Personal Attacks

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by Charles Fout, May 1, 2022.

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  1. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    [Moderated: explaining a personal attack doesn't make it not be a personal attack.]
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 1, 2022
  2. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Calling someone a troll is a personal attack. If you believe that someone is trolling, and you're not inclined to respond to it, report that post.
     
  3. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Is this an official moderatorial edict? Because if so, trying to argue with you is normally against the rules.
     
  4. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    The Department of Homeland Security is setting up a Disinformation Governance Board to try to counter the spread of false information. Reporting is that the board will focus on disinformation coming from Russia as well as misleading messages about the U.S.-Mexico border. Based on the right acting like their hair is on fire and then calling it the George Orwell's Ministry of Truth in this forum with zero opinion being thrown into the mix is about as close to a troll post as I can imagine. That is not something that I imagine should be reported though? I haven't read the DegreeInfo Terms of Service in many years but I'd be surprised is trolling like that would be against the TOS?

    Now personal attacks I'm sure are against the TOS though.
     
    Vicki likes this.
  5. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Since when? None of your posts arguing with me have been moderated, even the "properly spicy" one.
     
    Dustin and Maniac Craniac like this.
  6. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    That's why I asked if the above was said in official capacity.
     
  7. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Then yes, officially, calling someone a troll is a personal attack.

    I'm not trying to be difficult, but I'm still unsure what that changes regarding arguing with me, since I don't remember you or anyone else here calling me a troll.

    I will say that trying to be both a participant and a moderator in a community like this means walking a difficult line, and I make no claim at all to perfection. For what it's worth, I'm trying to do a better job at disagreeing agreeably than I may have in the past, and I openly invite anyone who thinks I'm being unfair to please say so. (Or tell Chip to "fire" me, whichever.)
     
    Dustin, Vonnegut and Maniac Craniac like this.
  8. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Reporting means it gets looked at. That's all. I wasn't suggesting that merely being wrong is against the ToS. Honestly, I was more focused on the "You're a troll!" part of this, which is a different and much less helpful response than "Here's why I disagree...."

    That's true.
     
  9. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member


    Actually, I believe you do an excellent job as a moderator, as does the Maniac. I really appreciate the job that you folks do. THANK YOU!
     
  10. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Well, the only way to manage that was to clip out more tit-for-tat posts than I would have preferred, but I did so.

    Honestly, not sure how else to handle tit-for-tat personal attacks.
     
    Maniac Craniac likes this.
  11. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I appreciate that. I only offered in the first place because we were inundated with spammers. I'm no Elon Musk, but content moderation is still not my cup of tea.
     
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  12. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    It takes on a different tone when you add that little "the" :emoji_japanese_ogre:.

    Thanks for the kind words. At least I can do something right now and again :emoji_sunglasses:. Steve is consistently this board's voice of reason and I think we're all much the better for having him working behind the scenes.
    I think it's important in our little nook of the web that users can get to know, to a certain extent, who is doing the moderating. I've been on other boards where the moderators act like a clandestine league of shadows. That kind of atmosphere just doesn't work in a place with so much lively discussion as we have here. You do a great job of keeping that balance.

    Me on the other hand... :emoji_smile: at least I know how to delete spam.
     
  13. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Reported.

    But seriously, even I wouldn't say that. I've been rightfully schooled from time to time.
     
    Rich Douglas and Maniac Craniac like this.
  14. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    You're right on that. Huzzah to moderators!
     
  15. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    It's hard, and you do an admirable job. So many moderators let their personal biases affect their decisions; I haven't seen you doing that. Thanks!
     
    SteveFoerster and Maniac Craniac like this.
  16. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    Musk will buy that DGB to insure free speech:) just joking.
    I speculate if DGB will be politicized based on who is in WH? Like alleged controversy of some agencies in the past.
     
    Rachel83az and Bill Huffman like this.
  17. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    There should be no such government entity in the United States. It is an affront to the First Amendment.
     
    Lerner likes this.
  18. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I'm sure that if any government agency started routinely suppressing free speech that the courts would very quickly put a stop to it. You are flat out wrong though that the first amendment protects lies especially when spread by a foreign government like Russia. Why does it upset you if the US government corrects Russian disinformation? Or does something else about this upset you?
     
    Rachel83az likes this.
  19. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    After further research here's the situation. In general, it's true that the First Amendment is designed to further the pursuit of truth.

    However, I found an example where a lie actually is protected by the first amendment.

    quote:
    In United States v. Alvarez, 567 U.S. ____ (2012), the Supreme Court struck down the Stolen Valor Act, which was designed to punish individuals who made false claims, not about others, but about their own military service. In striking down the law, the Supreme Court thus refused to expand the limited number of categories, like obscenity, true threats, and libel, where it permitted restrictions on the actual content of speech. Essentially, the justices thought that this was an issue that should be resolved in free and open debate rather than by government action. https://www.mtsu.edu/first-amendment/article/1506/false-speech

    Note that this does not mean that the speech of foreign governments is protected speech in the USA though.
     
    Last edited: May 2, 2022
    Rachel83az likes this.
  20. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Thing is... disinformation is perhaps the biggest threat to national security - given russia threat and the adversary's formidable expertise in lying. I can't imagine what kind of American would want his country to fail to address this threat. The same kind, perhaps, that would willingly spread foreign lies, like pretty much anything from Sputnik News.
     
    Johann, Dustin, Rachel83az and 2 others like this.

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