How has a DL doctorate helped you?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by SurfDoctor, May 15, 2010.

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  1. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Joking aside, Ike, congratulations. That is quite an accomplishment. I hope I can do 1/4 as well as you!

    May I ask which school you got your doctorate from?
     
  2. Ike

    Ike New Member

    Sure. I am always ready to share :)
     
  3. Ike

    Ike New Member

    I received my doctorate from Nova Southeastern University (the Graduate School of Computer and Information Sciences).
     
  4. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    I've been told that Nova is the cream of the DL crop. Not easy. Not cheap, either. Good work!

    I have a young friend who is trying to decide on a career. He is studying to be an engineer but not liking it that much. What do you think the job outlook for kid, fresh out with a BS, would be in your field?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 17, 2010
  5. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    Just to be clear - Nova is a good B&M school with a large DL program.
     
  6. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Is Nova a for-profit?
     
  7. Ike

    Ike New Member

  8. Ike

    Ike New Member

    If employment is the most important thing to him, he should consider a program in the medical field (pharmacy, nursing, physical therapy, medicine, radiology, etc).
     
  9. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    I don't know. Here is my take (for what it is worth) - all schools are "for-profit". If they do not make some money they can not exist. The only school I would say is non-profit is Nations U. that offers free degrees to many and $100 per year to those that can pay. State schools that charge $200-300 per credit, well, sounds like they make something.

    If a school is for-profit, they answer to the shareholders. If the enrollment is low or the education quality it poor, something will change...someone needs to take ownership. Is this story about Northeastern Illinois University professor a profit or non-profit? How does that determine the quality of staff or education?

    My wife was looking at a state school at one point and the parking sticker had to be purchased. It cost something like $200 a year for the "gold" sticker and $75 a year for the "common" sticker. The gold sticker entitled you to park in the closer lots. When we were discussing the fact that we were going to buy the gold, the woman said "don't bother, people park where every they want anyway. If you get here later in the day you will have to park in the far lot and take the tram to the campus." My wife also told the admission person that she got great grades for her AA and asked about scholarships. She was told, "they tell you to work hard and get good grades but, honestly, it does not matter here."

    We then went to a private for-profit school and she was treated well, would get the same degree from professors that took the time to meet here and discuss Broadcast Communications (which was the major), and tell her what to expect. The cost was a bit more but we were treated like people - not sheeple (people being hearded like sheep). Which one sounds like a school you want to attend?

    Maybe I just don't understand enough. I am sure someone will enlighten me.
     
  10. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Good term, sheeple. That's the feeling I had when I went to Cal State Long Beach for a year. The schools are so big that the staff there looses any personal contact with the students. Try asking someone a question at CSULB, staff will hardly speak to you, brush you off and act offended that you were causing trouble in the herd!
     
  11. Dave Wagner

    Dave Wagner Active Member

    That's what Nova students and graduates say alright... :)
     
  12. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Or consider Dartmouth College, a prestigious Ivy League institution. The "sticker price" to attend Dartmouth as an undergraduate, including tuition, room, and board, is $47,694 per year. So Dartmouth definitely must be "making something", right? How can they possibly be considered a "non-profit" when they collect that kind of money ?

    Well, here's the answer: Dartmouth spends $108,924 per student per year. That's what it costs to maintain a beautiful campus with world-class professors, intimate classes, and state-of-the-art research facilities. So Dartmouth loses some $60,000 per year on every student they enroll -- it's actually more than that, because many students can't afford the "sticker price" and get financial aid. And that's why Dartmouth is considered a "non-profit" institution.

    How can Dartmouth stay afloat when it loses so much money? Because it is subsidized by a multibillion dollar private endowment and generous donations from their wealthy alumni base. Non-profit state schools typically operate at a loss as well, with government subsidies (ultimately derived from taxpayers) making up the difference.

    You are confusing "profit" and "revenue". A school can collect "revenue" and yet still operate at a loss -- in which case there is zero "profit".
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 17, 2010
  13. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    Thanks for the clarification. I knew it was something like that and I was sure someone would take the high road and clarify tactfully. Personally, I still don't care if a school is for-profit or non-profit. I am hung up on to many other things in life :eek:
     
  14. DBA_Curious

    DBA_Curious New Member

    Well, yes and no.

    Operating at a chronic loss doesn't make an institution a non-profit. A non-profit has to reinvest its profits into its mission instead of distributing them to its shareholders. Because non-profits serve a mission other than maximizing their shareholders' wealth, they are often funded by donations and/or grants.

    So, to clarify, Dartmouth may be a non-profit because they have a commitment to reinvesting any profits into their mission but that loss you've described isn't necessarily part of that. Technically, that could happen at a 'for-profit' that's poorly run. And yes, that can happen at a poorly run not for profit as well.

    I know what you mean so my argument is semantics at best but if someone were unfamiliar with the definitions, your post could read as if any institution running at a loss could qualify as a not for profit. That's not the case. It's all in the mission and how funds are used.
     
  15. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    State schools like CSULB charge below-market tuition rates (compare CSULB tuition to that of private USC, for example). And so they typically lose money with every student that they educate. In theory, they can afford to do this, because they are subsidized by state government.

    But in practice, this doesn't always work, especially in the current economic climate. State governments may cut back on their subsidies, yet they may not allow tuition to rise or admissions to drop either. So the schools have to cut corners, with familiar consequences. You get huge classes, poor service from the administration, and high supplemental fees for parking, etc.

    In such cases, for-profit schools may be an attractive alternative. The for-profits will typically charge more for tuition, and are likely to offer only in-demand subjects. However, they can often offer better service than a non-profit affected by budgetary problems.

    One downside with for-profits is that they are almost never selective or prestigious. If a school makes a profit on every student, then obviously more students means more profit. So the for-profits have a financial incentive to admit as many applicants as possible (even if they are poorly qualified) and to keep them enrolled in the program (even if they are poor performers).

    Of course, many non-profits aren't selective or prestigious either. But many other non-profits are. A school that expects to lose thousands of dollars educating each student has an obvious incentive to limit admissions to the most highly qualified applicants, and to flunk out students who aren't capable. That's why the most selective and prestigious universities in any region (and nationwide) are almost always non-profits.
     
  16. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    In theory, you are correct: it is obviously possible for any for-profit endeavor, including a school, to lose money. And that doesn't make them "non-profit".

    But in practice, an unsuccessful for-profit school is probably going to close (just like any other unsuccessful business). I doubt that there are many for-profits that continue to lose money on their students, year after year. Yet non-profits routinely operate this way for decades, or even centuries.
     
  17. gettingthere

    gettingthere New Member

    ike, what degree did you get?
     

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