Does U of London LLB program qualify graduates for Canadian Bar Exam?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Warren_King, Jun 20, 2006.

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  1. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member


    That is more than adequate time to prepare.

    You should be aware that obtaining a faculty position within a Canadian law school is much more competitive than obtaining a spot as s tudent at a Canadian law school, so using a UoL externall LLB in this way is the longest of longshots.

    Good luck with your studies, have you considered enrolling with a tutorial provider?
     
  2. dko

    dko New Member

    Hi novemberdude,

    Wow! A million thank you! I thought I wouldn't have enough time. Thank you for boosting my level of confidence.

    Yeah, I guess I'll have to hope for the best as to whether I'd get into Canadian law school or to work in the academia.

    Maybe I'm wrong but I only found tutorial provider in the east coast (ie. Toronto) but none in the west coast, Vancouver, which is the city I reside.

    May I trouble you for one more question, please? The study materials came with more than 15 books and I am planning to read them all anyway. This may seem like a stupid question, but is it necessary to read every single page of all 15-16 books? I mean, I am not trying to take any short cuts or anything but was just wondering if there was any sort of guidance. Any input is appreciated. Thank you so much and I hope it's not too much of a hassle for you with all my quesitons.

    Sincerley,
    David
     
  3. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    I have enrolled in the UoL LLB degree this January and am awaiting notification if they will accept me. I applied under the undergraduate category so I will have 12 courses over 3 or 4 years. I realize obtaining an articling position in Canada post NCA challenge examinations might be an obstacle, however, not impossible. Worse case scenario I become a legal researcher working in the dark recesses of a law firm or government department. Another UoL LLB graduate, who passed her NCA examinations, is trying to find an articling position and the lack of familiarity with the NCA by the law firms is troubling.

    In the meantime, I am debating whether to seek a high-level position or something less challenging as far as my employment is concerned to allow time to study. In hindsight I should have taken medication, alot of medication, and the government job to avoid such decisions.
     
  4. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member

    I would not think it is necessary to read every single page of every book. Goodness knows I didn't.

    Presumably you have received UoL study guides, and in these guides they should tell you which pages of which books to read. I would be surprised if they say read all of every book. Even if they do you will start to get an idea of how you learn and which of the books work better for you and given time constraints you will eventually start to focus (it's the Darwinism of the study world).

    As important as working hard is working smart. Once you have a working knowledge of the materials go through the old exams and see if they tend to ask questions on that subject. What I did (and this may or may not work for you) is make a grid of exam topics and exams years, which brought into focus what topics tended to be examined. Then I learned the key points for those topics.

    What I would suggest is from the beginning making a list of the key cases and what they stand for, for example:

    Hadley v Baxendale: Scope of Damages then a brief explanation. That way you have the list prepared nice and early.

    I would also suggest doing questions from early on. It's one thing to read the chapter and take notes, it's quite another to discuss the criminal liability of the parties when Tom unexpectedly surprises Michael while robbing a flower shop, and Michael runs into the street causing Marge (who is driving without a licence) to swerve and run over and kill Pete's dog and destroy Pete's prize winning geranium collection and Donna who is watching from her window finds it all too stressful and dies of a heart attack.

    I actually remember one question from Criminal which involved someone shooting at and missing, and you were expected to not miss the point about the damage the bullet caused to property.

    In terms of tutorial providers there are several that offer online tuition. I don't remember all the providers but you can try London Law Tutors and also George Pappas' group which might be called ICLS but you can get there by going to www.malet.com. You can also try Holborn College and I think the Institute of Legal Executives (ILEX) also offers support Your student package from UoL should provide details.

    I'm not trying to spend your money but unless you've studied law before some kind of tutorial support will probably be helpful.

    Also (and again I'm spending your money) but you might also find the following books helpful:

    The Nutshells Series: They have a small book for every subject that hits the high points. These are pretty useful and I bought one for every course that I took.

    Law Cards: Similar to Nutshells, probably a little briefer but lots of flow charts if you learn that way (I do).

    How to Write Law Essays and Exams. I found this book helped me a lot. I only discovered it after my first year, and it made a big difference.
     
  5. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member

    Can you provide any details about what exams the NCA candidate you've mentioned was required to complete, and also what route she did at UoL and what degree standing she achieved? Any information would be very interesting.
     
  6. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    From the information I recall the person finished with a 2:1 (upper second level standing) and wrote 5 or 6 NCA challenge examinations, but I do not recall the subjects.
     
  7. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    UoL provided this information to another student regarding class standing.

    For a first class classification a student must score a total aggregate of 630 - which is an average of 70 marks for every subject.

    In order to be awarded a 2:1 classification a student must attain a total across all 9 subjects of 540 marks, with 4 subjects being marked at 60 or above, or attain a total across all 9 subjects of 505 with 5 subjects being marked at 60 or above.

    In order to be awarded a 2:2 a student must obtain either 450 marks with 4 above 50, or 425 with 5 above 50.
     
  8. BlueMason

    BlueMason Audaces fortuna juvat

    sentinel,
    Is there an update for you and UoL? Have you received word yet?
     
  9. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    I expect to hear any day now. I have found postal mail between Great Britain and the "Canadas" to be rather slow. If I do now receive an envelope in the mailbox by next Friday I shall telephone the University of London. I will post whatever response I eventually receive; hopefully a positive response to the application. Her Royal Majesty - for whom I would take a bullet - might still be upset a relative of mine dared depart for the Colony and was a member of the original Northwest Mounted Police. :D
     
  10. nienyinchang

    nienyinchang New Member

    I got my UOL degree evaluated by NCA

    I have my UOL degree evaluated by NCA after they effected the new policy in March 2009, and I am only required to take 5 exams: Administrative Law, Constitutional Law, Criminal Law, Corporate Law, and Professional Responsibility. That seems a lot easier than I expected. Under the old policy, I guess I would be required to take 30-60 credits at a law school. So, I think UOL degree now becomes an even more attractive option.
     
  11. phlin

    phlin New Member

    nienyinchang, was your degree studied via the External system?
     
  12. nienyinchang

    nienyinchang New Member

    Phlin,

    Yes, I studied through the external system.
     
  13. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member


    If you wouldn't mind giving some more details of your precise educational background I would be very appreciative. I hold an external LLB and LLM from an English school and am considering having my degrees evaluated. Precisely:

    1- Did you have a degree (or degrees) prior to the LLB?
    2- What degree classification did you obtain in the LLB?
    2a- Were your marks pretty consistent across all the LLB subjects you took?
    3- Which route did you follow (graduate entry route or not)?
    4- If you did not take the graduate entry route, which courses did you take in your final year?
    5- Are you a member of any law society in another country?
    6- Do you have any legal education other than the UoL LLB?
    7- How quick was the evaluation process?
    8- How long do you have to fulfill the requirements set out?
    9- Do you have a choice between class attendance and challenge exams?
    10 - Through your dealings with the NCA did you obtain any information not available on the website? Do you have any other insights or opinions about the process?

    I apologize for the number of questions, however as a person who has actually had a UoL external degree evaluated I am thrilled to see you here, this is a subject that is close to my heart and one that has been the subject of a lot of speculation over the years on this site.

    Congratulations on your assessment and best of luck with the exams.
     
  14. nienyinchang

    nienyinchang New Member

    Hi, Novemberdude,
    1- I got a BSc and a MA prior to the LLB degree.
    2- 2:2
    2a- My average score is 5X throughout the three years.
    3- graduate entry route
    4- N/A
    5- No
    6- No
    7- It took about 6 months. (It could have been quicker, the delay was due to policy change effected in March)
    8- What requirements?
    9- Yes. I can choose to attend the courses offered by a Law School or take challenge exams.
    10 - I just followed the process listed out on the Website. No other insider information.

    Hope that the above info is useful to you!
     
  15. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member

    Thanks for your replies, they are very helpful. In question number 8 I was referring to the requirements set out by the NCA. In other words, how long do you have to pass the 5 challenge exams or complete the equivalent courses? I had understood that when giving an evaluation the NCA established a date by which requirements had to be satisfied.
     
  16. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    How many years did you take to complete the LLB?
     
  17. nienyinchang

    nienyinchang New Member

    Oh, yes, the NCA requires me to complete the challenge exams in two years -from Aug 2009 to Sep 2011. I am still thinking whether to take the NCA exams or registering as a special student at a law student. Do you have any ideas? Like which route is easier?

    It took me 3 years to complete my LLB.
     
  18. sentinel

    sentinel New Member

    You might find the NCA examinations more time-efficient given your experience with a law degree earned via distance education. Also, many law schools severely restrict the number of available seats for 'special students'. There is a FaceBook group dedicated to University of London (LLB) and the NCA process; you might get some pointers from the members.

    Did you use any tutorial services during your studies or just the course materials from the University of London?
     
  19. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member


    I haven't looked into it recently but my understanding is the same. Some law schools do not consider NCA applicants, I believe the Alberta universities fall into this category. They will possibly offer advanced standing however. On the other hand, University of Ottawa will NOT offer advanced standing, but will consider NCA applicants.

    In terms of the number of seats, the NCA required courses have traditionally been first year courses, and these are naturally all full with very little space available for non degree students.

    One advantage of attending a university: I've heard that some schools (Osgoode comes to mind, but I may be wrong) allow NCA students access to their career services. That may be the best argument for taking classes rather than the challenge exams.

    Having said that I think I'd give the exams a shot, but it's a personal choice.
     
  20. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member

    That's not bad, it seems as though you have 6 exam sessions to complete the 5 exams. Even if you do them one at a time you still have an extra sitting up your sleeve.
     

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