Ccu

I sure hope so too. I am half done the MBA but am still in no hurry. My delay is to have the DBA accredited, even if I have to wait the maximum 4 more years. I have to save enough courses to do my minimum 2 per year.

 

Hi Dennis - I don't think anything is 100% about anything except, as they say, "death and taxes". Aspen, although always highly regarded, did not get approved on its first try to achieve the then NHSC accreditation. I am not saying CCU will or won't get approved at the June meeting. I haven't a clue. I am just by nature cautious (makes you wonder how I got involved in DL so early doesn't it ) so when I saw your 100% I had to comment. I have seen more than one "sure thing" be deferred on their first try. Of course I have also seen schools make it through on their first try. Best to just wait and see what happens!

Regards,
Mary A

 

I, for one, can’t understand how the DETC can completely and confidently evaluate a school that recently made significant alterations to their programs and procedures (solely to meet DETC requirements) and has yet to graduate a single student that fully adhered to all the new requirements.

Aren’t the majority of courses in progress and the majority of students enrolled in California Coast University using non-compliant methodology? Isn’t the inability to assess outcomes or evaluate a school’s full compliance to the requirements somewhat troubling? Shouldn’t the DETC be concerned that many students could possibly graduate from a DETC school without having gone through a program (or possibly even a single course) that adhered to their requirements? Shouldn’t other DETC accredited schools be concerned about all of this as well?

 

I don't know how much coursework had to change other than requiring some proctored exams, which are not necessarily that common at R/A schools.

The faculty all have better than average doctorates and the courses are quite comprehensive.

I don't think the transition would have been very remarkable.

The first graduates of any newly accredited program entered an unaccredited program. big duh!

 

I don’t have any hard evidence (such as empirical studies) to prove it, but years of observation lead me to believe that if a RA school requires examinations as part of a course (and especially if it is the sole means of assessment, or if the exams consist of only multiple choice questions), then the majority of RA schools require that the exam be proctored. I believe that unproctored open-book multiple-choice exams are extremely rare. I also believe that it is not (with a few exceptions, such as the student having to first do a series of mathematical calculations in order to determine the correct answer) a valid means of assessing knowledge and comprehension. It seems that the DETC agrees with me.

However comprehensive the courses may be, they do not meet the requirements of the DETC. The fact remains; assuming CCU receives accreditation soon, many students will earn a DETC accredited degree although they followed a program of study that was unaccreditable.

No one has disputed this fact. However, there are accreditors that insist a school be functioning adhering to accreditation requirements for a prescribed amount of time (some even requiring a graduating class) before the school is granted full accreditation. In fact, in contrast to the DETC, the regional accreditors employ the designation “candidate” for this reason (among others).

If CCU is granted accreditation this June, the message will be that the DETC places a higher value on theory than it does on practice.

 

The DETC always has to prove itself more stringent than R/A schools.

I don't believe that the majority of R/A DL programs require proctored exams. I haven't seen one. I went through this discussion not long ago.

 

Always? I have no idea what you mean by that, but I don't see how you could possibly substantiate this statement.

It wasn't much of a discussion. Moreover, I don't recall anyone agreeing with you. In fact, in all my years of participating in distance learning discussions, I don't remember anyone asserting that multiple-choice exams from regionally accredited schools are rarely proctored. There are, however, numerous discussions on how to procure a proctor and the logistics of having exams invigilated.

Perhaps we should conduct one of DegreeInfo's informal polls.

 

I suppose if we think hard enough and work our brains to mutton, there must be something wrong with CCU becoming accredited and recognized... it's the school and it's programs, ...no, it's CCU's curriculum financing, ...no, it's CCU's testing policies, ...no, it's the State approval process, ...no, it's the accreditor. It's not all of the above, but possibly none of the above (for multiple choice fans). Fascinating...

 

Then again, without having to think or work our brains much at all, rather than civilly discussing schools and accreditation procedures or countering any arguments presented, we could choose instead to mock and denigrate any discussion of these legitimate issues and those who wish to discuss them.

Hmmm… I wonder who would benefit most from this kind of “sweep it all under the rug” perspective.

 

And your response contains not a hint of mockery but is instead the paragon of objectivity and civil discourse? Hypocrisy knows no bounds...

 

Almost every school I checked out required proctored exams. I would guess that about 1 in 10 did not.

Personally, I don't see a whole lot of difference between proctored and unproctored open-book multiple choice exams. Apart from affirming that the correct person is taking the test, what exactly does the proctor do?
But do you know what is really funny? The same DETC zealots that thrust forth the proctoring (open-book multiple choice okay) requirement as proof of DETC superiority, lambast degrees earned from one of the big three through tests that are proctored (id required and usually videotaped); that do not allow any use of books or notes; and that, because of the way they are normed, represent a standard of achievement consistent with a (hypothetically) perfectly average school.

Tony

 

My post simply took your tactics to an extreme, albeit quite civilly and eloquently. Moreover, you confuse parody with hypocrisy.

Bear in mind that I am advocating discussion of the issues, while you are simply advocating turning a blind eye towards anything that might adversely impact your alma mater. As such, whose objectivity and hypocrisy is suspect?

‘Twas not I who first mocked and denigrated; I simply noted and pointed out who did. Why don’t you stick to a discussion of the issues rather than (for the second time) attacking the messenger?

 

I seem to remember almost every unaccredited school get slammed until the day it is accredited. Same naysayers - same recycled crap. If Gus had ever actually attended an R/A school he would realize that they aren't necessarily that demanding.

 

I have argued that most unaccredited schools are degree mills. I give reasons and specific examples supporting my assertions. I've given many reasons why I believe that KWU and KU are degree mills, for example. I don't remember you EVER making any counter arguments as to why these are actually good schools. The only argument that you seem to embrace are ad hominums.

 

Nah. I continued to slam quite a few schools even after they had been accredited, especially if the accreditor just happened to ignore significant ethical lapses on the part of the school (such as claiming bogus accreditation) as the DETC has done.

Are you referring to the fact that none of the issues raised are refuted or the wherewithal to even offer a relevant comment is notably absent, but the denigration of the poster and the disparagement of the concept that these ideas should even be discussed are, once again, attacked?

What proof do you offer to that I have never attended a RA school (I am on record as stating I have)? Never mind. Interestingly, Dennis, I agree with you. I don’t believe that RA schools are that demanding. Perhaps that is why I am of the opinion that no one with half a brain would choose an unaccredited school whose only advantage was a program that required significantly less rigor than that offered from a legitimately accredited school.

 

1. Some people have asked the same question of NCA, many times.

2. What poster have I denigrated? Usually I respond in kind.

3. We can fix that in a hurry - what schools did you attend?

4. I have no problem with rigor - that's why I enrolled at CCU instead of other business programs. My intention when enrolling at CCU was to obtain an accredited MBA and an accredited DBA and step one will come true in 10 or so days. I have 4 years left for step two.

 

It seems that you are now agreeing with me (which is tantamount to disagreeing with you).

Not really Dennis. You denigrate frequently and indiscriminately (well, maybe not so indiscriminately). Moreover, the record will amply demonstrate that you are usually the instigator.

Not THAT again; don’t you get tired of acting so unintelligently solely to impress your bobblehead buddies? It was you who stated categorically that I had not attended any regionally accredited schools. The burden of proof, therefore, is on you.

I’m sorry Dennis, I’m laughing so hard that I am unable to formulate an appropriate response. Rigor? You consider untimed unproctored open-book multiple-choice exams in which even the chapter where the answer can be found is provided to be rigorous?

• 
  BWA-HA-HA-HA!!!

I am fairly certain that everyone on this forum who has really had to study for an exam (and that includes pretty much everyone who has attended a legitimate school) is laughing their asses off at your latest cockamamie pronouncement.

Even if CCU is granted DETC accreditation, the truth is that the program of study you followed did not adhere to DETC accreditation standards. Moreover, the issue of whether or not your DBA (IF and when you ever receive it—I have no doubts you will rise to the challenge of a doctoral program so rigorous that a dissertation is not required) is moot, because you are on record as stating that you will misrepresent the degree in the event the school does not achieve accreditation (or even if it does).

Tell us, Dennis; how will you represent your DBA IF the DETC approves doctoral programs with the proviso that it must require a dissertation, but you are granted an exemption from that requirement because you are already subscribed to an unaccredited program?

 

I'd be happier than a pig in poo. Who am I to question the wisdom of the powers that be? After all I am a follower, not a leader. I believe the correct form would be Dennis Ruhl DBA, although Dr. Dennis Ruhl BA BCom MBA DBA would look nice on a business card.

 

I have this funny feeling that you are destined for a BIG disappointment.

 

Gus - do you think that maybe I giggle a bit when I post some of this stuff?