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Father Guido Sarducci (Don Novello). Don't forget the snack.

 

Oh, there are a lot of courses that no longer have significant writing requirements. It's not limited to the "Big 3." Besides, it's hard now to get through one of those programs without writing. (In my first bachelor's, I took some night courses that had writing requirements, and I took two NY Regents exams with essay sections. My second bachelor's was all by multiple-choice exams. I don't think you can do that anymore, IIRC.)

 

Some remember little - that's true. Others remember a lot. In my case, I still remember quite a bit and I attribute that to three factors:

(1) I was a "born again" student who didn't really get started until his 40s.
(2) I may not be overly intelligent (despite test scores or whatever) but I still have a phenomenal memory - that helped me then and helps me now.
(3) Having to write all those essays etc. Definitely a constructive approach - at least in my case. Like learning guitar; you have to play - you can't just sit there with a book - or even YouTube.

 

I'm sure it wasn't your experience, Rich. But from the threads (and in one case, almost an entire forum) devoted to the finer points of the sport - credit-stacking, I think it approaches mania status (no disrespect to our resident Maniac) for a significant contingent of degree-seekers, and is of considerable importance and interest to many more. I think there's evidence a-plenty to support that.

 

I agree with that. I find it tedious to discuss anymore since it is a simple issue lacking nuance, grace, or complexity. But if you take a step back, many people are doing it to get past the requirement and on to what they really want. I once counseled a colonel who didn't have a bachelor's degree. He was coming up for consideration for general--the Air Force decides after a few years which colonels will have a shot at general and who will be out of the running. He knew he needed a degree, so I helped him get one from Regents. His goal was much, much farther beyond the degree, but lacking the degree was an impediment. (He didn't get selected, but I wonder if that degree helped him when he retired from the military.)

So yeah, there's a lot of credit scooping and stacking to all of that. But it can be seen in a much bigger context as well, which I suggest changes its meaning.

 

Point taken.

Whenever it can be seen in that bigger context - it should be, indeed. But with all the gung-ho and hoopla of some midnight-oil burners, it's sometimes hard to see the forest for the trees. In fact, one begins to wonder if some of them can see clearly - or if it's just an addictive game for them. They eventually win - and start a new stack... same game, new level.

Right, Rich. Maybe this is a good point to end the discussion.

 

Yes, but not without agreeing with your last post. I get frustrated with the transactional thinking we see regarding DL in general, as well. It's normally a very complex topic and with every answer there is likely an equal and opposite answer that must also be considered. Almost none of it surrenders to simple solutions--or thinking.

(By "tedious to discuss" I didn't mean this discussion. I meant all of those "I need 3 credits in...." Yawn. )

 

by the way, I think you guys can try to finish the University of North Texas program within 8 months.

Study.com allows you to get up to 15 college credits per each month (5 proctored exams).
In six months, you can get 90 credits (15 credits x 6 months). You can first apply to the program when you have 60 credits and start taking 30 credits worth of their online courses along with study.com exams.

I think this could be the fastest way to get a Bachelor's degree from known school for under $10k. The best part is they accept transfer credits from any course, any subject... as long as the credits are on a transcript from accredited institution, they'll accept it.

 

It might not be all that easy. U. of North Texas isn't on Study.com's all-auto-acceptance list. I looked the school up on Study.com and here's what they specify about credit transfer of their courses to U. of North Texas: "Students seeking credit transfers should contact their school directly to determine credit transfer eligibility and requirements specific to their situation."

Check first. Good advice. Always.

 

Yeah, I just sent an email to U. of North Texas to figure that out.

I will see if they'll accept study.com ACE credits on Excelsior College or TESU transcripts.
Last time, they said they'll accept any credit from regionally accredited institutions.

 

Getting study.com credits accepted at Excelsior and then trying to transfer THOSE credits (as if you earned them at Excelsior) is "credit laundering." Extremely problematic. They should be transferred directly from the source to one school. No middlemen.

 

But you can't transfer ACE credits directly to some of the schools... they require some kind of a transcript.

Excelsior College offer 'one transcript' service to help you with that:
https://www.excelsior.edu/support-resources/onetranscript/

 

Yes. Check the list here:
https://study.com/college/school/index.html

So, Excelsior will enroll you as a non-degree student and let you transfer in all of your exam credits.

Credit Consolidation
Example sources of credit that Excelsior will place in OneTranscript:

• Proficiency demonstrated through exam programs:
  • CLEP® – College Level Examination Program®
  • DSST® – DANTES Subject Standardized Tests®
  • Excelsior College® Examinations
  • UExcel® examinations
  • New York University (NYU) Language Examinations
  • IT certification exams from – Microsoft®, Cisco®, SAS®, Oracle®, CompTia®, and Sun Microsystems®
• Business/Industry/Government training courses evaluated for credit by:
  • American Council on Education (ACE)
  • National College Credit Recommendation Service (NCCRS)

 

but keep in mind that 'Bachelor of Applied Arts and Sciences' is widely known a completion degree:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_of_Applied_Arts_and_Sciences

In the United States, Bachelor of Applied Arts and Sciences (B.A.A.S.) degree is considered a completion degree. The degree can be awarded to students who have both technical education and traditional college/university education. Some universities also give credit for work-related training and certification completed by the student.

 

Actually, that's an amazing program! they require minimum 45 credits to be completed through their online courses and each of their credit costs only $371!
You can get Bachelor in Computer Science for $16,695 (45 x $371). Although I'm not sure how flexible they are in terms of accepting transfer credits.

"Some degree requirements may be transferred from other institutions. Please note that a minimum of 45 credits of the last 75 credits in this degree program must be completed at Oregon State (online or on campus) to meet the academic residency requirement."

https://ecampus.oregonstate.edu/online-degrees/undergraduate/computer-science/

 

He's also got a law school if you've got a minute...

Personally, I think this is all very exciting. I came late to the big three game and I did not do it the way most of that crowd did. Had I been 20 years old and sitting in the Navy and these options were all available to me I would have definitely made some different choices. I know me. I probably would have gone for Villanova. Not a big leap from Scranton but Villanova packs a better punch and has a broader reach. Not to mention, I can get behind any "New House" themed institutions. It could have played into my personal brand.

That said, Villanova would have probably resulted in more out of pocket expense for me. CTU was pretty cheap because they're no dummies. They built their tuition around the GI Bill. After military TA I basically paid them the entirety of my montgomery GI Bill payments. I left with debt but so little it was almost laughable.

To compare that to Scranton, it would have been very close. The cost to attend at that time was right around $15k per year. I don't know what Villanova was at that time. Though I do recall that they were more expensive than Scranton. Of course, the conventional wisdom was that it was worth the extra money because it was Villanova. Would I have left with more debt? Less debt? Would the Villanova name have paid off in the end? Who knows?

As with Rich, my degree, for-profit as the school may be, enabled me to:

1. Get into grad school
2. Get accepted to law school (but I didn't go)
3. Get a job straight out of the Navy as a recruiter at Manpower
4. Take my PHR exam sooner rather than later and help me advance within that firm rapidly
5. Get a job with a Fortune 100 company after that
6. Live free of student loan debt in an era where that is practically viewed as impossible by society

Would I recommend the same path for my kids? Probably not. They have, and will have, much different options than I did just like I had options that my father never had. He didn't earn his bachelors degree until he was in his 50's because earning an associates degree enabled him to carry on a successful career as an NYPD officer and was about all he could do in between working, being in the Army reserve and courting my mother as far as higher ed went. A viable distance learning option of any kind would have changed his math as well.

The problem with so many options now is that like the hypothetical Neuhaus with the world at his fingertips 18 year olds can still make stupid decisions. You can get yourself into some serious debt with higher ed choices. Now you can do it without ever leaving home! I think people underestimate exactly how detrimental that possibility can truly be. When I graduated from high school, around half of us stayed at local colleges. Most went to Kings College or Wilkes University as they were within walking distance of our high school. The other half went away, flipping the bird to NEPA as they drove off to greater things. Of those half, I'd say most were back within a semester. The adjustment to being away was hard.

Now you don't need to go away to earn a degree from Villanova. So the kid whose excitement to attend Villanova was all that could pry them from the comfort of their parents home is now able to take the easy path. There is a social impact there. Also, of the bulk of those who went away most who returned ended up enrolling at the community college. It made sense. Their parents spent a ton of money for them to go away that one semester. They came back and there was a cheaper option with no stressful application process. You could literally just go and sign up. They ended up saving money in the long run because they transferred to other local colleges with nearly half of the coursework done at a CC. Now, that same student might well just come back and enroll in an equally expensive college if for nothing other than to save face. Why did you leave Temple University? Oh, no big deal, I came home to Omaha so I could finish it up with the University of Chicago online.

Many unintended consequences that I don't think people fully appreciate.

 

There's a lot about this on the other forum. What I gather is: source of the credits shows on the One Transcript - that, of course, eliminates "laundering." And many, many schools then ask for the original-source transcript, for credits other than those earned at Excelsior. Best to find out FIRST from the intended receiving school if they accept transfer credits from the original source(s) where you got yours - and if they will need originals or go with One Transcript. You might save yourself headaches - AND possibly, the $300 or so cost of One Transcript service.