Do HR people know about Diploma Mills?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by LBTRS, Jan 29, 2006.

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  1. LBTRS

    LBTRS Member

    I am in the military and have a friend that is in the process of retiring from the military. He has worked for 7 years in the HR side of the military and is now looking for a civilian job.

    He was just called back after a phone interview from a medical center in Houston Texas where he is being flown down for a face to face interview.

    My concern lies in the fact that he has no "formal education" and holds a BS and an MBA from Almeda University. He received both of these "degrees" recently and is very proud of them.

    Why would this Medical Center pay to fly him out to interview for a position when he holds credentials from a diploma mill? The position starts at over 100K and states a master’s degree is required.

    It sure seems like HR people would be more knowledgeable about education credentials.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 29, 2006
  2. AuditGuy

    AuditGuy Member

    The ones I have worked with have been very bright, professional people, several of them attorneys, and the concept of a degree mill really surprised them.

    The standard verification procedure of "did the applicant get a degree from the listed school?" is easily defeated by the transcripts and verification services offered by a mill.

    Most organizations are lacking clear, thought-out policies on degree acceptability. Other than university postings, you don't often see any reference to the accreditation required.
     
  3. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Diploma mills are being uncovered and becoming part of the HR process. Our Hr dept has a list of "unreputable" schools that they keep. Also, I have a friend in the military that say you cant use a school that is not on their list.

    One other thing. As this comes to light, I would hat to see someone take a 100K job and buy a 300K house only to get fired because his credentials are BS. if you got your degree from a mill you know it and its basicly fraud. Not to mention...why would you set yourself up in this way to fail.. I do alot of SOX and GLB regulatiory work and Backgorund check are becoming quite very important process


    That was my ONLY reason for not going to Almeda route.
     
  4. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    Wait a minute...the only reason you didn't go the Almeda route is that you thought you might get caught by a background check? What?

    How about the fact that going the Almeda route doesn't teach you anything, is basically a fraud and is dishonest? What about the fact going the Almeda route means you don't end up with a real degree? What about the fact that going the Almeda route is essentially just buying yourself a degree?

    Surely, there were other reasons you didn't go the Almeda route...right?
     
  5. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Yeah your right....there were really two other big little reasons...they are 5 & 3,,,

    anyway


    I personally dont believe that the education system is more than proving ground for employment. Im sorry, Id like to think that its about achievement, and learning, and all that fluff, but really its not. I wish it was. Heck, if I won the lottery tommorow Id be on the endless quest for knowledge for the sake of learning, but right now its about getting two little girls raised and through school and hopefully college. The path to success is through a solid education. The more educated your are the better potential and growth oppurtunities you will have. Fortunatly for us all that Honesty and Hardwork through a real school provide a base that is not challangable, and if you choose to cheat and lie then more often that not your are exposed and pay the price. It really is a good thing that these standards still exist and I hope that the internet and the growth in DL help strengthen it and not weaken it. I personally take the time to work with our HR when we hire new people. If you have Mill on your resume I mention it and HR has not apporved any of them...

    Once agian, you are right. I talked coworkers out of mills reqularly, and I personally advocate RA schools over NA. Credibility is all you really have...
     
  6. Ian Anderson

    Ian Anderson Active Member

    I hope you do not fly on US built aircraft because I am still using what I learned in my first 4 years of college to design parts for them.
     
  7. Tim D

    Tim D Member

    Actually,a large portion of Rich Douglas' Doctoral Dissertation was based on the premise"Human resource professionals often do not understand the differences among schools and different types of institutional recognition and they do not often check".

    So it is not surprising at all.
     
  8. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Yes, but these are job applicable skills. And Im sure a peson with a Mill degree wont stand a chance to design parts for the plance i have to fly on (god i hate that)

    Im not saying college is useless at all, but as a HR funciton, it really doesnt matter. Job performance is a different matter all to gether..
     
  9. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Rich Douglas's dissertation showed that HR people are not really knowledgable about diploma mills and accreditation. For employees in the price range we're talking about here, it is very common for companies to use professional evaluators. The professional evaluator companies aren't generally asked to do their evaluation until after the final candidate is chosen. If that is the case then your friend will be rejected at that point, assuming that he passes the interview. If the company doesn't use a professional evaluator then we might be looking at a classical timebomb situation in the making.
     
  10. TCord1964

    TCord1964 New Member

    The degree may get you in the door, but it's what is between your ears that is going to help you keep that job.

    Think about it.
     
  11. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Cant disagree at all. Most of the time getting past HR is just the first step. The second interview with a department manager or supervisor usually ferrets out any BS....
     
  12. tigerhead

    tigerhead New Member

    I have brother who has a degree from Kennedy Western, which for some reason he is also very proud of and believes is a legitimate degree. Anyway his employer, one of the largest coporations in the World, (Generel Electric), paid for this degree, and upon his completion of it, offered him a very lucrative promotion about 4 years ago and he continues to do very well within the company. So, it seems to me that the HR department and hiring authourity, in my brother's case, had no knowledge of KW being a degree mill, or apparently didn't care.
     
  13. JNelson467

    JNelson467 New Member

    Here is my thoughts on this particular discussion:

    I believe that the reality of many individuals that may pursue a diploma mill for a degree " feel that their long term experience and tenur within a particular field warrants a experiential or PLA type degree", which is where I see how one could believe that idea.

    The concern that we all have found to have a common ground upon is utilizing CLEP, DANTES etc. and maybe pursuing a degree program from Excelsior, Charter Oaks or TESC to obtain a degree by testing out.

    It is a lack of education still or a deceitfulness for sure on a individuals part to not thoroughly seek out legitimate or respected options to complete a degree.

    For one to feel they have the experience and knowledge to be granted a degree, one would also think that they also have the knowledge to investigate before paying money to have someone validate their experience.

    In either case and to close this posting of mine, Using BAin4weeks.com and the above possible schools to test out and obtain a degree would probably be best suited and if one has the knowledge already, then their should not be any reason to not complete a program rather quickly.
     
  14. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I would guess that GE didn't know. In many companies the scrutiny given to educational reimbursement is far below what a new hire would go through. For example, at one time in the company that I work for, only the direct supervisor had to approve the reimbursement.

    It would seem that your brother was probably very deserving of the promotion and GE was happy to be able to bestow it. I hope that your brother's time bomb remains inactive. You may want to point your brother to the Senate hearings where KWU's status as a diploma mill was made painfully obvious (or delightfully obvious depending on one's view).
     
  15. BinkWile

    BinkWile New Member

    Many private organizations are lazy and don't conduct background checks, which is unfortunate. Thankfully, 99% of the time state and federal jobs do conduct background checks and will explicitly state that a degree must be accredited, and or be regional or national. Albeit, I'm sure some hic-ups exist.

    I've said this before, but it deems repeating. In my last position, my qualifications and salary were determined based upon my Masters Degree. The thing was, after a month in my new job, I realized that no one had ever asked for proof of my degree. I called my employer and asked if he wanted proof, and he said "yeah sure." So I sent him a copy of my transcripts and a scanned copy of my diploma, which by all accounts could have been faked (they weren't of course).

    Scary huh?
     
  16. tigerhead

    tigerhead New Member

    Good point, and I agree the promotion was primarily based on his performance and merit. I am just thankfull I found out about KW (primarily throught this forum) or I may have enrolled there based on his endoresment. This kind of thing worries me a little, because it seems to me that there is somewhat of a lack of knowledge on this subject in the HR world and it also worries me that these degree mills are hurting the credibility of the legitimate RA online degrees.
     
  17. mbaonline

    mbaonline New Member

    That's the reason...

    I do believe that reputational risk to DL degrees is the main reason that degree mills should be shut down and/or disgraced. It's too easy for those people who are unknowledgeable about DL to lump DL with degree mills.

    I work for one of the largest banks in the country and our tuition reimursement rules are very straightforward. Institutions have to be on the approved list from the American Council on Education www.acenet.edu in order to have tuition reimbursed. Kennedy Western isn't on the list.
     

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