Aspen versus NCU, Walden, Capella or California Southern University.

I highly doubt it. Will the price increase? Probably. Unless they have staff whose living expenses never increase and bills that never increase with inflation.

But will they go as high as the others? Unlikely. The other schools participate in Title IV. CSU does not. NCU, Walden and Capella (excluding FlexPath) can charge $50k for a Masters because a typical student is going to qualify for at least some financial aid. If financial aid isn't in play then you have to have a lower tuition rate in order to stay afloat. The American College of Education has been at it for a few years and their EdD is nowhere near the cost of a doctorate at NCU despite also being RA.

I realize that NCU, Walden and CSU are all similar in that they are all for-profit schools offering doctorates and are RA. But the business model CSU employs is pretty different from the others. If you want to try to predict where CSU is going you might considering looking at schools that are more similar to it (Patten, ACE, WGU). Even that's imperfect but it's a closer comparison than just randomly selecting other schools.

 

That is also the unfortunate reality of being ABD. Many people don't find that out until they hit the brick wall when things didn't go exactly as planned. Plans fall apart. Then what? A part of the process is learning to bend without breaking. No matter who a chair is (chosen or not chosen), it's important to let them have their way because they ultimately have the power to nix a dream.

 

Agreed: CSU looks like a good choice, as long as a student understands that the dissertation is going to be the most challenging portion of the program.

 

Understood.

 

AV8R,

Sorry to offend your sensibilities, and without the need to be snarky but straightforward, it is MY money, time, effort, needs and goals that are at stake, NOT YOURs, UNLESS of course you are willing to provide me with a significant financial stipend to attend a school that YOU feel fits the bill.

Seeking an online doctoral program at a school that is not religious in its orientation, not overly priced (which many of them are), that meets the flexible needs of older and very career accomplished applicants, as well as being accredited by a gold standard accrediting agency, is NOT searching for a unicorn but for the right fit! Anyone who does not perform their "homework" with due diligence prior to entering an online doctoral program is taking a major risk, financially and in terms of effort and time, and will regret not doing so in retrospect. Unless of course you will bail them out by paying the tab.

 

Me again, although it is important to "bend without breaking", the fact is that if the student and chair do not mesh it can be disastrous!

Many ABD's are in their predicament because their chair stymied their progression for myriad reasons, some legitimate, some personal, which makes it essential to have a say as to the selection of the chair. And lets face it. Many of the for profit online distance doctoral programs are not exactly paradigms of academic excellence nor are their faculty members, many of whom are run of the mill educators with no outstanding credentials or academic achievements to brag about. So while a young student may look up to these educators as being special and comply to their dictates without questioning their necessity, I and many other older, seasoned professionals do not, necessitating a more flexible, open and accessible educational environment which is so essential within the context of a distance online doctoral program.

 

Not offended in the least, Jan. Here lately we seem to have a bit of a problem on this forum with people dropping in seeking guidance on finding a doctoral program. The good people here then offer perfectly reasonable recommendations, but the recommendations are never good enough for some reason. It gets old.

The idea of "searching for a unicorn" simply means you are looking for something that does not exist. You say you are looking for a program that doesn't "demand unquestionable compliance." Oh, and don't forget that you want to pick out your own dissertation committee chairperson, too! It also must be cheap, secular, online, etc. etc.

Yes, you are clearly on a unicorn hunt. You are looking for something that doesn't exist.

 

Me again, does your reference to CSU in several posts imply that you attended this school and did not complete a doctorate due to the challenging nature of the dissertation? Please let me know. Thanks. Jan

 

Hi steve, the curriculum of Cumberland looks very solid but the religious issue just does not jive with my needs and values. Thank you, Jan

 

I completed a doctorate at NCU, but was stunned when the dissertation process began because there was no hand-holding. The student does the work and is expected to know how to initiate it, repeatedly edit and re-draft it, execute it, evaluate and assess it, and then present the findings.

Most non-research courses at the undergraduate and graduate level are "academic busybody work." It's not hard, but it's definitely time-consuming. For example, non-research courses will provide a syllabus with specific instructions on what is required to pass the course. However, at the dissertation level, there is no syllabus to tell a student how to conduct their research. The student is expected to already:
- know how to do research (either quantitative, qualitative or mixed methods)
- know how to properly execute it and evaluate it

The vast majority of coursework is "academic busybody work." However, research and busybody work are completely different from each other. As night differs from day, so research differs from academic busybody work. Most students do not understand that difference, until they hit the brick wall.

I currently teach research to undergraduate students -- and it is an extremely difficult concept for most students to grasp because they have never done it before. It's like introducing them to a new language that they've never heard. The "deer in headlights look" comes to mind. I provide a lot of hand-holding since it is undergraduate.

 

Me Again, thanks for the feedback. I completed all my doctoral coursework and had my doctoral topic, literature review and methodology approved prior to requiring several contiguous surgeries, necessitating my focusing on my health and not completing the degree. It was a major disappointment but that is life. This is the reason why I am carefully reviewing my options, not to seek an easy path to complete my doctorate, but one in which I will feel comfortable and which will lead to completion of the program before I croak (lol).

It is interesting to note that CSU does not appear to require the actual implementation of the methodology but a critical review and analysis (meta-analysis?) of the extant literature. Are you aware of the protocol for completing the doctoral project at CSU? If so I would appreciate your feedback. Regards, Jan

 

Steve, at what stage of this doctoral program are you involved?

 

Implementation v. Critical Review

I have no connections or insight on the methodologies used at CSU.

As a general observation, there appears to be a push to seperate the PhD from all the other doctorates, such as the DBA, EdD, DM, DA, etc.

For example, it seems that many dissertations for the DBA, EdD, DM, etc. "do not require the actual 'implementation of a methodology,' but only a critical review and analysis of the existent literature" (your words for the most part). This can include:
- qualitative research
- phenomenological research
- exploring pre-existing quantitative research (but not requiring the generation of new quantitative research)

Conversely, the PhD seems to retain the requirement to "implement a methodology" in a lab, in the field or in animals or humans to discover something new to add to the existing body of literature.

 

If you are interested in pursuing a doctorate for "personal satisfaction," I strongly suggest getting a hobby. Many who want to earn a doctorate don't fully realize what they are getting themselves into.

I think you are being way too hasty in crossing off University of the Cumberlands. There are several board members who are in the program right now. You didn't even bother to ask them about their experiences at first. You made a quick assumption and then crossed it off your list.

Yes, of course I do. But I also believe it is possible to be too rigid in your requirements. Unless you compromise on what you are looking for in a school, I do not believe you are going to find one that meets all of your requirements. Since you have indicated you want this for personal satisfaction anyway, what does it matter? If you just want to be Dr. Jan and the degree has absolutely no bearing on your career, then just go through a DEAC program and be done with it.

I never implied such a thing. Not in the least. As previously indicated, I believe your list of requirements is too rigid and too long. You seem too quick to cross certain schools off your list. You expect the school to have a great deal of flexibility, but you do not want to be flexible yourself. You are setting yourself up for failure.

The point I'm making in all of this (that apparently completely escapes you) is that you are unlikely to find a degree program that matches the very rigid list of requirements you have mentioned. You can call me a fool if it makes you feel better, but I know a unicorn hunt when I see one.

 

Me Again, thanks for the feedback. Jan

 

AV8R, if you wish to abide by your "guiding " principles so be it. I will abide by mine. Have a good day.

 

Steve, I would appreciate your feedback regarding several questions I have about this program.

How do you find the level of accessibility of faculty?

Did you have a say in the selection of a dissertation chair and committee?

What is the mode of assessment for coursework (eg., papers, proctored exams, etc).

Is a comprehensive exam required?

Thanks, Jan