools and Colleges of Technology — •
Accrediting Commission of the Distance Education and Training Council • •
Accrediting Council for Continuing Education and Training — •
Accrediting Council for Independent Colleges and Schools • •
Association of Advanced Rabbinical and Talmudic Schools Accreditation Commission • •
Association of Theological Schools in the United States and Canada Commission on Accrediting • •
Association for Biblical Higher Education Commission on Accreditation • •
Council on Occupational Education — •
National Accrediting Commission of Cosmetology Arts and Sciences, Inc. — •
Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools Accreditation Commission

The rest is:

SPECIALIZED AND PROFESSIONAL ACCREDITING ORGANIZATIONS:

CHEA
Recognized
Organization
USDE
Recognized
Organization
SPECIALIZED AND PROFESSIONAL ACCREDITING ORGANIZATIONS
AACSB International–The Association to Advance Collegiate Schools of Business •
Accreditation Board for Engineering and Technology, Inc. •
Accreditation Commission for Acupuncture and Oriental Medicine •
Accreditation Council for Pharmacy Education • •
Accreditation Review Commission on Education for the Physician Assistant • —
Accrediting Council on Education in Journalism and Mass Communications •
American Academy for Liberal Education — •
American Association for Marriage and Family Therapy
Commission on Accreditation for Marriage and Family Therapy Education • •
American Association of Family and Consumer Sciences Council for Accreditation • —
American Association of Nurse Anesthetists Council on Accreditation of Nurse Anesthesia Educational Programs • •
American Bar Association Council of the Section of Legal Education and Admissions to the Bar — •
American Board of Funeral Service Education Committee on Accreditation • •
American College of Nurse-Midwives Division of Accreditation — •
American Council for Construction Education Board of Trustees •
American Culinary Federation, Inc. Accrediting Commission •
American Dental Association Commission on Dental Accreditation — •
American Dietetic Association Commission on Accreditation for Dietetics Education • •
American Institute of Certified Planners/ Association of Collegiate Schools of Planning, Planning Accreditation Board • —
American Library Association Committee on Accreditation •
American Occupational Therapy Association Accreditation Council for Occupational Therapy Education • •
American Optometric Association Accreditation Council on Optometric Education • •
American Osteopathic Association Bureau of Professional Education •
American Physical Therapy Association Commission on Accreditation in Physical Therapy Education • •
American Podiatric Medical Association Council on Podiatric Medical Education • •
American Psychological Association Committee on Accreditation • •
American Society for Microbiology American College of Microbiology —
American Society of Landscape Architects Landscape Architectural Accreditation Board •
American Speech-Language-Hearing Association Council on Academic Accreditation in Audiology and Speech-
Language Pathology • •
American Veterinary Medical Association Council on Education • •
Association for Clinical Pastoral Education, Inc., Accreditation Commission — •
Association of Collegiate Business Schools and Programs •
Commission on Accreditation of Allied Health Education Programs •
Recognized Accrediting Organizations (continued)
ACCREDITOR
CHEA
Recognized
Organization
USDE
Recognized
Organization
Commission on Accreditation of Healthcare Management Education • •
Commission on Collegiate Nursing Education • •
Commission on English Language Program Accreditation — •
Commission on Massage Therapy Accreditation — •
Commission on Opticianry Accreditation — •
Council for Accreditation of Counseling and Related Educational Programs • —
Council on Aviation Accreditation • —
Council on Chiropractic Education Commission on Accreditation • •
Council on Education for Public Health — •
Council on Naturopathic Medical Education — •
Council on Rehabilitation Education Commission on Standards and Accreditation •
Council on Social Work Education Division of Standards and Accreditation Commission on Accreditation •
Foundation for Interior Design Education Research •
Joint Review Committee on Education Programs in Radiologic Technology • •
Joint Review Committee on Educational Programs in Nuclear Medicine Technology • •
Liaison Committee on Medical Education — •
Midwifery Education Accreditation Council — •
Montessori Accreditation Council for Teacher Education — •
National Accrediting Agency for Clinical Laboratory Sciences • •
National Architectural Accrediting Board, Inc. —
National Association of Industrial Technology •
National Association of Nurse Practitioners in Women’s Health Council on Accreditation — •
National Association of Schools of Art and Design Commission on Accreditation • •
National Association of Schools of Dance Commission on Accreditation • •
National Association of Schools of Music Commission on Accreditation, Commission on Non-Degree-Granting
Accreditation and Commission on Community/Junior College Accreditation • •
National Association of Schools of Public Affairs and Administration Commission on Peer Review and Accreditation • —
National Association of Schools of Theatre Commission on Accreditation • •
National Council for Accreditation of Teacher Education • •
National Environmental Health Science and Protection Accreditation Council —
National League for Nursing Accrediting Commission, Inc. • •
National Recreation and Park Association/ American Association for Leisure and Recreation Council on Accreditation • —
Society of American Foresters •
Teacher Education Accreditation Council Accreditation Committee • •
United States Conference of Catholic Bishops Commission on Certification and Accreditation

I do see some called by national in their name but they are Specialized and Professional.

Learner

 

Your are correct. My point was they were not RA accredited. So, are these 55 NA/PA accreditation bodies substandard to RA. I'm not an expert, but I would make an educated guess the answer is no. And yes, I do realize there are PA's tied in with RA schools.

Accreditation recognized by CHEA and US DOE should be (and will be in the future) equal in the eyes of transferability.

Discrimination of students and graduates is not right, and will not be tolerated, as seen with the legislation now getting involved in taking legal action to protect students and graduates.

I should also point out there are some RA credits/schools that won't accept other RA credits/schools. So, this federal law will not only protect NA students/graduates, but RA students/graduates as well. It seems pretty logical to me.

It's amazing how we can easily recognize a diploma/degree mill, but then we challenge which accreditation is better. There are accrediation mills out there, but CHEA and US DOE will educate the public on this, as we should do the same. Accreditation recognized by CHEA and US DOE will be the future standard.

 

Maybe on the Federal level but I'm very sceptic.

One time CA state department of Education made laws and declared California Approval was equivalent to Accredited US degrees.

We know that this wasn't followed by any of the 49 states and even in CA as well.

Institutional Freedom ( well not race related or gender) can be argued and not discrimination.
Unless this will be included with gendere, race etc.

Learner

 

Who do you deem as "better universities"? Let me guess, RA schools. Most, if not all RA schools accept each others credits.

So, again it goes back to NA schools being unfairly discriminated.

Has anyone looked into the comparable similarities and/or differences between the RA and NA accreditation process. NA claims they "meet" or "exceed" regional standards.

So, I believe it's not the accreditation process, but the quality and rigor of the school. Accreditation is to ensure the schools meets certain criteria and standards.

 

Looking at two products and determining that one is better than the other is being discriminate, but it is not discrimination. What's more, the conduct that you are complaining about regarding transfer credits will continue long after congress passes (or doesn't pass) the legistlation you champion because the decision to accept or reject credits will still be left up to the individual schools.

DETC credits and degrees are acceptable at most RA, DL, for profit schools. You should be pleased about that.

But if you think you'll be able to railroad DETC acceptance into larger schools with more powerful alumni, then you are delusional.

Just my $0.02

 

Jamie I believe your stance on this issue is badly overstated. Using your logic, you would argue that all CHEA recognized accreditors are equal. This would mean that an ACICS degree is also equal to an RA degree. Have you seen the schools ACICS accredits? If not I encourage you to click here http://www.acics.org/accredited/documents/AccreditedInstitutionsasofJuly05.pdf

Most of these institutions are not even close academically to a RA school. I fail to see how you could possibly find an ITT Tech BSEET on the same level as any RA school. Perhaps attending Bryman College the equivalent to a Community College? Or suggesting that someone with a Bachelors in Business Administration from Catherine Gibbs School...ahem...Gibbs College is ready for a professionally accreditated MBA program. Of course I'm not saying that all DETC or ACICS programs are bad or even substandard, what I'm saying is they do have the need to prove their equivalency. It's not discrimination if the program is lacking academically.

Now someone brings up the fact that schools like UNISA(University of South Africa and UNE(University of New England) are DETC accredited, my understanding of that was more on the basis for financial aid to aid in their drive to recruit more DL students.(of course I could be wrong about that). In reality both are considered to have RA like accreditation in their respected countries.

Jamie you also complain about the perception of DETC schools being substandard, you also must consider the DETC is new at this and for most of its business life had accredited only correspondence course. You also must realize that there are a lot of people in academia and in HR Departments who have adverse views of University of Phoenix, AIU and other similar schools

 

I think that RA is academic and been around for long time.

Now NA for most of the time is vocational, specialized, i.e
You want to be a heardresser, nurse assistant (no disrespect) come to our NA or Specialized Accredited school.

DETC began accrediting degrees such as BA, MA, MS not so long ego. DETC beeng DL accreditor of vocational and later academic
programs may some day get better recognition.

The reality is that most RA are academicly farther and higher than
other non RA programs.

In some countries the devision between vocational and academic begins in secondary school.

Some are qualifications driven others academicly driven.
Research universities with history of produsing academic quality
and minds are far far ahead.

Even within RA there are top 20 and lower tier barerely RA or provisional RA that yet to improove or go out of business.

the same for NA some schools made name and have academic acheivement others are more vocational and produce good specialists, graphic artists, nurse assistance etc.

Learner

 

Sigh,

There is nothing wrong with a degree from ITT infact, I have an AAS and a BS from ITT. And to boot, knew more about reading schematics and how parts fit together than most of the Engineers I worked with that had RA EE degree's. And this was at a Tier 1 computer company. So don't give me this crap that ITT degree's are inferior They aren't. Granted to you can get the degree in three years, but all of your classes except maybe 3 are related to your degree.

Just my two cents, which I am sure I'll get beat up for.