Apostille

For our forthcoming book, Degree Mills, I typed out a document declaring that the College of Cardinals had elected me as Pope of the Roman Catholic Church. I paid $10 to get it locally notarized, and (as I recall) $10 more to get it confirmed by the State of California, and a like amount for a Department of State Apostille, duly signed, not by, but 'on behalf of' Colin Powell. At no point in the process, of course, did anyone read the document -- or if, perchance, they did, it made no difference to the process.

 

According to the Hague Convention, everyone on earth is legally obligated to recognize your rightful claim to the Throne of St. Peter, Your Holiness.

 

Perhaps this is entirely humorous, and no precision is intended. But my interpretation is that if Pope John Paul II decided to sue Dr. Bear for impersonation in some realm, other than the USA, that signed the Hague Convention, and Pope John Paul II somehow came into posession of Dr. Bear's document, Pope John Paul II could introduce the document into evidence just on the basis of the apostille. Were it not for the apostille, Pope John Paul II would have to find a witness to testify that Dr. Bear signed the document before introducing it.

Once introduced, the court could read the content, decide it was a joke, and ignore it.

 

Re: signatures

No, the thing is, that the apostile certifies that the document is "real". This is not (only) used in the academic world, but also for example, in legal-personal-status issues (to certify, for example, that someone who plans on getting married is not married alerady).

Two scenarios:
A> You have a degree from a so-called degree mill, the University of Bulls. You hand it to the apostile, who certifies that you are a graduate of the University of Bulls (great name, isn't it?). The apostile says that you gave them an original documents and indeed, it is not fake, but it says nothing on the quality of your degree or on the way it has been achieved.
B> You fake a certificate, saying that you graduated from Harvard. The apostile would not certify it (hopefully) because it is a fake, even if Harvard University itself is rather acknowledged.

 

Foreign Office UK

I have checked with the foreign office in the United Kingdom.

They told me that there is different rules now on getting an Apostille attached to a degree.

The "Pope Declaration" by Mr Bear would work, but an apostille on a degree is a whole new ball game.

Don't believe it?

Call them

 

Re: Re: signatures

Question Floyd: How is the Apostille (usage?) going to know the difference between a fake Harvard Diploma and a real one? I believe, just like a notary, they will look at the signiture and your id. They will then verify that, but not the document. There is no way the process could actually verify the document without quite a bit of work.

 

I dont know

Possibly, well spotted.

Ask the foreign office in London.

 

Fred, can you give me the phone number of the Foreign Office where you asked that question? It costs me 3 cents a minute to call London, and I'll be happy to back you up......



Thanks in advance

 

020 7008 1111

 

Fred,

Thanks for the phone number. They require absolutely the same as in the US:

- To notarize the document and its signatures by a Public Notary
- The signature of an official Foreign Office and the attachment of the apostile (which is an automatic procedure once the notary signs).

To make sure, I find out about the procedure in Spain and in The Netherlands, and, voila, it's identical. They all say that the objective of this procedure is to certify that a document and the signatures that appear on it are genuine. Please, re-read John Bear's posts above for a perfect example about their modus operandi. They would affix the apostile to any document .....

I think it is pretty clear that the apostille could be a potencial source of fraud. I also think it is pretty clear that the objective of this apostille is not to demonstrate the validity of a degree, but hte authenticity of a document. Should we leave it like this so we don't confuse other people who in the future may come here looking for help? THX.


Greetings