Still difficulty with DETC degree Acceptance

Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is a big difference between transfering NA courses into a RA bachelor program versus using a NA bachelor degree for admittance to a graduate program. I believe that for many universities, individual departments can decide what criteria they use to apply to potential candidates. Perhaps they don't feel like CSU produces graduates who are strong enough to be successful in their program. This probably happens to lesser quality RA programs as well.

It still amazes me that people often look for the cheapest or easiest to complete degree and then act surprise when they find it doesn't have the acceptance of the better quality RA institutions. As Steve points out, unless NA institutions start meeting the same standards (not necessarily better standards) as RA insitutions there will always be enough discriminators to disadvantage those with an NA degree if thats what the institution wants.

Caveat emptor. Caveat emptor.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Not Southeastern

A year or so ago I would have said that the BGS has had great utility, but I've been on interviews since, and now I'm not so sure. No one has challenged the degree outright, but I suspect that it has been an issue.

Having a BGS has come with the baggage of having to explain what a BGS is. When an job listing requires a specific bachelors degree (health management, business) having a BGS has required that I "do a dance" and justify why my degree + my experience in health management "fit the bill". This could be avoided by having a BBA or something similar.

This is part of the reason that I chose to do the Tulane certificate program in business management, just to get something business specific on my resume (I have an AS in general studies and BGS). It is also the reason that I will be sure to complete a health-management concentration in my MBA program. In todays job market, employers have the option of picking and choosing from several, similarly qualified candidates. A degree that stands out as something different may not always be a good thing.

Of course, this could all be in my head.

That's the bad stuff, the good stuff is that I have a better job in management at a larger medical practice that I could not have gotten without the degree. I also got into a solid MBA program that required an RA undergrad degree. Oh yeah, I'm also in the UConn alumni association (just like the BS and BA holders) and that has been a neat networking opportunity, since I live in CT.

(GO HUSKIES!)

It's the old "good house in a bad neighborhood vs. bad house in a good neighborhood" question. Which is better? I don't know, it's all subjective. Government mandates won't change either the "houses" or the "neighborhoods", but good luck to them trying.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Not Southeastern

Charter Oak and Thomas Edison are both
Title IV schools - if they start accepting NA credits, anyone with a NA degree can just spend another thousand and get a RA degree as well.

 

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You are, of course, assuming that TESC and COSC will "play along". Like I said, good luck!

By the way, schools answer to more governing bodies than just thier regional (or other) accreditors and the federal government. Has anyone asked the Connecticut Board of Governors (or any of the 49 other relevant state agencies) for thier input? I wonder.....

 

I'd really like to read the actual Act - or some news on it's status. The articles on the financial aid for drug offenders and the 50% online rule had me thinking it was already passed...

 

This is not the bill, but it is information that may help the initial poster. I found it over at another forum, with thanks from that admin to member Bush04 (who may still post here).

Website:
http://www.chea.org/HETA/default.asp


The Higher Education Transfer Alliance (HETA) is a voluntary group of accredited institutions that are concerned with the importance of student mobility, enhancing success in transfer of credit, and affirming the responsibility and prerogative of individual institutions with respect to acceptance of transfer credits.

Designed by CHEA, the HETA directory can be used by students and the public to find institutions with transfer practices consistent with the four criteria in the CHEA Statement to the Community: Transfer and Public Interest. The directory also provides links to these institutions so that students and others can review a specific institution's transfer policies and practice.

If an Institution is in HETA, What Does This Tell Me?
An institution's membership in HETA tells you that its transfer decisions are not made solely on the basis of the accredited status of a sending institution and that the institution has agreed at least to consider transfer requests from other institutions. Each HETA member institution has an interest in cooperative efforts to assure and enhance student mobility.

 

Thanks RobbCD for adding the CHEA site as well as I was also going to refer this source.

I have found no problems of acceptance with a DETC program to date. The ones that do not have a clear answer upfront end up allowing me to make application and or tell me that it would be based on a conditional acceptance based on how one performs in the first 2-3 courses.

Most of these are for profit that I have looked into though.

 

Being frustrated, I worte a brief note to Michael Lambert, presidnt of DETC. He was kind enough to provide this encouraging response:

" We share your frustration and dismay, and there is no defensible reason for the denial of your degrees earned at these institutions. Longer term, hopefully within the next 5 months, there will be a Federal law signed by the President that will make these action illegal. The law will state that a college cannot deny transfer credit or degrees based solely on the source of accreditation of the sending institution. At that point, you will be in good shape to get accepted. Shorter term, if you send me the names and email addresses of the person who denied your acceptance, we will write them with a good letter on your behalf. I am sorry you have had to undergo this and there is no fairness in what has happened. The traditional colleges fear the competition from successful new schools like CSU and do what they can to diminish their acceptance. But the tide is turning. Good luck. Mike Lambert DETC"

I found that most of the for profit schools accept DETC without question. The others are not so fast to accept anything other than RA undergrad degrees

 

Not for nothing, but what's to fear? The bread and butter of traditional colleges are the B&M programs, and DETC schools don't threaten that. Also, there are, like, 3,000 RA schools, many with great name recognition out there. The DETC has, what? A few dozen little known or unknown programs? With respect to Mr. Lambert, this part of his response seems off. Way off. The fact that APUS is seeking RA is an indication of the direction that schools will be taking.

The tide is turning alright, towards regional accreditation and away from national accreditors.

 

I disagree completely. APUS is seeking RA because of acceptance. If it was illegal to discriminate against DETC credits, what reason would there be to go RA?

NA schools operate with much less overhead. CCU has tuition that is cheaper than any community college in my area! And even if the reputation wasn't there, what smart RA student wouldn't take the opportunity to transfer in some cheap NA credits to their degree?

Personally, I would have never gone RA if financial aid and RA acceptance had been around when I was choosing degree programs.

 

But that's the whole point, isn't it? RA schools will still be able to refuse credit from NA schools, just by changing policy. This will likely result in the exclusion of NA credit along with credit from many RA for-profit schools. What will your argument be then?

If you think that you'll be able to transfer credit from CCU into a school like, for example, UConn, you are dreaming. I went to a Connecticut Community College and some of my credits were refused. Huff and puff all you want, if you go for cheap credit you will get a product with substandard utility. No law will change that.

 

Sure, some schools will skip around new rules. But do you honestly believe all RA schools are going to ignore the spirit of the law and continue to operate as is? The net effect will be a significant rise in the number of RA schools who accept NA credits. UConn may hold out - but what are they going to do when Central Connecticut starts accepting DETC credits? The pressure will have increased exponentially. Not to mention the headache of trying to defend their non-acceptance of NA credits by means other than accreditor.

 

Re: Re: Not Southeastern

I believe that it is a fantasy to believe that educational equality can be legislated. Schools are not all equal.

 

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But they should be evaulated by their merits, not by their accreditor. That is the purpose of this legislation.

 

UConn won't be a "hold out", and if CCSU accepts DETC credits then the joke is on them. The pressure that you talk about for accepting NA credits doesn't really exist (exept on internet discussion boards). Hell, COSC doesn't even accept DETC credits unless they are ACE reviewed. The thing that you are saying that you want, RA schools that accept NA credits, you already have. If that isn't enough, tough. You write as if you expect this law to bring universities to heel. LOL! I've never heard anything so naive.

This law wont improve or degrade the situation. You will end up with a status quo.

 

I'm sorry for being so stupid to assume that institutions run by state governments, using taxpayer money, whose missions are to provide higher education, not to boost their elitism, would actually follow a federal law. You're right, jokes on me.

 

If you assume that public universities need to accept NA credits to provide higher education, then the joke really is on you. I would say that they do a better job at education by refusing those credits. That's not elitism, that's protection of a better product. If it wasn't better, none of this would be neccessary.

Of course they will follow the federal law (when and if it becomes law) and NA schools will not benefit from it at all.

 

I think 40,000 ITT Tech students would disagree. How about the 68,000 thousand students attending Corinthian College's NA schools? Heard about those lawsuits flying around about credit transferability? Perhaps you'd like to testify in court for UConn on why exactly NA credits are not up to their lofty academic standards. Remember, you can't mention accreditation!

 

So, essentially, your argument is that NA credits can be proven to be inferior to RA credits by quality. Again, I'd like to see you support such a claim.

 

Inferior? Maybe not. Different standard? Definately. The fact is that you want something for nothing, that is credit at a more expensive school that you did not attend. Forget UConn, what about Yale? Do you think they will be accepting DETC degrees in transfer? What about the University of Pennsylvania school of business? Why don't you try transfering DETC credit into any one of the private liberal arts colleges that dot the Northeast? Because you can't, and no law will change that.

Bill is right, schools are not equal. Wishing and screaming will not make them so.