UT (Tennessee) ranks most LGBTQ+ unfriendly school

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by chrisjm18, Aug 28, 2022.

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  1. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    Yes. Everyone should be loved. However, "Trans Women," who are actually men and boys should be discriminated right out of competing with women and girls in every shape, form, and fashion.
     
  2. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    Trans women are women. Every medical professional / MD will confirm that.
    The brain structures of trans women are female.
    Dozens of scientific papers will tell you the same.
    Look up the term "gender dimorphic nucleus".
    Post-operative and with a legal gender marker change, that woman should have as much right to compete with women as every other woman.
    The law has to treat people in similar situations with similar characteristics in a same manner, after all.
    That's where my input in the discussion stops. I'm not into a heated discussion about this topic. Trans women are women, that's all there is to say.
    Have a wonderful evening, Charles.
    I hope for you that you don't get banned by the mods or server, like last time. Would be sad to see you go for something you have in your own control (decency).
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2022
  3. Jonathan Whatley

    Jonathan Whatley Well-Known Member

    A considerable number of people have anatomies or chromosomes or combinations of anatomy and chromosomes that don't correspond with a strict gender binary. These include that people have internal anatomy or chromosomes inconsistent with a binary assignment based on their external anatomy, or that they have external anatomy that's not unambiguously assignable to one binary condition or the other. Similarly, a considerable number people have gender identities that don't correspond with the binary gender assignments made with the limited information available at birth.
     
    SteveFoerster likes this.
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Indeed. Quote from my Sudanese-Canadian EX-barber:
    "Why don't we just kill Gays, like we do in Africa?" - At that moment, he became my ex-barber -- although it had been coming for a while.
     
  5. Garp

    Garp Well-Known Member

    I don't believe this is accurate. There was a study (post mortem) giving indications of abnormalities. To my knowledge there is nothing truly definitive. It in fact mimics other body distortion disorders where people believe they have been born with too many limbs and so on. They will go to great lengths to be whole by causing amputation (doctors are reluctant to amputate healthy limbs). They feel suicidal and depressed. One person after amputation reported being whole and happy.

    Regardless, counseling trans people (at least older ones) and those wishing amputation does little to help change their mind. Where problems occur is interfering in the progression and emotional/mental maturing of children when they are still developing and making chemical and surgical decisions that cannot be fully reversed. There have been some unfortunate cases.

    The main thing is in terms of fully developed/mature adults, what does it matter to you. Treat people with dignity and respect. Being nasty to them doesn't do anything to help them and makes you a poor excuse for a human being (note not saying you TeacherBelgium, just a general "you").
     
    Charles Fout likes this.
  6. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    This conversation is perhaps political, so I will refrain from further commentary until after Thanksgiving. To date, I am pleased with my self-discipline in abstaining from political commentary.

    TeacherBelgium, we do not have to agree on anything. I wish you a wonderful night tonight and every other night. I know this surprises many here, perhaps because you may see me as a "Semi - fascist and such. However, I work on being a role model every day. I am a Chief Petty Officer (Retired), Black Belt, and most of all a Christian (Roman Catholic). I am obligated to be a role model. Disagreeing with you, and perhaps everyone else on this planet does not equate to not treating people with decency. The operators of this platform are free and welcome to banish me at any time for any reason. I don't think they have any intention of "Thought Policing" me Into accepting and praising what so many of know to be fundamentally not true.
     
  7. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    As a serious student of fashion, I get to see quite a few pics of models. That's one of the perks, I guess. :) Charles, I'd like you to take a look at this article:
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2021/07/20/sports-illustrated-transgender-swimsuit/

    Dude, you telling me this beautiful woman (Leyna Bloom), a Sports Illustrated swimsuit model, is a MAN? If so, the first thing you need is new glasses - and we'll see how it goes from there.

    Trans models are doing just fine, thank you. These 13 women (and others) are adding something new - and special - to the industry: I celebrate them -and wish them every happiness. https://www.scmp.com/magazines/style/celebrity/article/3138896/trans-pride-13-transgender-models-shaking-fashion-ines
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2022
  8. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    Christianity says you have to love people, not condemn them.
    So maybe not a perfect model after all.

    Being trans is not something one chooses for fun and games (sadly I can know. I'm mtf, been hormonally transitioning ( and recently also socially) since I'm 20 and still not accepted by family).

    I don't think you know how much damage you do with your ignorance, Charles.
    It's because of people with your mindset that I hid in fear until I was almost 20.
    Now at 26 I'm only truly starting to be myself.
    Had I had a better support system I could have done this during puberty and my life would have been easier.

    Never judge that which you don't know.

    I had planned to not reveal it on this forum but for people such as yourself it's good to make you see the other side of the medal once in a while.
     
  9. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    Personally I don't agree with your take on puberty blockers.
    I wish I would have had access to them when I went through puberty, but my parents were not open-minded.
    Trans teens who medically transition from mtf very very very very rarely regret later on.
    I knew as a child and these feelings never went away, despite my parents having tried to reprimand me for it at that time.
    Screenings are thorough before you are prescribed hormones.
    I had to see a psychiatrist for 6 months to rule out any abnormalities (and I was already 20 at that time) before they were willing to prescribe HRT.
    It's not like they just hand it to you. They do serious checks on you before medical intervention is accepted.
     
  10. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    I wholeheartedly agree.
    Thank you for being such an open-minded person.
    I remember how positive you reacted about my own situation when I told you two years ago.
    You were one of the first people here I came out to.
    Steve Levicoff was also lovely in his acceptance which surprised me at that time when I told him since I had thought him to be rather pessimistic.
    I miss him. He added something to this board.

    By the way:
    I would like to add Jenna Talackova to your top so much of trans models.
    She was one of my role models at that time (2012).
    She was the first trans model to compete in the Miss Universe pageant.
    Acceptance was so much less than now even 10 years ago.
    I remember Barbara Walters asking her about her genitals when she was interviewing her.
    That would be so out of the question (fortunately) now.
    Donald Trump who was the owner of the Miss Univere Canada pageant also constantly made it about her genitals until Gloria Alred (lovely woman!) put him in his place by asking about his genitals (obviously Trump being Trump bragged about what he was packing).
    We have come so far over the last 10 years in terms of people finally being more sensitive to scientific findings and how that relates to trans people.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2022
    Johann likes this.
  11. Garp

    Garp Well-Known Member

    I am glad you have found a path that is making you feel happier, more functional, and healthy, and that there are guardrails in place.

    I just don't think it is reasonable to allow children who can't smoke, drink, or make other decisions (whose pre frontal cortex isn't even developed) to make life altering decisions that have physical and mental consequences. In my mind, better to give them counseling that helps them explore who they are, develop confidence, and create a safe and tolerant environment. As adults they can make the decision to transition.

    Here is a NY Post article on de transitioning and reason for caution (especially with children).

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/nypost.com/2022/06/18/detransitioned-teens-explain-why-they-regret-changing-genders/amp/
     
  12. Garp

    Garp Well-Known Member

    Steve is part of the LGBTQI community as you are probably aware. According to some reports, there are two Steves. One is a perfectly reasonable and nice guy (who it has been noted is nothing like his online persona). There are few people here who have met him. The other is a typical Social Media troll who is rude, condescending, demeaning and full of hyperbole in his assessments. The second Steve is the one that got in trouble repeatedly here. I am glad he was kind and understanding (you apparently came in contact with the first Steve).
     
  13. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    The problem is that you would be making trans children suicidal by forcing them through a assigned-at-birth sex puberty.
    It's much better to prevent the development of secondary sex characteristcs associated with said assigned-at-birth sex than having to reverse that damage later on.
    The better a trans person is able to pass (look like a cis person of the identified sex) , the better the chances for employment, relationships etc.
    Facial feminization surgery, laser hair removal, voice training is all very expensive and not covered by insurance. In fact, the unemployment rate amongst trans people is so high that most would not be able to afford it without proper insurance in place or being blessed to transition early in life (12-14 y.o.).

    The few regretters (while unfortunate, less than 2% overall) are not worth gatekeeping all the people who do benefit from medical intervention.
    I have never once regretted a single thing in the 6 years since I sought help. If there is anything I regret, it's not starting younger (but I couldn't since parents were unsupportive).
     
  14. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

    Steve Levicoff.
    He was extremely sympathetic and sweet when I told him.
    I was surprised because in my DMs he was completely different than he would act publicly.
    Yes, I know Steve is a cis gay male.
    He acts tough but when it comes to showing understanding and sympathy when it matters, he is a really nice person.

    I have only had 1 person who frequents this site finding out about my background and being rather negative about something that was totally irrelevant to my background:
    That person came across my Reddit and knew it was me and his problem was with me discussing NSFW (not safe for work stuff) on my Reddit because he believed it could ruin my career.
    Other people I told on here were very kind and understanding and sticked with the topic.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2022
  15. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Last edited: Aug 30, 2022
  16. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Well-Known Member

  17. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    Not to mention, "bi erasure" is a thing. If you're cis and currently in a relationship with a cis person of the opposite gender, you're gay. Same gender, you're straight. Even when you switch back and forth for successive relationships. I've heard many times that this mindset often exists even within the LGB(T) community.
     
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  18. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    :eek:
     
  19. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    Please recall my first words in this conversation - "I say to love everyone. Let God sort it out." For me that's universal. To this point, I was unaware you are in transition.
    I sincerely pray that it is impossible for the thoughts I express, here and elsewhere, to cause harm to anyone.
    I may have more insight into the subject matter than you can imagine.
    I assume you are not an athlete competing against women and/or girls. Perhaps I should not have introduced that controversy to this discussion.
    The fact remains, that girls and women are cheated when trans athletes are allowed to compete against them.

    I know you are not seeking my wisdom but, I'm taking an opportunity to share a thought: CONGRATULATIONS! on becoming yourself.
    Never allow my thoughts or the thoughts of anyone else to intrude on your happiness.

    Years ago during my work in Human Resources Management, so long ago, my office was called the Personnel Office, there was a young woman, a dissident. I have a soft spot for dissidents. She was a phenomenal worker but, she was always at odds with her own management and coworkers. Hours before this conversation, I was thinking about her Just remembering her put a broad smile across my face. Her supervisor became angriest when this young woman decorated her workspace (which was absolutely allowed) with a big printout (very nice font, by the way) of Isaiah 54-17

    "No weapon that is formed against thee shall prosper;"
    Neither my office nor the lawyers would support management's demand that she take it down.

    Now, I pray that my words and the words of anyone cause you no harm.
     
  20. Garp

    Garp Well-Known Member

    The LGBTQ community is certainly not all together on this and there has been tension. Some Gay and Lesbian people feel that Trans people don't belong in their group and have ruined it by distracting and sucking all the air out of the room. One said it distracts for Lesbian and Gay issues and the movement and culture. Other LG people don't feel that bisexual people belong (posers who haven't really come out). I heard a Lesbian in her 20s going off loudly about bisexuals. And of course there are Lesbian Feminists who don't care what Trans people do but disagree that they are actually women (and of course others feel the same way such as Straight feminists, etc).

    In the end you have to not worry about what others think and what box everyone wants to put you in. You do you (be you).
     
    Charles Fout likes this.

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