I am deeply concerned for our country.

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by SurfDoctor, Sep 21, 2012.

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  1. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Yes, I agree. I have often mused that our political system, combined with our media, acts as a sort of filter to keep the really good leaders from being elected, or even heard of as you suggest.

    We certainly have a poor set of choices this time.

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2012
  2. ryoder

    ryoder New Member

    Those two wars are Congress's wars, not Bush's. Congress voted on them and approved them. Hillary Clinton voted Yes to go into Iraq and save the Iraqui people from a mass murderer and the influence of outside terrorist agents.
     
  3. ryoder

    ryoder New Member

    Rich I do understand macroeconomics and I am afraid of the consequences of our massive debt. I studied macro and micro in my BSBA, MBA, and as part of my PhD.

     
  4. Maxwell_Smart

    Maxwell_Smart Active Member

    Blaming the puppets in Government for everything is like blaming the waiter at a bad restaurant for the terrible food and collapsing ceiling. The waiter might be bad himself, sure, but the people in the back that you never see who really control the place are the ones making the restaurant awful. But as long as grown adults continue to think like children and believe in the red herring fantasy of the left-right/Republican-Democrat paradigm the way kids believe in the story lines of "pro wrestling", they'll keep blaming the waiter and never even come across the very idea of seeking out the owners and taking them to task. The Ron/Rand fallout was one of the most hilarious and pitiful things I've seen in a while, because so many otherwise intelligent adults fell for it like complete rubes, and are so stretched from it that they refuse to let go and are keeping up hope for alternative high-ranking offices like it's even a real possibility, smh. It's a damn, damn shame.

    Although, I'll say that "Bush blame" is not that unwarranted since it's a fact that the Bush family has had very strong controlling interests in Government, Finance, Military, and Energy for quite a long time (a few generations, in fact). Other than that, the head offices of Government are nothing more than the jobs of a spokesperson, so when people attribute any real power to the position the naivety really amuses me but saddens me, because people--North Americans and citizens of the UK in particular--are so easily fooled by flashy presentations and well-written, well-delivered speeches, and the constantly lying media that lies so often they can't even keep up with their own story-telling anymore.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2012
  5. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    It's sad that this kind of thing always devolves into partisan finger-pointing when the issues are actually much bigger than any one leader or even one political party. Many are to blame for this and the avarice runs deep and wide.


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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2012
  6. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    The debt is not the issue, it's the gross expansion of the money supply that causes the concern. With that many more dollars being created, severe inflation is a distinct possibility. The QE's were not a just a few more dollars, but a huge increase in created money. Dr. Wiedemer believes that we will begin to see the first signs of inflation in the next year or two, and it will increase from there. We will find out soon enough.
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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 22, 2012
  7. AUTiger00

    AUTiger00 New Member

    I question anyone who puts this on the House (or the Senate for that matter) because it demonstrates that they don't have a firm understanding of how our government works. Those officials are elected to represent their particular state's interests, not those of the nation as a whole. You don't like the congressman from Wisconsin? If you're not from Wisconsin then tough shit. S/he doesn't owe you anything, s/he doesn't represent you.
    This entire situation can be laid at the feet of Obama and his party for refusing to give at all, resulting in - surprise, surprise- Republicans refusing to give at all. Someone needs to step up and rise above political posturing. I think Obama is too tarnished to do that and the only real option is to get someone new in there. I'm not saying Romney will do any better, but we need a change.
    Oh, and inflation is a certainty not a probability with the way we print money.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 23, 2012
  8. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    Well yes unless it is backed by something valuable like gold.

    You need to do a little more research. Try to be a little less biased and more open minded.

    Printing money is not addressing the underlying problems. So creating inflation for no reason does hurt.

    This kind of thinking is plain nuts

    There's a fair argument that the stimulus did not help and actually made things worse. It's fairly obvious the stimulus went to payback political votes and not to create jobs.

    This is one of the big problems. The people with the money are the ones that take risk and create jobs. As long as they sit on the sidelines there will be no growth. You cannot force them to take risk. Ask yourself why the people with the money are sitting on it. Do some research. Two big reasons are uncertainty about taxes and Obama care.
     
  9. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    Wow you are either so biased and partisan it is blinding you or you are incredibly misinformed about politics and government.

    In 2006 the Democrats took both the House and Senate. The Republicans took back the House in 2010. So the Democrats held both the Senate and House for the last two years under Bush and the first two years under Obama. Any budget has to be passed by both the Senate and House.

    April 29, 2009 was the last time the Senate passed a budget and the last time the Majority in the Senate brought their own budget to the floor. The Republican House is passing budgets but the Senate is not approving them nor is the Senate offering their own budget or negotiating on the Republican's budgets. This is a political maneuver to throw blame the Republicans.

    The Senate voted 97 to 0 to reject President Obama's FY2012 budget. The House voted 414 to 0 to reject President Obama's FY2013 budget. The president's budgets are so ridiculous not even a single Democrat in either the House or Senate will vote for them.

    I can't stand either party but lets keep the facts straight.


    Sources:
    CNN.com - America Votes 2006 - Midterm Elections
    Senate, House, Governor Races - Election Center 2010 - Elections & Politics from CNN.com
    Timeline Of Senate Democrats
    President's budget sinks, 97-0 - The Hill - covering Congress, Politics, Political Campaigns and Capitol Hill | TheHill.com
     
  10. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    That's a fair statement although the president can play a role in bringing the parties together to get a budget passed if he chooses to do so.

    The wars were/are a huge mistake. Bush screwed up on that one. I am so tire of being the world's unpaid police force and welfare daddy.
     
  11. BobbyJim

    BobbyJim New Member

    Uncharted waters?

    “The truth, however, is that nobody on the committee, nor on our staffs at the Board of Governors and the 12 Banks, really knows what is holding back the economy. Nobody really knows what will work to get the economy back on course. And nobody—in fact, no central bank anywhere on the planet—has the experience of successfully navigating a return home from the place in which we now find ourselves. No central bank—not, at least, the Federal Reserve—has ever been on this cruise before.” We Are Sailing Deeper Into Uncharted Waters | RealClearPolitics

    :irked:Not too sure, but to me the future looks a bit like past ‘stagflation’ of the 1970s.
     
  12. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    I agree. Dr. Wiedemer seems to think that it will be similar but quite a bit worse.
     
  13. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Yes, protecting our interests is one thing, but what we do is nuts. Especially going into such debt to do so. We are no longer the rich superpower we used to be.

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 23, 2012
  14. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Yes, the underlying fundamentals are not in place for an economic recovery. That's why the QE's are not doing what they wanted for us. Like I said before, it's like pouring gas on a campfire that has run out of wood to burn. You get a flash, but it can not start the fire back up. The QE's are just creating a flash and the danger of devastating inflation is increasing. Dr. Wiedemer believes it's too late to avoid, that we have already gone too far.

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    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 23, 2012
  15. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    It doesn't matter who is in office. I've said it before and I'll say it again; anyone should be able to see that there has been a carefully guided program to place the average person in this dire position we're in now, and it's been going on for longer than most of us have been alive. The Government's job has become one of maintaining that course for its own benefit, not fixing the issues of the average person. They don't care about us at all, and they're doing nothing to help us but window-dressing.

    Politics, especially at the State and Federal level, are just a dog and pony show. Snap out of the matrix, stop, think, and realize that you're having the same false hope model every 4 years only to repeat it again, and it repeats regardless if the winner is Republican or Democrat. Government at this point doesn't need reform, it needs overthrowing and re-establishment because they ignore the Constitution outright and blatantly, and we should no longer tolerate it. Our Government is simply a lying, thieving, inept, inefficient, rogue organization that needs to be stopped and put under new management, but first the people controlling it whose names we don't know as publicly as the average politician, have to be taken out.

    Anyone who thinks these clowns will fix the problems they've created, and that by going into a booth and pulling a lever you have even a modicum of control over it, is kidding themselves. Unfortunately, most Americans are kidding themselves.
     
  16. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member

    And who would we have replace the existing government after the current one is overthrown?
     
  17. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    I recommend SurfDoctor as supreme dictator.
     
  18. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Preferably no one.
     
  19. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    Every politician left who has a strong record of voting and supporting on the side of the Constitution, and those who've specifically expressed public push back against bills and executive orders that are diametrically opposed to the Constitution. That number probably won't be large at this point because corruption is basically the routine practice of Government today, but it will be a good start, and certainly give us better hope than the farce currently installed.
     
  20. Maxwell_Smart

    Maxwell_Smart Active Member

    @LearningAddict

    The only problem with that is, how do we know that based on that record they're truly genuine? I offer up the Ron/Rand fiasco again.

    I think we can both agree that the current Government cannot work and has to be terminated. It's just too corrupt to redeem itself at this point. But I think the roadblock is one of human nature more than anything. Lots of Governments start out well enough with good enough intentions. However, some might argue that even in its heyday and infancy America was corrupt and indifferent to its Constitutional concept when you consider the mass slaughter and enslavement of Natives and Black Africans. You also have to look at the lure of money and power eventually corrupting a new regime.

    So my point is, even if a new outfit did a better and honest job during our lifetime, it's bound to circle back to what we have now after we're all gone. But what I can't stop playing in my mind is how the founders said in direct and certain terms all of the mistakes that--if made--would destroy this country, and dammit our so-called leaders have made every single one of them and then some, and done so intentionally and without care about their impact whatsoever.
     

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