UoP vs. CCU

"I'm not convinced that the University of Phoenix is the bottom of the barrel....Personally, I think that Phoenix isn't nearly as bad as its critics allege, but it's not without problems either."

Bill,
Have you ever taken any classes at UoP?

 

I am currently in a doctorial program with graduates from the UOP MBA and MAOM programs. I find their work to be as good or better as any of the other students in the program.

 

I received my BSBM at Phoenix (public knowledge) and I now teach there (also public knowledge).

Is Phoenix perfect? No. But then neiter were any of the other schools I went to. I have heard horror stories re: Phoenix. But then, I was surprised by my sister-in-law's tale of a situation she encountered in her very first semester at SJSU. Also, there were issues at IIT, Chicago Circle, etc.

Phoenix may not be perfect. Some of the faculty might want to consider succeding elsewhere. However, one finds these issues in every organization.

 

tried to find what tier the UoP is in, but found that it wasn't even listed.

UoP is Tier 3

 

UoP vs. KW

My husband just got his degree with UoP. I'm getting my degree with KW. The reason I went with KW is that UoP won't recognize my 2 yr. degree becuase I got it over 10 years ago. Sad fact is, that while UoP is thought to be a "legit" distance learning school and is gaining wider acceptance, the requirements for the actual classes (time spent on text and actual study) was the same or less than KW. Same text in many cases! At UoP, you can get class credit for just logging in and chatting! Very few tests, and papers get a passing grade no matter what they look like. And also, sadly, if you push UoP (my husband did) they'll give you the same "experiential credit" that KW does, they just make you pay them to allow you to use it. As far as the quality of the education is concerened, I'd put KW on a par with UoP, yet many of you will disagree. I put less stock in accreditation, as my employer (and my husband's) won't pay for KW, but they will recognize it. Talk about a double standard.....

 

Re: UoP vs. KW

U of P does not offer a BS/BA for 5-7 classes and is accredited. This puts K-W clearly in the degree mill category.

 

UoP

Trust me, when my husband got done detailing page after page of "employer facilitated training" that was mostly bogus, UoP bent over and gave him the credit (at a cost). That bogus info wiped out about 30 credits. How legit is that? Doesn't that really amount to what KW is offering by allowing experiential credit up front. If UoP will allow completion of a form to document bogus training, and then not follow up to determine if it is valid, then charge you to allow you to use the "bogus" credits, aren't they even worse????

 

Welcome

Rebecca:

Welcome

I hear you and I concur! I have a fellow with whom I work with who was amazed by the courses I had to take at K-W; he is a U of P student. Not only were the courses more difficult, the work put towards was signifigantly more then he had to undertake. He made me aware that his grade was group based - he had his part to do - but that was it. In my case, all the course work was entirely up to me.

There is much prejudice on this board for K-W. The "RA Gang", do not understand that the typical student of K-W already has a AA Degree, and many years of work experience.

Keep up the good work - and do not be discouraged.

 

Re: UoP

It is not the same for a number of reasons.
1. K-W does not publish graduation requirements. The credit for life experience from K-W is meaningless because you can't use it to satisfy any requirements because they don't have any graduation requirements. What K-W has is a marketing department that "negotiates" the graduation requirements for each individual degree. In this context negotiates has a meaning very close to "scams".
2. K-W won't admit students from their home state. This is probably the strongest sign of a degree mill that there is.
3. If the above is the strongest general sign of a degree mill then this is a close second. K-W has moved their mailing address to different jurisdictions not just once but they're in their fourth state! This is another very strong sign of a degree mill. UoP was so embarassed by their ONE move when they moved the whole office not just the mailing address, that they threatened to sue Dr. John Bear for mentioning it. K-W has done this THREE times and each time it was to avoid prosecution for being an illegal school. UoP moved to try and position themselves more favorably for accreditation which they subsequently received.
4. UoP is accredited so the credential will value. K-W is unaccredited and the degree will be close to useless.
5. K-W degrees are illegal in some states.

Kennedy-Western is a degree mill. University of Phoenix is not a degree mill. This is a huge difference.

 

Re: UoP vs. KW

Maybe you should look into an Excelsior degree. In my case they accepted credits from other schools that ranged in age up to 30 years.

My Excelsior degree was low cost because I took advantage of California Community College and Cal State University courses, and CLEP.

Ian Anderson
BS - Regents/Excelsior
MS - CSUDH

 

Rebecca: "Trust me, when my husband got done detailing page after page of "employer facilitated training" that was mostly bogus, UoP bent over and gave him the credit (at a cost). That bogus info wiped out about 30 credits."

John: This is mind-boggling. You state that your husband fabricated a lengthy resume, and the University of Phoenix gave him 30 semester units for his fake claims, without checking them.

No, actually, I don't trust you, Rebecca. But my mind, often boggled, is open. So let's take it one step further, Rebecca. Send me proof. I have kept people's confidences, absolutely, for 30 years in this field. I will keep yours and your husband's. If what you say is really true, I will report it here, and in my books, and apologize profusely for not trusting you. If you'd rather not entrust the information to me, I can suggest one or more disinterested 3rd parties with credential evaluation services, or you could find one of your own. I'll gladly pay all costs of making copies and of postage. Contact me privately for discussion of logistics. [email protected]

John Bear
http://circledance.tripod.com

 

Re: Welcome

What courses? Are you suggesting that K-WU students actually take courses? Or do they conduct independent study under the supervision of a mentor? There is a whale of a difference there. I see absolutely no evidence of courses being conducted at K-WU.

The K-WU bachelor's is awarded for 5 book reports and a term paper, no matter how much or how little experience you have, or the number of credits you transfer into the program. This simply isn't a bachelor's degree. It's more like a coupon good towards the purchase of another, higher degree from this credential bazaar.

Just read the posts on the K-WU "Pub." I was amazed at the number of people working on bachelor's degrees (or, at least, that's what Kennedy-Western calls the pieces of paper they print). It seemed that many or most were doing so with the intent of going on to another program at K-WU.

I've played golf for 12 years. I'm a 7 handicap. I've never had a hole-in-one (despite many, many eagles). Oh, except the time when I hit the blue ball on the orange carpet, past the windmill, down the ramp, through the clown's mouth, and into the hole. A hole-in-one? Sure. Golf? Hardly. Get it?

 

UoP like KWU? Now, that's funny!

I'll be very curious to see if you can produce proof of this claim. As a UoP graduate, my experience with their "prior learning assessment" was quite the contrary: I had quite a bit of training and professional experience but I could not match this to their course requirements, therefore my academic advisor suggested not to pursue this... unless I wanted to waste my time and money.

For UoP to grant credit for prior learning you need to assemble a portfolio of your experience and map it to a UoP course and provide the following documentation (from the student web site):

. Proof of successful completion of the course, such as an original certificate
. Verification of course length in clock hours
. A course description and/or syllabus which demonstrates in an acceptable level of detail that the course content is college level
. Information on the professional or sponsoring agency
. Original certificate
. Original training transcript
. Unaccredited transcript
. Copy of government document, such as a license. However, originals must be available upon request by the Prior Learning Assessment Center.

I am surprised to see they accept "unaccredited transcripts" as supporting evidence, but then I guess it does not matter where or how you acquired knowledge, as long as you can provide proof and map it to a UoP credit course.

True. At UoP Online you are required to login at least 5 days per week. However, you must also contribute something of substance to the class for it to count towards participation. That is in addition to the assignments, group projects and final papers/exams/projects. Participation usually accounted for 20-25% of the grade.

Easy for you to say... you are the one going for the unaccredited degree. I can't tell if KW is more "rigorous" than UoP, but frankly, who cares? KWU is not accredited while UoP is... and that is the bottom line. A bachelor's at UoP requires 123 credits vs. 5-7 courses at KWU? Oh yeah, I forgot the 75+ page "thesis." Give me a break!

It's your decision; I hope you understand what you are doing.

 

Re: U.S. News & World Report

For once, you are correct! ;-)

UoP, just like Capella, is not ranked because the majority of the students are "non-traditional." From the US New & World Report website:

 

Ice ...

Rich:

Book Reports for classes, come on. This is the way it works, you register for a course, you get the sylabus, order the text and workbook. Follow sylabus, meaning, reading entire text, completing the workbook. You take a practice exam, then the final (on-line testing, or if prefer proctored). Again you may have to complete 5 to ... I've witnessessed up to nine classes. At the BS level a proposal and a 75 page final paper must be written. At the graduate level a proposal and a 100+ thesis. The school is upfront about what classes are offered and the final project. AGAIN, the school caters to the mature student, who must have a AA degree, or, complete a series of tests to demonstrate they have the learning at a minimal of a AA degree. If the tests are causing difficulty, remedial courses are required. The school is not accrdited, nor have they claimed to be, nor have they stated they are on-par or better. The school is what it is a legally existing state liscenced post secondary educational institution. ... Just think if K-W was not around you would be bored because you'd have no school or set of students to bash around. I'd better go put some ice on my bruses.

 

Re: UoP like KWU? Now, that's funny!

I too will be very curious and waiting anxiously. We will see if Rebecca is any better than RJT. RJT has made numerous grandiose claims about K-W and he hasn't ever backed up a single one. His credibility couldn't be any worse with me. Rebecca is way up there in credibility compared to RJT. She has the credibility of at least a complete stranger.

BTW Rebecca, if you choose to go the private route that John Bear has made an option then it would really boost your credibility to at least let everyone know that. Otherwise, you're going to be joining RJT in the credibility cellar. Let me say this though. If you do surprise me and provide the requested information then you will be doing the education establishment a great service and you'll also get a most sincere apology from me for disbelieving you.

 

Re: Ice ...

Okay, 5 open-book exams and a term paper. Thanks for the correction.

 

Rebecca, Where Are You?

Rebecca,

I'm dissappointed (but not surprised) that you haven't responded. Have you been too busy raking in commissions by scamming people into purchasing crippled credentials from K-W?

Oh well, good luck on your future endeavors, except those involving taking advantage of others.

Have fun,
Bill Huffman

 

Re: UoP vs. KW

I am guessing UoP didn't accept your 2 yr degree due to either:

A) The institue you received it from isn't accredited, or
B) the institute is accredited, but the courses were taken before its accreditation was complete.

The reason I state this is because UoP doesn't have an age requirement on the lower division, general education coursework. Only technology credits have an age, which is currently 5 years if memory serves.

Also as part of the UoP curriculum, you must log on at least twice per week, and to get any sort of decent grade you will need to log in five times per week. There are posted lecturettes during the week to which the students are required to respond to through the questions following up the lecturette. There are papers to be completed on a personal level, and as a group there are weekly tasks to be completed.

Obviously depending on the instructor, you will get varying grading styles and practices, so I cannot comment on how papers are graded.

If you feel testing is the way to go, then more power to you. Since I have been working for 15 years, I have never taken a test in the professional world. I have, however, written many proposals and made many presentations. That being said, you might be in an industry which doesn't require these skills, which there are plenty. But the bread and butter degree programs of UoP are business programs, thus those folks are needing skills to be able to perform at a high level if they hope to reach the higher-paying jobs in the business world. And while I am so high on my soap box, the team assignments make up a total of 20%-35% of a student's overall grade in the course.

If you haven't noticed, I am a big fan of UoP.

Matt

 

department of redundancy department

Never trust the logic of an individual that believes a non RA school is a better alternative to one that is accredited.

Build something idiot proof and they build a better idiot.