ITT Tech is closing

The Army experience was enough communal experience for me.

 

When I did my first Graduate Program colloquium on campus at then-Vermont College of Norwich University, I remember one guy showing up with a gigantic boom box and a rather large cooler full of beer. He said that he had missed the “college experience,” so he was determined to live it over colloquium week. I’m unaware of whether he succeeded.

At the same colloquium, they had “Mandala centering exercises” on the quad every morning at 6:00. I wasn’t about to wake up that early, so I simply visualized that it might consist of people sitting naked on the grass in a circle chanting, “Nelson! Nelson!” (Mandela, get it?)

I do have to admit that these days, when I see a for-profit hit the dust, the first word I think of is schadenfreude. Best explained in the musical Avenue Q: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5isHw02S0Cg.

 

Steve! Ich wusste nicht, dass Sie Deutsch so gut sprechen könnten. :smile:

I agree with Bruce, Decimon and Steve on the "college experience" front.

Some feel it's indispensable,
Some say it's indefensible. (Song I haven't written yet.)

As for me, I look at the tag and wonder if it's worth the asking price. If it's Harvard, Princeton etc. and you're going to make life-long connections, maybe. Otherwise...

None at all, Bruce, except it would have to be the most desperate school(s) on the list. I hereby declare nominations officially open. :smile:

J.

 

deleted dup. J.

 

Ich kann nicht. Das ist, was Google Übersetzen ist für. :biggrin:

 

A few community colleges in my area (Ohio) have been trying to welcome / enroll ITT students.

As a side note, my wife and I were just singing a Dusseldorf hockey fight song (DEG)... but even after living there for a while, my German is still terrible. Then again, someone from the Bayern region or as close as Koln might make think that as well

 

For me, personally, I wouldn't mind my children attending any of the colleges I attended with the exception of the two for-profits that I regret having attended. If they can get into better colleges at a decent price, then that will be better. I wouldn't think my kids deserve more than lower class kids. Maybe this wasn't your intention, but your post reads as if it is okay for people to believe that their kids are too good for open admission for-profits while thinking they are perfectly fine for everyone else.

Everyone wants to throw in politics for why ITT Tech was hit so hard, but we are forgetting the most important factor. Very few schools have the type of direct loan program that ITT Tech had. Their tuition was priced well above the federal loan limits, so students either had to come up with several thousand dollars out of pocket or borrow from the school. When the students took out a no interest loan, they were not informed that it had to be paid back in 12 months. So, when the balance became due, that loan was converted over to a high interest loan. ITT Tech is one of the worst schools I'm aware of for taking advantage of students and misrepresenting themselves.

 

Wie immer, Steve. So komisch und so wahr! :smile: As always, Steve. So funny and so true! :smile:

J.

 

As with so many other things, Democrats AND Republicans have a lot of hypocrisy; but, I doubt you will ever admit that.

 

There's hypocrisy everywhere, but the Democrats have taken it to a new stratosphere. You said;

But, you now try to ignore the absolutely breathtaking hypocrisy of attacking for-profit colleges, while simultaneously collecting millions of dollars from the very same.

As far as hypocrisy goes, that takes the cake.

 

I didn't ignore it. I responded to Phdtobe, who was talking about Fox News. Fox News is a Republican cable network. You point to a Democratic politician who is not even running for office as proof that all Democrats are invested in for-profit colleges while also demonizing them. This is not the case. There have been more Republicans and conservatives who have spoken out against same-sex marriage while engaging in homosexual activities and cheating on their spouses while talking about the sanctity of marriage.

 

Nosborne48 - A quick check of the ABET website revealed no ITT programs accredited.

Regards - Andy Borchers

 

I said absolutely nothing about children being "too good" for any college. In fact, I spent quite a bit of time articulating how many people choose colleges not based upon how they are intrinsically better than others but simply because of differing goals.

The notion that kids going to a "better" college are just "too good" is your own addition.
My preference that my kids go to a four year college straight through has nothing to do with thinking they are too good for a community college. I'm taking pretty extreme measures to save up for their education so that they don't have to. They can pick a school and enjoy a good four year run. The way I have my 529s set up both of my kids can pay for four years of a SUNY school and walk away debt free.

Keep in mind, three of the undergrad colleges of Cornell are technically state schools and charge the SUNY rate. So that's potentially on the table.

But if my kids want to be ultrasound technicians, paramedics, or if they choose to go to a CC to save some money so that the savings can fund professional or graduate school, that's their choice. But you aren't saving money transferring CC credits into Cornell. Many people in Central New York do it, but it turns a four year degree into a five year degree and you lose a bunch of credits in the mix.

Albany elite are never sending their kids to community college. Does that mean they shouldn't support them?

It has nothing to do with "my kids are too good let the peasants have this." Do some people have that attitude? Possibly. But I'd say there are many more thinking "yeah, I have the connections and the access to elite education for my kids. But a poor family doesn't have that. They should have options too."

Though you didn't name it in this discussion it sounds like you'd take issue with your kids attending CTU. I can't imagine I'd recommend it as a first choice for my kids but my education there was just fine. If my son or daughter had to choose between say, a full scholarship at CTU or paying full price at small liberal arts school with no particular reputation, I think CTU would have to at least be a reasonable consideration. And why not? I make a fine living with my degree.

Naturally, if my kids to choose to follow in my footsteps and work in HR I'd love for them to go to Cornell ILR, one of the best HR programs in the country. As New York residents they automatically have a leg up over out of state residents. So should I not support CCs? Are they just for "everyone else?" Of course not. Nor are my kids too good for a CC.

It's very contextual. And there are no clear black and white lines. So no, a GOP politician is unlikely to send his kid to a for-profit school. So what? I don't see our democratic governors sending their kids to a community college either. Why is it different for them to send their kids to Columbia while making community colleges available "for everyone else?" Are their kids too good for a CC?

There is nothing intrinsically wrong with for-profit education. There is nothing intrinsically wrong with for-profit medicine. Indeed, the only problem with either seems to be when government funds get involved. Then it becomes a whole big mess.

If for-profit is so evil then go find yourself a non-profit dentist.

 

BOOM!!! <mic drop>

The whole concept of "non-profit" is a scam to me. With the presidents of many "non-profits" making over $1 million per year, and with endowments in the billions (small B) of dollars, someone is sure has hell making a profit.

 

In my opinion, CTU costs too much for the quality of education they provide. If I'm going to send my kids to a lower tier school, then it's going to be one that's cheap.

No one ever said that being for profit is intrinsically bad in all sectors. However, the healthcare system in the U.S. is extremely expensive and out of reach for many people (going into debt by going to emergency rooms is not a good alternative), so I don't know if that's the best example. Going to the dentist is one of the first things people avoid, not just because they don't like dentists, but because they can't afford to go to one. Thankfully, there are public and non-profit organizations that offer dental services to the poor.

Bruce can help you pick that mic up.

 

We've gone through this before. If you think earning a salary is earning a profit, then you earn a profit off your police work every time you get paid. If you think receiving donations that are used to provide discount or free services is earning a profit, then every time your department does some kind of drive, they are earning a profit. A lot of people already think the police write tickets and confiscate items for profit.

 

Oh, they do! At least they do with confiscating items for profit. It's called civil forfeiture, and it's a major problem that needs addressing.

Policing for Profit - Institute for Justice

 

Now you're starting to understand that there's really no such thing as "non-profit".

 

Yeah. I'm going to tell that charity that helped my family with clothing, food, and school supplies years ago that their non-profit status is a scam. We could have just walked into Target and gotten that stuff for free.

Actually, I've gathered long ago that you don't understand the business concepts of for-profit and non-profit.

 

Yet companies that hire only ABET accredited degreed professionals also hire in the other departments non ABET and actually even non RA accredited professionals.
In some IT departments that design, develop, implement and support world class infrastructure for Telecom and Computer Information systems, cloud based and enterprise premise based solutions with people who graduated ITT as well.
Many are certified professionals that required to re certify every two years vs a PE who passed exam soe 10 years ego.