Very unusual Doctorate at Harrison Middleton University (DETC school)

Just data. I just added up the 5 national accrediting bodies that approve degrees, not the other 46 national accrediting bodies that are more specialized. You may not like the implications of the data, and come up with straw-man arguments against it, but data is data.

 

You don't even need a doctorate to teach at most of the schools accredited by ACICS. After conducting a search on ACICS' website, only 83 schools offer a masters and/or doctorate.

ACCSC doesn't even have an option to search for doctoral degrees, so I'm assuming there are none at any of their schools. According to a search on ACCSC's website, only 7 of their schools offer masters degrees.

Getting a doctorate to teach in vo-tech programs is overkill. One wouldn't even be qualified to teach most of the courses in vo-tech programs with a Doctor of Art. One would only qualify to teach their limited number of general education courses. You don't need a doctorate to teach undergraduate general education courses at most NA schools.

I believe DETC has about 70 degree-granting institutions. Just imagine how few DETC schools offer graduate degrees out of those 70 schools. Just imagine how few of the graduate degrees at all of the NA schools are non-religious degrees in the liberal arts.

All of this is not even counting the NA schools that prefer hiring people with RA degrees.

 

You don't need a doctorate to teach at Harrison Middleton. They list 19 "tutors", and 10 of them have no degree higher than a master's. Of the rest, I count 3 PhDs, 2 EdDs, and 4 with various law degrees (JD, Executive JD, and LLM).

 

A DA credential isn't going to hurt you in any of your scenarios. I get it though, if you don't like something you can come up with complicated circle arguments against it. No worries dude, piece!

 

I don't think anyone dislikes HMU or their doctoral programs -- the question is whether the benefits are worth the costs. There is no need for any complicated circular arguments, just the simple point that the DA program costs more than $20,000. It may be true that the DA credential "isn't going to hurt you", but then again, it may not provide $20,000+ worth of benefits either.

HMU has actually conferred two DA degrees in its history, so there apparently are some people who do perceive a net benefit from this program. And if it worked for them, then that's great. But two seems like kind of a small number.

 

Yes - couldn't be much smaller. I like it! A very small, exclusive academic club! :smile: Another reason to like HMU - and I do!

Johann

 

I suspect your count of 3,000+ NA schools includes a very large number of schools teaching subjects like cosmetology and truck driving, granting no degrees and offering no apparent gen ed teaching, that are accredited by NA agencies that also happen to accredit degree-granting schools.

For example, the ACCSC accredits numerous degree-granting schools. Here is every single school the ACCSC accredits in my friendly state here Massachusetts. If I'm not mistaken, you're counting each of these towards your 3,000+ NA schools.

Bancroft School of Massage Therapy
Bay State School of Technology
Catherine Hinds Institute of Esthetics
Everest Institute (2 locations listed separately)
Hallmark Institute of Photography
J & J Driving School and Logistics
Le Cordon Bleu College of Culinary Arts
Massachusetts School of Barbering
Millennium Training Institute
MotoRing Technical Training Institute
National Aviation Academy of New England
New England Hair Academy
New England School of Photography
New England Tractor Trailer Training of Massachusetts
North Bennet Street School
Porter and Chester Institute (2 locations listed separately)

Only one out of these 18 NA schools offers a degree. That's Le Cordon Bleu and the degree is an AAS in Culinary Arts. It degree plan (from their catalog, pdf) includes 5 gen ed courses – 100-level Composition, College Math, and Public Speaking, and 200-level Cultural Diversity and Art Appreciation.

Ed, did you do anything to limit the enormous number of NA schools like the other 17 from your count?

 

Unless, of course, what makes one happy is using the degree. Then "some company or school" becomes incredibly relevant.

That said, we should guard against confusing the big picture with individual situations, which can vary broadly, blur lines, etc.

I would be very interested in hearing how a degree from HMU would be used.

 

The degree can be used in a number if ways. Not all college graduates have a traditional job. Some start a business or work as a freelancer.

 

Apparently, you think it's worth it to spend over $20k on a degree that is either not accepted or not needed to teach at most schools. If you think it's worth it to get a DA to teach at a truck driving school, then more power to you. It's really not that complicated.

 

Few regular readers or posters here would would argue this point. I can't imagine many people seeing a doctorate in "great books" are looking for the kinds of tangible benefits you mention. As far as teaching goes, one would be lucky to even teach at NA schools with this degree on their CV. It's largely a vanity credential, and there are way more credible ones to get for that price or less elsewhere.

The kind of strongly worded response that Ed Edwards got to his commentary might or might not have been merited. Such a response might keep someone from unwisely jumping into an overly expensive program with low ROI, but it might also inhibit new/infrequent/casual posters from jumping in when they feel prompted to.

 

Every single post Ed Edwards has made in this thread seems to me to be trying to belittle someone. Emphases added:

Yes, a "3,000+" count of NA schools that seems to consist very heavily of non-degree, no-general-education schools teaching subjects like HVAC repair and barbering.

Note the goalpost shifting: Now our standard for an investment of over $20 000 and years of hard work should be that it "isn't going to hurt you." We're a consumer webboard.

 

This....

I apologize if I derailed the thread.

 

IIRC, in other recent threads Ann has been asking about adjuncting work.

 

She did ask for our opinion and mentioned legitimate accreditation. I don't know why accreditation would be all that important if the person doesn't intend to use the degree.

 

Okay, so getting a doctorate at HMU won't give you a rare blood disorder. Fine. but back to the point: what is such a degree used for?

Yeah, we get that some people are in private practice and, thus, might (might) be less concerned about the utility/acceptance of their doctorate. But that explains exactly nothing. How would one practice using this degree? Doing what and for whom?

And no, the community-college-distinguisher concept is merely hypothetical, not established. Ironic, since the original purpose of the Doctor of Arts degree, regardless of which academic discipline was awarding it, was to focus on teaching, not research. Hence, the alternate title vice the Ph.D. Where would someone take a DA from HMU and teach with it because they held that degree?

I can see a use for K-12 teachers, assuming HMU's accreditation didn't get in the way.

 

ATTENTION: Public Service Announcement:

If you get a degree from an NA school, especially a DETC school, please be aware:

- Upon leaving the graduation stage (or upon opening your degree mailer), you will be met by several police officers, and you will be cuffed, and hauled off in a squad car.

- While in the squad car on the way to the station, you will be beaten intermittently by a backseat officer while being reminded with loud shouting that you have an NA degree.

- Once in the prison elevator, you will be beaten some more, followed by a short review session in which you are allowed to peruse the brochures of all the RA schools you could've attended. Once done, it's back to beating.

- You will be thrown into a small prison cell packed with 5 other RA grads who will take turns beating you while reciting excerpts from various Regional accreditation handbooks.

- After 90 days of beating and waiting, you will be sentenced in court to work as an assistant fry cook at Burger World, because with that NA degree there is no WAY you'd be in demand enough or skilled enough to be the head french fryer.

Don't let this happen to YOU. Always choose RA!

This has been a DegreeInfo Public Service announcement

 

It's nice to see that they've lightened up a bit since the old days (Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!):haha:

 

...¿No? Creo que usted no tiene razón, Kizmet! :smile:

Johann