Construction trade....

Ok guys I've been tapped by my father in law to help him manage his drywall interior construction company. I'm so new to this I don't know what to do. He said go take courses on estimating and bidding but I wanna go all out and I've found a certificate in engineering and architectural auto cad. It's a two month intensive course 9-5pm. Supposedly after this program I should be able to hit the ground running understanding renderings and designs.
Secondly, I've signed up for a cost estimating and bidding course. It's a weekend long intensive 9-5 course with a certificate of completion from Green education services. And last I'm gonna take a course in blueprint reading which is also intensive.

Would this be enough to start? I'm trying to make sure I get my money's worth with all this.

Anyone offer some advice? I would also like to start with an internship at a local firm and was wondering if any firm would take a total newbie?

 

Hello? Anyone?

 

There are a few problems with you question. The first is that we don't know anything about your educational background. There are, for example construction management certificate programs that require that you have a college degree just to start. Others are undergrad certs that a high school grad can start. The second problem is that you haven't really said much about your goals. You said that your f-i-l tells you to learn something about estimating, bidding, etc, but then you sign into an auto cad course. Not really very close. Do you want a whole program (maybe 6 courses) that will earn you a cert or do you just want to take courses to learn specific skills? Start looking at local community colleges and then look at this program to see which courses might relate to your goals.

Online Certificate Programs | University of Washington - UW Online

 

Alright! Thanks, now we are getting started.

Ok, I have a BA in Economics and mostly worked as an analyst for a credit card processing company and now I'm in market research doing quant stuff. Totally different ballgame.

I've always wanted to do architecture and urban planning so I planned a career change and that's why I'm already in an auto cad program starting off as a drafter. Then I was going to move into an architecture program. But my FIL hinted at me helping him out with his drywall interior company.

It was just a hint that he needed help it wasn't an immediate offer so essentially im interested in learning the basics to hit the ground running.

I was just wondering if these classes might be a waste of time. I've already started the auto cad certificate so I'm at least finishing it and hoping it relates by being able to read the specs and designs better. My FIL is always talking about the arguments he gets into with the designers, LOL. I just figured it would be helpful.

Anyways after all the classes I was hoping to do an apprenticeship with one of the unions out here them at offer them in CA. The bidding/estimating and blueprint reading classes that I listed are just seminar courses that run 9-5 for a weekend or two. They're very basic.

I didn't even think of signing up for a construction management certificate. If I do it'd have to be cheap enough to pay out of pocket. I'm in Los Angeles right now.

 

Cool, you can start off using these:


Cheap, easy, fun, and it involves urban planning as well. :smokin: Sorry could not resist.

All joking aside, UCLA Extension School has a Construction Management Certificate: Here is the link. Estimated tuition is around $7,500. Now you have to specify "cheap" and "inexpensive" as they are highly vague. Cheap, to me might mean $500 bucks, to the next person cheap may mean $10,000 bucks. You get my drift?

 

I would give my left arm to go to that ucla program but that's not cheap for me. I think the program is like 900 bucks a class. I would do one class a quarter so it might take me a long time to finish.
I've been busting my hump looking for the same kind of certificate at the local CC level but couldn't find any that I know of. Perhaps I'm looking hard enough. I should check out the occupational centers.

The ucla program is perfect and reasonable, I can afford it its just it would take me quite a while to finish and do you think I can get an entry level job with little experience? Perhaps an apprenticeship in the least?

 

"an entry level job" doing what? Carrying bundles of shingles up a ladder? Wrestling conduit? Nailing 2x4s? Entry level jobs in the construction business don't necessarily require any experience at all. Work hard, do whatever you're told, don't break anything. Entry level jobs in construction management usually require either substantial experience in multiple trades or the full blown academic thing.

You seem to be torn between two very different fields. That's not unusual around here. There's lots of people pursuing multiple directions or changing fields. You may want to think about what kind of info you need in order to make the choice.

 

Actually I'm not torn. I want to do construction management. What I was asking about was entry level in the management side, like working in the office estimating, bidding or managing a project. I was wondering if it could be done with just the education and not the background working on the ground actually putting up the sheet rock.

I was wondering if they had apprenticeships for the managing side. I was wondering if I could get started after the certificates and go straight into entry level office work with a firm.

 

UC Riverside Extension: Professional Certificate in Construction Management
“The cost to complete the program is approximately $3,500. This does not include textbooks or materials unless otherwise noted.”
Construction Management Certificate: Certificate Programs

LSU: Post Baccalaureate Certificate in CM (online) – 6 courses /18-credit hours
https://www.cm.lsu.edu/academics/online/certificate

Ashworth College (DEAC): Undergraduate Construction Management Certificate (5 Courses)
https://www.ashworthcollege.edu/undergraduate-certificates/construction-management/
https://www.ashworthcollege.edu/undergraduate-certificates/construction-management/tuition/

UK Option...

Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors (RICS): Certificate in Construction Project Management (DL)
Certificate in Construction Project Management
http://www.rics.org/Global/Certificate%20course%20in%20Construction%20Project%20Management%20%282%29.pdf
RICS is incorporated by Royal Charter
Royal Charter and byelaws
http://www.rics.org/Global/RICS-Constitution.pdf[/url]

 

You guys rock! Keep it coming, I'm gonna research all of them.

To answer my question, can you get entry level office work in the trade, no ground experience after earning the certs?

 

My only other suggestion at this point is that you go to a site like monster.com, search out jobs that fit you employment goals and look to see what credentials (experience, academics, etc.) they require. This should begin to give you a sense of what you'll need to do in order to get there.

 

By way of background, my dad is a framing, drywall, and painting contractor. I did basic labor for him when I was a teenager but decided to follow a different path.

Your FILs advice is in line with what my dad told me years ago, take courses in estimating and bidding. I think my dad actually suggested inpecting (don't recall the exact title) so I could sign off on work and blueprints for him or something like that. If you want to move up then the construction management programs are probably a good idea, along with basic experience. If you prefer a traditional education then I would suggest business management or accounting.

CAD, urban planning, architecture, etc. is a completey different business.

 

I know CAD is a totally different ballgame but I had started it before my FIL mentioned joining him and now I just want to finish it. I was looking to go into drafting and then architecture, but I was at least hoping it would fit somehow with it such as reading designs better and such. But all in all you think it's just not relevant at all?

Basic management courses would do me better? Last, lacking ground work experience, would it be ok to just start off in the office with just the education?

 

UF has had DL construction management programs for a while now. This is one you might be interested in: International Construction Management Certificates » M.E. Rinker, Sr. School of Construction Management


Don't know what the cost is nowadays.


Also, if you are interested in cost estimating, you might be interested in taking a course from the Appraisal Institute on Real Estate Appraising. There are usually offered at your local Appraisal Institute chapter and much cheaper than a university class. Not really geared for people in construction, but when I did the courses a while ago, there was a part that covered cost estimating based on construction, rather than "comps" or rental income, that you might find relevant.

 

I refrained from commenting for a day or two because I wanted to really give it a good think about how I would handle the exact same situation. There are a ton of job transitions where I would just say "Go get a certificate and try to wiggle your way into the field."

But I also believe there are certain jobs that really warrant a more personal approach. Were I in your exact same position I would probably start cold calling a few local construction companies and see if I could convince one to train me for a fee. Generally speaking, unpaid internships walk a grey ethical and legal line when they are administered by for-profit companies. Even more so in fields like construction where the Department of Labor is constantly on the lookout for the hiring of people "under the table."

But, if you pay them, there is very little risk, at least to begin the conversation. And, honestly, if you run into a friendly local owner who empathizes with your desire to break into the business they may be willing to offer you much more meaningful guidance than I could possibly offer you. Best case scenario? You can walk away from a meeting with the start of an excellent mentor relationship and possibly a brief training overview that would either complement or surpass the outcomes of that weekend intensive. Worst case? They either brush you off or send you to the same sort of courses we are pointing out.

 

California is a great state that offer apprenticeships but I don't know if it's for the office side of things. I have to inquire further but if I wanted to jump into drywall it's there.

 

Just my opinion and its free so that may be what its worth. Getting a degree in architecture to work in drywall is like getting a PhD in nutrition to flip burgers. It might be personally useful and interesting and you will certainly know more than everyone else, but will it make you a better burger flipper? Probably not.

Get a mix of hands on (hang some drywall) and office work. Get the essential education as recommended by your FIL. There is nothing wrong with architecture and CAD and other things; I just don't think it will be of much benefit if what you want to do is drywall. OTOH, drywall may be a means of earning a living while you pursue other interests. Nothing wrong with that either.

 

LOL! Wow! That's an amazing and funny analogy. I had no idea it would be considered over qualified. But wouldn't it be a good thing that I would have a head start like that?

Are you saying that it's not useful at all in the sense that it's not relevant or that it's basically getting an MD to be an elementary school nurse? But wouldn't that give me an advantage? I would like to just come in with a plethora of credentials, knowledge and understanding to hit the ground running and just impress. I will take an apprenticeship to do some ground work and get my hands dirty but that's not what I want to do really. I want to be in the office managing projects, estimating and bidding.

So all in all if I come back with an auto cad certificate in engineering and architectural design, construction management certificate and at least a years apprenticeship on the ground work. How will the look?

 

I think I've already given you all the information I have to give. While drywall is a skilled trade, it is not rocket science. Maybe my familiarity growing up around the trade causes some bias though. Get some hands on and see if you really like it, get the certificates and short courses to help with the admin side, and then see what advanced education you would like or need to pursue.

I wish you all the best.

 

The problem with being over qualified is that prospective employers will assume that you'll move on to another job ASAP (regardless of your reassurances). If an MD applies for a school nurse position, wouldn't you, as the school administrator, just assume that the MD will quickly tire of calling parents to come pick up their sick kids and move on to a regular MD job?