NJ Governor wants to merge TESC into Rutgers

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by scaredrain, Mar 17, 2010.

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  1. bazonkers

    bazonkers New Member

    I should retake the verbal GRE now that I've read your post. That has to be worth at least a 100 point improvement. :)
     
  2. major56

    major56 Active Member

    That’ a good one … :D
     
  3. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    Or you could go back to Excelsior and major in Sociology :D

    I have a question for you, check your PMs.
     
  4. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    One blogger's take on the proposed Rutgers/TESC merger:
    An alternative suggestion: if TESC is to be merged, merge it with similar schools in neighboring states to form a regional institution:
     
  5. RBTullo

    RBTullo Member

    Be nice and don't pick on those of us who majored in Sociology at Regents College (nka Excelsior College).:)
     
  6. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    Take a look at my signature. I promise you, I am not self- hating :)
     
  7. Delete "merged with."
    Replace with "subsumed by."
    An arranged, forced marriage with a mission in which Rutgers has neither an investment or interest. They've rejected any "real" distance learning scheme since the 80s, with their faculty roundly rejecting the notion that education can be had outside a residential program taught by tenured faculty.

    Thanks, but I'll pass.

    FWIW, the "Rutgers Brand" carries about the same name recognition outside the tri-state area as the WaWa Convenience Stores.
     
  8. TMW2009

    TMW2009 New Member

    That may be larger than you think... I wish we had WaWas out here... Mmmm... Homestyle Roast Beef subs....
     
  9. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    mmmm... Rutgers.
     
  10. This is an email that I recently received.

    I am contacting you today to explain why Thomas Edison State College opposes the proposal announced this week to merge our College into Rutgers, a plan which was not initiated by either institution.

    We are opposed to this initiative for the following reasons:

    Threatening an Important Mission:
    Thomas Edison State College's distinctive mission can survive only in an autonomous, specialized institution. The College was created in 1972 because prominent educational leaders recommended, and state policy makers understood, that adult students could not be fully accommodated in the colleges and universities that were created to serve 18-22 year olds. This unique purpose was reinforced in the mid 1980s when, under the leadership of Governor Kean, specific funding was provided for Thomas Edison State College that enabled it to become a national leader in developing and providing flexible, high-quality, collegiate learning opportunities for self-directed adults through technology.

    Denying Access:
    Most of our alumni would not have been able to earn their degrees within the framework of Rutgers' current academic policy. Rutgers limits the number of credits that can be transferred from other institutions. Rutgers limits the number of credits that can be earned through testing and prior learning assessment. Rutgers limits the number of credits that can be earned from military and corporate training. Rutgers has very few programs tailored for adults and very limited experience in delivering online education for adult students. Rutgers operates on a traditional academic calendar (two semesters and summer sessions). Thomas Edison State College begins a new semester each month, enabling students to begin when they are ready and finish when they complete their degree requirements.

    Reducing Affordability:
    The current annual in-state tuition and fees at Rutgers total $11,874. At Thomas Edison State College, the current in-state comprehensive tuition and fees total $4,815. The current annual out-of-state tuition and fees at Rutgers total $20,456. At Thomas Edison State College, the current out-of-state comprehensive tuition and fees total $6,840. Thomas Edison State College is currently New Jersey's most affordable senior institution of higher education for New Jersey residents.

    Cost to the State:
    Thomas Edison State College receives the fewest state appropriation dollars of any senior public institution of higher education; yet, with more than 18,000 students, we are the state's third largest college or university. Our current state appropriation is only $5.3 million. The College is supported mainly through student tuition and fees, which account for approximately 80 percent of its revenues. Our tuition and fees are the lowest in the state among all senior public institutions.

    Impact on the Economic Development of Trenton:
    The rationale behind the proposed merger is that by combining Thomas Edison State College, the New Jersey State Library and the New Jersey State Museum into a Rutgers campus in Trenton, economic development would be stimulated in our state capital. First, no state funding is being provided to support this initiative. Second, the New Jersey State Library is already a well-managed affiliate of Thomas Edison State College. Third, if the proposal is approved, there would still be a college, a library and a museum in Trenton. Fourth, students that require a traditional classroom experience in Trenton already have access to The College of New Jersey, Rider University, and Mercer County Community College. Fifth, Thomas Edison State College is already involved in important economic development work in the city of Trenton. Finally, both Trenton Mayor Douglas Palmer and Mercer County Executive Brian Hughes have expressed opposition to this proposal and have said it is not in the best interests of the city and county.

    We are aware that New Jersey is in the midst of the worst fiscal crisis since the Great Depression and understand the sacrifice that is required of us, but we do not believe the public interest is served by the enacting of this proposal. We firmly believe it would destroy the mission of our College, deny educational opportunities to thousands of adult students, increase the cost of education and in no way enhance the economic development of our region.

    We will be asking for your support and assistance in preserving this institution's ability to serve the adult students for whom it was created and will continue providing you with more information on this issue in the coming weeks.

    Sincerely,

    Dr. George A. Pruitt
    President
    Thomas Edison State College
     
  11. cnvspd

    cnvspd New Member

    What happens to my degree?

    I graduated with a BS in Liberal Studies in 2005. What happens to my degree, and will it still be valid? Will our transcripts now come from Rutgers? Also, if the proposed changes take place when will everything convert? Does anyone have any insight to these questions.
     
  12. Griffin

    Griffin Crazy About Psychology

    I think you're looking at this in an interesting way, that maybe isn't very realistic. The "Big 3" would become "Big 2" if this goes through.

    Rutgers already offers online courses, so having them absorb TESC means that current students would have to abide by Rutgers' current classes. If Rutgers doesn't offer Thanatology, for example, tough because you won't be able to take it. This isn't seen as a merger of equals, but of dissolving TESC and using it's budget for other things.

    That Christie wants to add ~17k students to Rutgers with NO BUDGET is insane, plain and simple. Cost to the state per student at rutgers is pretty high, compared to very little per student for TESC. TESC is very good at using small amounts of budget money, and Rutgers is sustaining numerous campuses and a bunch of athletic teams.

    At Rutgers, you are extremely limited in what you can transfer in. All new students would be required to apply based on the standards of Rutgers, NOT TESC's current standards.

    I'm hoping in the end that it won't go through, and it isn't likely if for no other reason than they want to build a campus in Trenton with no money. It's like he hasn't even done the most rudimentary research on this. Lots of NJ students go to TESC, but they are not centralized around Trenton (give me a break). I like Rutgers, but this would be a huge huge mistake.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2010
  13. rickyjo

    rickyjo New Member

    What kind of time line are we talking about? I believe my wife may be able to get an associates degree with the credit she already has (71 credits on a 4 yr degree path). I hope it's not too late!
     
  14. bazonkers

    bazonkers New Member

    Probably sometime in 2011 if it gets approved.
     
  15. rickyjo

    rickyjo New Member

    Well, that's plenty of time. I think. My first priority above all else will be to submit her to that school and get that degree for her as soon as this condo ordeal (I'm buying a condo) is finally out of the way.

    Even if she doesn't get the degree from TESC I consider this very bad news. What a shame, I bet the governor has no idea the extent to which he is potentially setting back progress in our educational system.
     
  16. Griffin

    Griffin Crazy About Psychology

    One of my friends is an adjunct and high school teacher, and she put it pretty succinctly IMO: People are getting what they asked for. People voted him into office because they wanted substantial tax cuts, and they got them. It's almost admirable that he's made almost everyone completely miserable with the budget cuts, instead of just a few people. The only thing spared was charter schools, which is a bit of a pet project for him. Plus it might have made his keynote address a couple of days ago kind of awkward.

    If all of it goes through, he's probably not looking at a 2nd term, which I'm sure suits him just fine. You can also criticize him on Twitter, if you're into that sort of thing.
     
  17. cookderosa

    cookderosa Resident Chef




    Something else to consider, is that the university can create a new college. I can think of a dozen university systems that only offer DL degrees only through their extension/continuing education/global/alternate name college. and unless it's Harvard, no one ever cares. <smile>

    There must be administrative advantages of running alternative colleges, although the specifics are beyond my scope of interest. Maybe it's to capture market share, maybe it's genuine interest in bringing educational access to the people.

    I think the fail of University Illinois Global has a lesson in there somewhere, but the success of Pen State's World Campus also has a lesson. Western New Mexico University is running their online degree programs out of the "virtual campus" which is not the graduate college. Many many many schools have created an alternate campus, many people here are attending them, and I've even said before that some people might not even know (or care) which college of a university they are attending.

    Individual colleges of a university of course can maintain their own policies, so under this concept, TESC would retain some of its autonomy.
     
  18. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    If TESC is absorbed by Rutgers, and continues to operate in its present form, then it probably will be in a separate college. Otherwise, Rutgers' own professional accreditation would be at stake.

    For example, the Rutgers Business School has AACSB accreditation for its graduate and undergraduate business programs. That's the most prestigious form of business school accreditation; it requires strict admission standards for students, full-time tenured faculty, and strong institutional support for research.

    Obviously there is no way that TESC's business program is AACSB-accreditable. TESC has open admissions, part-time faculty, and a teaching orientation. There's a place for that -- but not in AACSB.

    So there's no way that TESC's business programs or business students can be absorbed into Rutgers Business School. Rutgers, of course, wants to maintain AACSB accreditation. They can't stay in AACSB if they operate like TESC does.

    If Rutgers is put in charge of TESC's business program, then they will have to wall it off into a separate division that is completely isolated from their traditional, AACSB-accredited business program. Unless they kill it entirely. Current Rutgers Business School students, faculty, and alumni will likely be strongly opposed to a new Rutgers business program with open admissions and no professional accreditation; they will probably perceive it as cheapening the brand.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 22, 2010
  19. Griffin

    Griffin Crazy About Psychology

    With Rutgers, I don't think they would allow TESC to keep on doing what it does best. This is my opinion, but I really think it's more likely that RU would kill TESC off and give existing students the option to continue as Rutgers students (probably under RU policies). If nothing else, they would surely add a residency requirement to make sure that they make as much as possible on classes.

    With how I am situated geographically, there is really no way to get to B&M classes without me purchasing a car, so TESC is my best option. It's also hella convenient, let's be honest, because I can take as many CLEP/DSST exams as I want to and not worry about the cost of sitting the classes. My closest B&M 4yr school would charge me $500 per credit including fees. Outside of southern NJ, they actually have less of a reputation than TESC.

    I would rather TESC go private and raise the tuition, since it's already extremely cheap to attend class.
     
  20. qwer

    qwer New Member

    whats the situation or comments on a new student potentially attending TESC starting now?

    dont do it? choose excelsior?
     

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