Any new news on NationsU getting accredited?

Dr. Lynn, being "dishonest.... NationsUniversity...a mill and so forth shows me several of you do not know what you are talking about. Thankfully those in a position to judge have enough sense to investigate and make logical and informed decisions. Thus, your unfounded and cloaked accusations have no impact.

 

Well, in the statement you replied to, I was really speaking generally about people who post fake degrees, so in that context it's certainly not "ridiculous" unless you feel touting fake degrees is a perfectly ethical thing to do, and I'm sure you don't feel that way.

No one ever called Nations a "mill".

Relax. In case you haven't figured it out, this is a board that takes these sorts of matters very seriously, as it should. When I first posed the question, you had ample opportunity to correct it with the information you just posted in post #40, but you didn't and that leads me to think that you had to look up some information yourself because you weren't sure, and that you may still not be sure. That may or may not be the case, but it does lend some cause for doubt.

I (we) have plenty of sense, but like you none of us are perfect. Therefore, we cannot be all-knowing of all things at all times. We do a search, we see what turns up. I did see the school you listed, but I didn't think much of it because of its location. Granted, location has no bearing on anything in DL, but I still overlooked it nonetheless. It's also not as if seeing a religious program called "The International University" popping up during a search, is completely different in name from a degree being listed from a religious school named... "The International University"... give us a break, seriously.

All of that being said, I do find this interesting:

"Megatrend International University Vienna is a very young academic institution, starting only May 9, 2011 after the former “The International University” was closed by the Commercial Court of Vienna. Therefore we don’t have yet alumni of our own."

Link: International University - Alumni

As it stands, there are at least two schools with that name. One is definitely a mill. Do you know for sure which one his degree is from? Perhaps. But if I were Dr. Lynn, I'd probably specify which “The International University” the degree came from, unless even doing that would be a bad idea, considering what the link above states about the status/closing of one of the former “The International University” schools, appearing to have been a bad situation of sorts.

I think everyone here has the same purpose of finding the truth about educational institutions and their standings, and if that means being wrong at times, so be it. I personally would gladly be wrong 1,000 times than mistakenly steer someone into a bad situation that I could've helped them avoid.

 

Here is an article about the revocation of accreditation of the now defunct TIU. Translated from Geman to English using Google Translate. I would like to note, however, that I did not see any indication of it ever offering a doctorate degree of any sort.

International University: Accreditation revoked

First in the Austrian higher education landscape: It shall be for the recognition of private universities charge the Accreditation Council approval of the International University (IU) is revoked as a private university.


"The IU has never achieved the character we wanted, and not necessary readjustments done," explained the head of the Accreditation Council, Helmut Konrad, the decision to the APA.

The Council's decision must still be approved by Education Minister Elisabeth Gehrer (ÖVP).

Reservations were voiced as early as 2001

The Vienna-based IU was accredited in January 2001 as a private university. Even then, the only recognition for three years was pronounced, while other institutions received approvals for five years. "We have already given evidence at the time of necessary adjustments and this is called at regular intervals since then," said Konrad.

But especially in the area and material resources, the relationship between teaching and research and in the selection process for academic staff to have improved the situation "not satisfactory". For this reason, the Accreditation Council have launched four months ago, a revocation process that has now been completed.
...
International University
The "International University" was founded in 1980 as "United Christian College" with the main campus in Vienna and has branch offices in Kiev (Ukraine) and Altea (Spain). With three universities in the U.S., the IU has an official agreement with the degree of the IU will be recognized. Currently on campus in Vienna, the degree of "Bachelor of Arts - Diplomatic Studies", "Bachelor of Business Administration" and building upon the two master's programs offered.
-> International University
...

Revocation valid on 31 July - out of respect for students

In the interest of students - study According to Konrad currently around 200 at IU - the withdrawal of accreditation is only on 31 Effective July 2003. This is to give students the crossing at other recognized universities will be facilitated.

For the recognition of past achievements, the study committees at the respective universities are responsible. Already at IU acquired diplomas, according to Konrad remain in effect.

May remain as an education provider

The IU itself could remain as a provider of tertiary education continue to exist as it had been the even years prior to accreditation. However, foreign students from the IU would again fall under the immigration quota, in contrast to those in government or accredited universities.

In discussions with the Ministry of Education and the Rectors' Conference, the Accreditation Council trying definitely to solution models for the students.

IU will continue

The President of the International University, Wil C. Good army maintains that the withdrawal of approval as a private university back to a "big misunderstanding" of the Accreditation Council: "We are - as many universities in the USA - a teaching and no research university that is not our job, "Good army said on Monday in an interview with the APA.

Good for the army, there is no question that the IU will provide further her studies in Vienna. "We existed long before 15 years of accreditation and will continue to work after the withdrawal," said IU head. Finally, the IU graduates have excellent opportunities in the labor market.

Good and army also sees advantages in the decision of the Accreditation Council: "We are stronger now because we are now able to develop as we want and need to develop not so, as required by the Accreditation us."

 

The meaning of this phrase is less than clear to me.

"With three universities in the U.S., the IU has an official agreement with the degree of the IU will be recognized."

 

It isn't clear to me either, Kizmet - and I'm sorry I pegged the wrong "International University." I was dead wrong - it's not the Missouri & Panama one at all. Turns out the Vienna animal WAS licensed (not accredited) in Alabama at one time -- and I've seen a possible address (not campus) in Tennessee as well.

I'm checking for any links to "3 American Universities." I think they may turn out to be unaccredited religious schools. The Tennessee address was for a school of that type. In the meantime, here's a Wiki on the Vienna thing - from opening, to accreditation, to withdrawal of accreditation --- to bankruptcy and court-ordered closure:

International University Vienna - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Johann

PS - I also found an article about this (Vienna) school running into trouble, conferring about 40 unaccred. MBAs in Asia here: http://www.asiaone.com/News/Education/Story/A1Story20080916-88053.html

 

I agree with you on many issues.

You make sense to me now. I agree with much of what you wrote. As far as Dr. Lynn he is my colleague. Tomorrow I am flying to Brentwood via Nashville to be staying at the Lynn's home for a week working. Dr. Lynn and his wife are very ethical professionals. As far as Dr. Lynn's honorary D.Adm. he received from the unaccredited, and apparently closed, IU from Vienna remember it is honorary. Dr. Lynn apparently values that he was honored by IU some years ago. Nothing fishy or deceitful to be found there. His STD, and the several other degrees he has earned, coupled with over forty years as a professor/administrator with several well regarded Universities certainly speaks for it self.

As an administrator with NU I have been very honest and upfront as far as my own opinion with NationsUniversity. Simply as a way to better inform other members of this forum. NU has never been a degree mill, however, up until perhaps the past year the curriculum was strong in content, but lacked in more than one area. Thus, NU was not ready to be accredited. We have a few areas that still need work before we meet or exceed the established standards for an accredited university. One important area that is being worked is that a handful of our courses need revised looking forward to Bloom's Taxonomy of Learning Domains. We at NU are confident that both areas will be brought up to standards within a short period.

 

I agree with you on many issues.

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It is somewhat peculiar for a school who only offers master's degrees as their highest academic program to award an honorary doctorate degree. It is like an elementary school awarding an honorary high school diploma.

 

Thank you for your understanding on that. I just want to clear up my thoughts that, I don't necessarily think holding an unaccredited degree is something to look down on regarding a person's integrity, depending on the circumstance of course. I don't see an unaccredited degree as automatically equaling "fake" as I once erroneously did a decade ago. After all, pretty much every school had to at least start unaccredited and there are a number of unaccredited schools/institutions, etc that are well respected to the point of some of their programs being a prerequisite to licensure/certification in certain fields. Nations University is currently unaccredited, but no one considers it a mill and that's obviously a credit to the work put in and the reputation the organization has built as a result.

Truth is, I want Nations and other legitimate schools like it to reach accreditation and open up to even greater opportunities, because their very presence in education considering what they offer at an incredibly low (or no) cost, is something badly needed right now with tuitions for many schools resigning the unsuspecting to a life of perpetual debt.

 

Yes, I believe this happens all the time. Stephen Colbert has a honorary DFA from Knox College, a libiral arts college with no graduate programs. I'm pretty sure I've seen community colleges giving out honorary doctorates.

So it turned out the issue is blown completely out of proportion. Dr. Lynn has an honorary doctorate from school that, while a failure, was apparently serious enough to briefly secure Austrian accreditation. It is now sold to an accredited Serbian university that seems to be that country's for-profit behemoth, Phoenix of the Balkans. Nothing here screams "Harvard", but there's NO indication of anything improper, either.

It is interesting that Megatrend lists the enigmatic Drs. Igor and Grishka Bogdanoff as its physics professors. Bogdanoffs are French TV celebrities that got PhDs (in Physics and Mathematics) from University of Burgogne, after publishing several papers on Big Bang in reputable academic journals. They gained international notoriety when a rumor started their thesis was a hoax, "reverse Sokal affair". Most experts agree their papers (and dissertations) are either of a very low standard or completely meaningless. French academic authorities even completed an investigation into their degrees, and concluded the dissertations' content is very poor. Nevertheless, their degrees were duly conferred after proper defense, and thus legal and legitimate.

 

honoris causa doctorates are awarded from 4 year and master degree level colleges.

Maybe peculiar, but not unusual many colleges that do not grant earned doctorates award honorary doctorate degrees. For example Austin College

Austin College to Award Three Honorary Doctorates | Austin College

There are many more but I do not have time right now to get the information.

 

Sorry, I did not realize that that is the case. All the honorary doctorates that I was previously aware of were from universities that also offer academic doctorates. Of course, I was referring to those that are known to common people like myself, honorary degrees like Bill Gates' Doctor of Laws from Harvard or Arnold Schwarzenegger's Doctor of Laws from Emory.

 

This.

I recently heard of Nations, but can't imagine wanting to attend if it's not accredited. It's free (other than tech fee), which is amazing and incredibly needed during this economic storm.

But, I don't see why someone would want to put forth the effort needed to get a "degree" when they're really not getting a degree at all. You can't transfer Nations courses elsewhere, or use their degrees to get into a university later on, can you? I can see doing it for the sake of learning, like you do when reading a book. Do most who choose Nations just want the personal enrichment, not educational or career advancement out of it?

I hope they get accredited. An affordable school is definitely a needed thing.

 

I'd imagine that a lot of the credits from a religious degree would cover some of the requirements of a secular academic degree that aren't core courses. So you'd get some transfer utility out of it if it's accredited. If a person plans to continue studies at another religious program it would certainly have a lot of utility if it's accredited, and I know there are some programs that currently accept Nations credits even while it's still unaccredited.

The other thing is, we're in a harsh reality where having a Bachelor's in anything will give you a better chance than not having one. As an example, I was browsing some jobs on indeed using terms like "Master's, Bachelor's, Associate" to see what kinds of jobs popped up. To no surprise at all, I found lots of employers basically stating that they wanted someone with a degree, unconcerned with what the field of study was. With that thinking so widespread among general employers, you can see how important a virtually-free degree from Nations would help a person with no degree who is currently on the outside looking in and without the funds necessary to reverse view.

 

First, yes, there are organizations that will accept Nations Degrees. I was admitted to, and have since completed, a Master of Divinity at Liberty University based on my Nations Degree. I also was admitted to New Orleans Baptist Seminary, which is not only Regionally Accredited, but also ATS accredited. Of course, I later finished my accredited Bachelors from SATS, but I did not use that to get into either of these. I was admitted solely on my Bachelors from Nations.

Second, Nations is an awesome organization for getting knowledge. If your desire is to get a piece of paper with a big name school on it, for the purpose of job seeking, then perhaps Nations is not for you. However, if a person wants to be educated, but does not have the cash, Nations presents an excellent opportunity.

Last, Nations primary mission is to educate people who are presently in environments and economic situations, which provide no other opportunity. Third world countries, inmates, etc.

 

Well guys, I suppose we should hear about Nations U and its accreditation bid sometime in the next week and a half or so? I say that since the DETC is having commission meetings on Thursday and Friday (June 14th and 15th) where I believe all of their applicants will be discussed.

I hope they make it, I've always wanted to take a Religious Studies program.

 

Yeah - I'd like to see that happen too. But we shouldn't count on it. I've known DETC to take a l-o-n-g time for some decisions. Also, at times the final decision has been "no" when many thought the school was a shoo-in. The reverse is also true; DETC has sometimes accredited schools that critics hoped it wouldn't. There have been some famous comments about that in the degree-fora!

DETC is like the stock market.

(1) It serves a very useful purpose.
(2) It's hard to predict - and even harder to time.

As I said, I'm hoping, too. We'll see.

Johann

PS - I sometimes think DETC is like the stock market in a third way. Even if they were not economic or educational necessities, both would have to exist as psychological necessities.

 

I used to like Nations. Back in the day, they had an MRS in Church History, but they no longer do so now I don't too much care.

 

Any idea what happened to that program or why it was cancelled? That would have been quite interesting to take!