Economic malaise, NASCAR dads, & soccer moms...

Warning - liberal/socialist rant ahead....

It struck me these past few days just how bad the overall economic picture for middle class Americans has really become under the Bush administration. The most frustrating aspect of this for me is that Bush has broad support from the very population who is the most damaged by his policies - namely middle America (as represented by my categories of "NASCAR dads" and "soccer moms"). The corporate sector is in his camp already, and always will be. But it mystifies me that so many Americans who barely have a pot left to piss in (excuse my French) still follow this idiot and have voted him in for 2 terms.

Let me list the economic malaise that has occurred under Bush's watch:

1. Gasoline prices at $3 a gallon! And we thought $2 a gallon was bad enough..... no end in sight to these costs.
2. Medical and health care costs rising, while at the same time insurance premiums and the need to carry high deductibles as part of the "base service" is the new order of the day. Where will this end??
3. Natural gas price increases - which will be felt by every American heating their home with natural gas this winter. Some say 70% increases, but it was already high, and now has become nearly unaffordable for many upper income middle class Americans, to say nothing of what will happen to the majority of working poor.
4. Rising costs for food and other staples.

I could go on and on. The thing that strikes me is that basic commodities and essentials for human life are now being priced out of sight for many people in the former middle class. Guess what? They are now going to be enlisted in the ranks of the poor, if they aren't already. Thank you NASCAR dads and soccer moms for your idiotic, emotional, and religion-fueled support for Bush against your own self-interests. Hope you like it when your kids can't have new shoes, you can't put food on the table, your cars sit idle, and your thermostats are set at 45 degrees this winter to keep the pipes from freezing.

Finally, to make matters even worse (and this is the genius of the Bush malevolence) - bankruptcy laws have been changed so that those in the most need can't even hide from their crushing debt anymore. I'm not talking about saving the asses of those who lived beyond their means - I'm talking about people who had unforeseen and devastating medical bills, who lost their jobs, or who had other economic tales of woe that the federal government has just turned their backs on.

So you get squeezed on the cost side, and then have no safety net on the debt relief side. A perfect solution for a Republico/fascist regime that seeks to maximize its own profits for the 1% of the population (almost like Brazil) that benefits, while the rest of us slide into true economic depression.

Oh sure, it doesn't seem that bad. Our streets are mostly swept and clean, our cars are new, our houses are McMansions. But did you ever wonder where all those people will wind up when foreclosures hit, when jobs disappear, and when repossessions take their few remaining assets away?

Did I forget social security? Here's another Bush masterstroke - let's remove that safety net too! Throw the uninformed and inexperienced middle class investor to the winds of Wall Street, while taking away the defined benefit! Pure genius! Guess who's going to win that game?

If this doesn't make all of you stop and think about who you are going to vote for the next time around, nothing will.....

 

"Nothing Will"

You see, some folks will always maintain loyalty and religious dogma over competence and we are seeing the results of such values.

I agree with most of what you wrote, but I have a couple things to add. The oil thing is strange considering this regime/dynasty is a powerhouse energy family and should know how to better manage energy/explore alternatives...I don't know for sure, but I suspect their family/friends are profitting from these high prices.

Also, what about the mishandling of what seems like everything with little-to-no accountability? The incompetence at so many levels (remember the missing $9 billion/the effort to find BinLaden that is now unimportant/bad numbers on how many groundtroops would be need and for how long/alienating our allies), now we are told that there have been many foiled terror attempts, but I wonder how can we trust *this* information when we could not trust all the other horribly bad data that led us to war? Further, the tired arguments that Clinton also used the bad info from our intel groups ring hollow because even if he did enforce noflyzones, etc. on that info, Clinton did not initiate our first pre-emptive war based on that info, so the responsibility would remain w/the current admin. if we apply some common sense to our current situtation.

But you are talking economics, right? I think I saw a blip a few weeks ago citing a rise in the poverty level again, but what wasn't reported was the rise in the nations number of millionaires...I don't follow these things much, but it seems to me the rich are getting richer while, the poor continue to get poorer...the country is wasting time and money over generations at this point with little to show for it . And didn't Mr. B also propose permanent tax cuts during wartime...

FWIW, I don't think the Democrats will do much better if they ever win the whitehouse, the congress or the courts again.

 

A waste..

Caution, conservative reality check follows.

Actually, despite Carl's protestations to the contrary, poverty has not risen in the USA. Most groups which were in poverty 50 years ago have moved solidly into the middle class. Much of what poverty is left is of the have a car and cable but no job kind. The rest is caused by the massive influx of illegal and legal immigrants over the past 10 years. Few people realize that mor people have enetered the USA over tha past 10 years than ever went through Ellis Island. We also live in a country where the obesity rate is directly linked to ones economic status. The poorer you are the more likely you are to be fat. Where else does that happen?

Gas at $3 a gallon is still cheaper than the 1998 runup. Still, as someone who has to drive 50 miles to work I don't like it one bit and challenge Carl to point out what his governor has done to deal with it. Hate to break it to you but the laws dealing with gouging are in the state's area of responsibility. Of course, it is much easier for him to scream at Bush rather than actually come up with a solution. God forbid a liberal do something other than complain.

Health care rising? No!!! I guess the fact that a bunch of those millionaires we are getting are ambulance chasing lawyers heavily indebted to the Dem's also escaped your view? Much of the rest of the increase comes from excessive tests that act as a defense against any future lawsuit. The rest goes to the technology that serves to keep people alive for much longer thus costing more health care dollars. Remember, over 90% of a person's lifetime spending on health care is spent in the last years of their life. In the past, they wouldn't have made it that far, they would have likely perished much sooner. It is a harsh truth but it is the truth. Should we ration care like some other countries do? If we did, the liberals including Carl would be the first to scream. They just want to be able to scream and avoid the facts.

You're right Clinton didn't start a war. He didn't do anything at all. His lawyers always advised him to avoid anything that smacked of controversy since he just wanted to be everybody's friend. Despite his efforts to be everybody's buddy and his real efforts to solve the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, planning for 9/11 started under his watch and occured 8 months into Bush's for him to deaL with. So much for trying to be the good guy. Any real look at literature will tell you that almost every country in the world believed Saddam had or was trying to acquire WMD. He was in fact still trying to acquire them even if he didn't have the stockpiles. However, many of them never felt their country would ever be his target so they just preferred to sell things to him. Germany actually sent several people to jail for violating the sanctions and he had billions in contracts with France and Russia, Yeah, they were unbiased, NOT!!!!

I am so tired of listening to you people on this board complain about things you know nothing about. Do we have problems with health care? Yes, but much of your so called solutions are as bad as what we have now. In Canada they are suing to have supplemental health insurance because it is almost impossible to get prompt routine care. In Germany, my ex-wife always paid for supplemental insurance because the national plan was stingy with routine care. Poverty? Look at some real numbers not the hype in the headlines. Fact, poverty has plummeted among African Americans and the elderly. College educated black women actually make more than their college educated white women. Poverty will never go away simply because welfare is an inflationary trigger which serves to raise the welfare level higher. I live within blocks of public housing and guess what, they have cars, cable and pretty much what people in the lower middle class have. They also have health insurance which is something not as common to the lower middle class. If illegals come and live in poverty that was quite frankly a choice they made and thousands of them are still making it because it is light years ahead of what they had back home.

Give me a break from the do nothing liberals of the world.....

 

Re: If pro is the opposite of con, the the opposite of progress is....

American's are some of the biggest bunch of "wanters" in the world. They want great government services but at very low tax rates. They want security but god forbid they ever have to give up any personal freedoms to get it. They want immediate help in times of trouble but don't want to stand in line to get it. Then, if someone makes a rash no bid contract to get immediate help somebody wants to scream at them. I guess they have never done a bid contract that takes MONTHS OR YEARS to get done. Want, want, want big bunch of whiners are many of us.

I am getting sick already of the Katrina thing. People complaining they had to stand in line to get their $2000 from Fema and then another line for some for the ARC! Over a half a million people were harmed but we should be able to take care of them without them having to stand in line? Look at the bills for rebuilding, millions if not billions for stuff not even related to the damage caused by Katrina. 2 hospitals are "unsalvageable, even though they were only lightly damaged by the actual flooding. The key thing, "these hospitals were already in bad shape", meaning "hey lets get the feds to build us a new one, why bond it ourselves?".

Meanwhile, tragedies great and small go on every day in the USA but because it wasn't a huge media event in the last bastion of the southern Democrats you won't hear a peep on their plight and they'll get no help beyond what their neighbors provide. If you are going to suffer harm be sure to do it in a media frezied event. It started in 9/11 and it is getting worse.....

 

Interesting take by both Carl and DTECHBA. Very well written and I can tell you are both highly articulate.

I sit somewhere in-between in my beliefs. Is there more poverty in the US? I guess you have to compare it with other nations. Personally, I only compare us with other western nations of similar makeup (I can count only 2-3 which fit the bill).

Katrina? Screw-up at all levels: State, FED and local. All should pay and all need to be replaced. Is it Dubya's fault? Only for hiring someone who wasn't qualified to do the job. Perhaps Congress needs to scrutinize political appointees to a greater degree.

I think we set a very bad precedence when we paid the victims of 9/11. At no other time in our history have we done this (to my knowledge). I think we need to rely more on ourselves and families. When my grandmother got sick, I made sure that all her bills were paid and grass was cut. I paid for the service to bring her to and from chemo. Yes - that set me back at least 10G's - but it is my family. We should not rely on the government to take care of essentials - we need to look to ourselves for that.

To comment on DTech: I don't think it is about wanting - I think it is about having things shoved upon us. -- and it is being done by the Cons and Libs. This is why I have always believed that government is really a local thing. If I want more cops and fireman in Fremont, then I should vote to tax myself more for this service. If I don't want them, then I should vote to cut the service. (Same thing for schools). It is all about choice.

BTW: NASCAR and Soccer sucks!

 

Insight...

As I have mentioned before, I am very involved in politics. One of the things that amazes me the most is how light the turnout is for local elections. It runs at about 50% of a presidential race (unless there is a tax referendum on the ballot, that gets people out). As a friend says, "the local government has the most effect on our lives but no one wants to go vote on who'll run it". They sure do complain about it though.

I used to be in the soccer sucks camp. However, as my children started playing it I started enjoying it. And if you really want to see something great, watch a bunch of kids play indoor soccer. Nonstop action with two 30 minute halves. My son plays and on some days he has a doubleheader. He is so worn out afterwards that he is usually asleep in the 5 minutes it takes to drive home! This despite the fact the nickname his teammates gave him is the "Energizer Bunny". Maybe I am just a proud dad, my wife heard a lady refer to him as the "Pele, of indoor soccer".

Sorry, I'm bragging him up.........

 

Words to live by. Unfortunatelly, if you don't pay at one end then you pay at the other.

 

DTECH

My son flubbed at Soccer. However, he is excelling at band. He is even in line to be the band leader next year. He has taked to the Trumpet, Tuba, and Guitar very well and I am very proud of the little shit. I spend my free time (what free time?) going to band functions (parades, football games, etc).

My daughter just took up the Trombone. -- she is not as good but she is definitely trying.

I figure anyway to keep them away from drugs or gangs is good - don't you think?

 

Both daughter's and the wife were in the badn....

My daughters were in band and I know how that can eat up the time. It got so bad I just opted to send cash instead of all the fundraisers it takes to run the band. I may joke about it but I would never run down being in the band. Especially, since one of my life goals is to play a musical instrument and yes, belonging to the band is much better than some of the other options you mentioned.....

 

Isn't it ironic?

Isn't it ironic that I can play multiple musical instruments at a professional level, even though that's not my profession? Yet you would not want to be me, nor I you.....

I think if you become more liberal in outlook, the music will just flow...... peace out!

 

Re: Isn't it ironic?

Why wouldn't I want to be you? Are you a pervert or something? I just wouldn't be a blind liberal.....

 

Great points Carl and Oaskie. I agree.



Good evening gentleman!


Abner

 

Re: A waste..

Yikes. Are we talking about the same planet? This is a perfect example of out-of-touch conservatism. If you don't like the hard facts, then just make them up. Make some sloppy generalizations about what you'd LIKE to be the truth, and then state it as fact.

You might want to consult some "official" government and social welfare sites to get a picture of the growing poverty class in this country.

I agree with the assessment that it is, by and large, the people who are most damaged by Bush who are also his greatest supporters. We have a large and growing class of dupes in this country. Bush and his henchmen are very adept at appealing to people on a gut (read patriotic) level, and then screwing them in the process.

Walter Cronkite recently said,

"If we expect this country to work, it depends on an informed, an intelligent electorate. You know, Thomas Jefferson said very early on in our republic that the nation that expects to be ignorant and free expects it never can and never will be.

We're an ignorant nation right now. We're not really capable. I do not think the majority of our people are making the decisions that have to be made at election time and particularly in the selection of their legislatures and their Congress and the presidency of course. I don't think we're bright enough to do the job that would preserve our democracy, our republic. I think we're in serious danger."

And that's the way it is.

When it comes to the Iraq war, I wish conservatives could come up with a better defense than the whining argument that says, essentially, that all the other countries/people had the same information and reached the same erroneous conclusions about WMD. "Everyone else screwed up too." That's the crux of the whine. Let's remember that everyone else did not decide to go to war and spend umpteen billions each month on such a mistake. The billions spent in Iraq don't seem to be helping NY subway riders deal with the threat of terrorism these past two days, or in our government's ability to even define what it is they're supposed to be afraid of.

 

Re: Re: A waste..

Exactly, and now we are going to spend another $50 billion on Iraq? Perhaps we should start worrying about our own country for a change?



Good points Tom57,



Abner

 

Re: Re: A waste..

Wow, you quote Walter Cronkite as a source for your assertions? Very scholarly and your statements are as general as they are unfactual.. Wake up and get some real sources. Your bubble will be greatly burst. No, we are not talking the same planet. I am talking the real one and you are talking the liberal gloom and doom one. You have the nerve to make statements about ignorance when you can't even bother to do some decent research. That is the very definition of ignorance.

Here's some stats for you. This one shows black poverty has dropped 10% over the past 30 years.
http://www.publicagenda.org/issues/factfiles_detail.cfm?issue_type=race&list=10

Here is another on poverty and immigrants:
http://www.npc.umich.edu/poverty/#3
a quote from that study:
"There are also differences between native-born and foreign-born residents. In 2004, 17.1 percent of foreign-born residents lived in poverty, compared to 11.8 percent of residents born in the United States. Foreign-born, non-citizens had an even higher incidence of poverty, at a rate of 21.7 percent. In total, the foreign-born poor account for about a sixth of all poor persons."

Here's one on the aged poor rates:
http://www.ssa.gov/policy/docs/ssb/v64n3/v64n3p23.html

Here is one on educated women's earnings:
http://washingtontimes.com/business/20050328-125309-1639r.htm
A quote:
"A white woman with a bachelor's degree typically earned nearly $37,800 in 2003, compared with nearly $43,700 for a college-educated Asian woman and about $41,100 for a college-educated black woman, according to data being released today by the Census Bureau. Hispanic women took home slightly less at about $37,600 a year."

A report on immigration:
http://www.cis.org/articles/2001/back101.html

You people need to get your facts straight before you even try to debate intelligently. Come up with better sources than the talking head media and GIVE ME A BREAK.......

 

Us are American's who believe the constitution is more important than religious rhetoric. Them is everyone else. I have always had the belief that all government leaders ought to swear on the constitution and not the bible. (I have actually refused to swear to god or place my hand on the bible - not because I believe one way or the other - I do believe in god, just think my allegiance as a citizen is to the constitution and not to god)

 

The forces of evil are at work again....

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/southflorida/sfl-zdeduct13oct13,0,5636469.story?coll=sfla-home-headlines

See the article above about further plans to squeeze out the middle class in this formerly great country of ours..... Limiting mortgage deductions to a paltry $250K - $350K will destroy what is left of the true middle class in this country. Oh, and the article also mentions taxing health insurance coverage/benefits above a certain level. Wonderful......

Thank you President Bush, and fellow travellers.....