You know - I am pissed

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Mr. Engineer, Dec 22, 2005.

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  1. Mr. Engineer

    Mr. Engineer member

    . You know - I am pissed. Everyone who reads my posts knows that I am pretty much a middle of the road non-religious type of guy. No - I don't believe in the bible or Jesus - but I definitely believe in a power greater than myself.

    With that said, I attended my daughters "holiday" concert on Tuesday. Not one Christmas song! Not one - my daughters group played their renditions of several non-holiday and almost commercial songs (Matterhorn Express?). -- What is up with that? What happened to Silent Night -- Deck the fricken halls - Merry Christmas, etc? OK - we have become so polarized and PC that we cannot acknowledge our beliefs? Have we regressed that much. I believe that we can and should celebrate the holidays and traditions of other religious beliefs - Ramadan, Passover, etc. But that doesn't mean that we should ignore Christian traditions (not that I am a Christian, but some of my best friends are. :D )

    Just my two.


    While I am ranting - have you ever noticed that we are taught to be tolerant of others beliefs? Do you think these same people are tolerant of ours? (I am talking to the general beliefs of Americans) - If you think so, go to Japan, Singapore, or China. They could care less about being tolerant
     
  2. mcdirector

    mcdirector New Member

    Our Christmas concert was cancelled due to the dreaded inclement weather, but it would have been full of Christmassy Christmas stuff.

    Put on some Nat King Cole (my fav Christmas CD) and have a sing-a-long with your sweet little gal :D

    Merry Christmas Mr. Engineer!
     
  3. 3$bill

    3$bill New Member

    I lived in Japan for 15 years and I found a much more tolerant religious atmosphere there than here. There is a great proliferation of sects and so-called "New Religions," whose members themselves may feel they have a monopoly on right doctrine which they should share with others, but in general, other people's religious beliefs per se just aren't an issue. Perhaps that's because most Japanese observe both Buddhist and Shinto practices. Since Shinto is polytheistic, ritualistic, and virtually a-doctrinal, why worry about other people's deities? There are plenty to go around.

    To speak to your general question, I'm tolerant of others' beliefs because it's sensible and fair. What they think of mine is a matter of complete indifference.
     
  4. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    My sister taught first grade for many years. (recently retired) She said that it was getting so that she had great difficulty finding PC songs that the kids could learn for the Christmas program. One year she thought that she had a most marvelously PC program. There was one song that had a couple "halleluljahs" in it. After the program was over one set of parents came up to and screamed at her because they were offended by the halleluljahs and reported her dastardly conduct to the principal.
     
  5. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    Best Christmas song I ever heard was in a dingy nightclub in the late 70's, with a punk band growling out:

    'You'd better not pout!

    You'd better not cry!

    You'd better be good

    I'm tellin' ya why --

    Santa Claus is comin' to town!'

    If they did it today, it would be a rap song.

    What's most often being advocated is tolerance towards the divergent beliefs of other Americans. The idea that people with non-mainstream beliefs aren't truly American is part of what the tolerance-advocates are criticizing.

    My feeling is that like with everything else, some moderation is called for. America should be a big-tent, but it has to retain some kind of cultural identity and not just devolve into the rest of the world's get-rich-quick zone.

    That balance is constantly being negotiated.

    I can't speak about China, but despite Japan being less than 1% Christian, Christmas is surprisingly big in urban Japan. You see Santa Claus and hear Christmas carols playing in English that nobody understands. The Japanese are always up for another holiday and the commercial possibilities are endless.

    But yeah, I certainly don't have anything against Christmas songs. I positively like them. Although I've heard so many of them while drinking my $50 mochas at Starbucks recently that I'm ready to scream.

    A Christmas pagent that pulls the Christmas songs? Ridiculous.
     
  6. Khan

    Khan New Member

    i went to my nephew's play and it was just the opposite. It was more like church than a public school play.
     
  7. DTechBA

    DTechBA New Member

  8. Will Makeit

    Will Makeit New Member

    Sometimes I am wanting that others keep up the Christian spirit for me, and then I complain when I see that society is progressively getting rid of religion altogether...
     
  9. Mr. Engineer

    Mr. Engineer member

    Re: Ben Stein's thoughts on the matter....

    Although I don't always agree with Ben, I have to respect the guy for his intelligence and insights

    Lets bring back Christmas!
     
  10. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    The problem isn't "PC" or the exclusion of religious themes. The problem is the school shouldn't be putting on a pageant (or whatever) about Christmas while trying to eliminate all references to, well, Christ.

    No Christ, there's no Christmas, and therefore no Christmas plays/pageants.

    Because public schools are supported by the government, they run the risk of the establishment clause in the 1st Amendment. They can either go on as before--and offend and exclude some people, creating what is a de facto acceptable reliigion--or they can leave these things to churches and other private (and non-governmental public) settings.

    Just because something's always been done a certain way doesn't mean it was right.

    The schools could go back to singing "Joy to the World," but that isn't really right and doesn't fit in a public school.

    It could take the Christ out of Christmas, but it's kind of stupid to put on a Christmas pageant without religious undertones.

    Instead, the school should focus on schooling and the church can focus on churching. I doubt the educative process would be harmed by eliminating this stuff. And doing it the PC way is the dumbest solution of the bunch. As a Christian, I wouldn't be offended. But I would think the school was silly for doing it at all.

    School is for schooling. If this other stuff doesn't fit, eliminate it. Not because it might offend, but because of the establishment clause.

    But I do wish a very merry Christmas to those who ascribe to it (religiously or not). Happy Hannauka and Happy Kwanzaa to those who celebrate them, too. Me? Well, I'm going to celebrate a merry Christmas and wish Peach on Earth and Goodwill to all men and women.
     
  11. John Bear

    John Bear Senior Member

    I totally support "Peach on Earth."

    I still have my button from the 60s, Jesus with fist raised, saying
    "Peace on earth . . . NOW! "
     
  12. PhD2B

    PhD2B Dazed and Confused

    I just picked up my kids from school [a public school] today and I was relieved when a teacher and the principal both wished me a merry Christmas on my way out.

    I am so sick and tired of all of this PC BS!

    Someday someone will decide happy holiday is offensive. What will everyone wish each other then? :rolleyes:

    So in the meantime, I would like to take the time to wish everyone who takes offense to merry Christmas, “Merry f’n Christmas!” :D
     
  13. DTechBA

    DTechBA New Member

    Christmas...

    Christmas is a national holiday in this country. Not only is it a nationally sanctioned holiday it is one of the few that almost every worker in the country will get off for. It is also the holiday that literally drives profitably for a large part of our retail business sector. In short, Christmas is a huge event for everyone in this country Christian or not.

    Thanksgiving is probably the next biggest holiday. It is also based on Christian thought which is to give thanks for what we have. Should we now start ignoring it?

    The point here is that it is pretty difficuly for schools to ignore Christmas and Thanksgiving even though they have derived from Christian beliefs and customs. Some of the contortions some people go to because of PC has become ridiculous. Enjoy the season. If you are a non-believer, so what, take the time out and spend it with your family or whatever IS important to you.

    On the other hand, I am becoming annoyed with some Christians who have made it a mission to say Halloween promotes demon or devil worship. Come on, few really think we are celebrating ghosts or goblins!! Celebrating the harmless fun of Halloween is not worshipping the devil or sending anyone to Hades. I mean really, how can one protest the PC'ing of the Christmas season and at the same time demand schools turn their Halloween parties in to "fall festivals" (yes, it happened in my town, ridiculous!!). Aren't you doing the exact same thing you are decrying?

    You cannot have it both ways.....
     
  14. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    And I'm sick and tired of this being dressed up as PC. Saying "happy holidays" to someone is inclusive, not exclusive." It doesnt' exclude Christmas; it includes other people who celebrate holidays at this time, and it also includes other holidays (like New Year's Day). Finally, it is more descriptive of the time period--some people take many holiday days during this time. Our company is taking all next week as holiday (not leave) time.

    No one is trying to hijack Christmas. That is a strawman. And it is the reaction to the strawman that is causing the problem. (Along with the hype that goes along this problem about nothing.)
     
  15. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Re: Christmas...

    That is so great! Nice one.
     
  16. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Re: Christmas...



    Good points DTech!


    Abner
     
  17. davidhume

    davidhume New Member

    My recent travels to the Asian region found a very high degree of tolerance for the Christmas, and by implication, the Christian celebration. Moslems, Hindus and Buddists were wishing me a 'Happy Christmas' The streets and shops were decked with colourful decorations and Christmas songs were being played in the malls. So maybe there is more of the spirit of Christmas in this area of the world!

    Oh and one place I was in was Singapore and they are full of the Christmas spirit!
     
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Perhaps Mr. Engineer is not as "middle of the road non-religious" as he would like to project. ;)
     
  19. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I believe there are many powers greater than myself, unless I haven't bathed in a few days then all bets are off.
     
  20. intsvc

    intsvc member

    Re: Re: You know - I am pissed

    My Wife is from Malaysia.

    The cards we've had from people in the UK have been highly secular: 'Peace', 'Happy Holidays', etc.

    The cards we've had from people in Malaysia have been true 'Happy Christmas' cards with Navity scenes in them, etc. They are alot more tolerant over Christmas as well, remembering that their major religions are Islam and Buddhism (Mahayana).

    Regards
     

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