UST/Luna - Worthless now!

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by AsianStew, May 14, 2022.

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  1. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

  2. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    18% return? Do they explain how they generate that? Because the article calls it a "new kind of Ponzi scheme" but offering people a shocking rate of return while not actually doing anything to generate it (and using new depositors money to pay off the old ones), it just the regular kind of Ponzi scheme.
     
  3. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Prohibition can work. For example, if the prohibited product is hard to smuggle or produce on a small scale, like tobacco. And even when it's not, prohibition can have an effect. When the US went dry under the Volstead Act, drinking went down. Unfortunately, there were so many holes in the system and booze was easy to transport, so it encouraged illegal activities, making a huge portion of Americans criminals.

    On the other hand, Australia went after the guns in the mid-'90s after a horrific shooting and got results.

    In my opinion, America's problem with drug smuggling is about demand, not supply. We provide the cash and (sadly) the guns, and we get the drugs (and attendant violence and other societal ills) in return. But it's our voracious appetite that is the basis of the problem.

    Or, we could take a lesson from the marijuana marketplace. Growing your own weed--or buying it on the black market--is a lot more hassle than just going to a dispensary and purchasing some. If we legalized drugs some crimes would go up, but many others would go down. And we wouldn't lead the world in incarceration anymore.
     
  4. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    I just got done saying crypto wasn't a Ponzi scheme--mainly because it involved people buying and selling from each other. But this sure does sound like one.
     
  5. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    There was a time, pre-Erdogan--when Turkey was seriously trying to convince the EU to admit it. (I think they leaned on their NATO role a lot vis-a-vis their opposition to the Russians.) But that's gone now, and the lira might be next.
     
    Johann likes this.
  6. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Dustin, if you're referring to Vonnegut's post (and I see no other quoting a rate of return) - the guy was offering WAY more than 18%. He was talking about 1% per week. Even at simple interest, paid annually, without compounding that's equivalent to 52% a year. With -- it could be up to around 70% annually depending on the compounding period.

    I don't have to bother with Interest rates in Islamic finance. But I remember. Oh Boy, do I remember!...:eek: Those rates are why I switched!
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2022
  7. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I'm not talking about crypto in general, I'm talking about this Celsius "bank" specifically that says they'll give you an 18% return on your deposit.

    Edit: Said, rather. Since they stopped allowing withdrawals.
     
  8. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    It was the WaPo article that Rich linked earlier. Here is the quote:

     
  9. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Sorry - missed that, somehow. I'll read the whole thing. Thanks.
     
  10. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Yes - I remember the days when Turkey wanted admission to the EU - and was working hard towards meeting the requirements. And if the lira is next to go, as it likely is, Erdogan's senseless insistence on low interest rates, in an inflationary time, will prove to have been the final straw. Too bad. Many interesting things about that country - which suffers from dire mis-government. It's a real east-west confluence.

    I like Turkish music, ever since I learned that a taksim isn't a vehicle you ride in, to Istanbul International Airport. And the quality of Turkish imports I've seen here is miles above what we get from China. Maybe we'll all get along better with a non-Erdogan administration. I can hardly wait. Same with a lot of Turks, I imagine.
     
  11. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Bitcoin lost only about $90 today. The bottom? Maybe but I don't think so. Then again who knows?
     
  12. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    I'm not sure exactly what this "bank" does but what the article describes is a classic (and terminal) bank run. It might not kill Bitcoin though. In fact if the bank really fails and was engaged in fractional reserve lending the result might be to shrink the effective Bitcoin supply and drive the price up not down. On the other hand if the bank failure was due to dishonesty the panic might spread.
     
  13. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    But something has to - preferably soon. :(
     
  14. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    My wife, Paula, thinks so. She spent a summer there as a foreign exchange student. Later, she was stationed in Turkey for two years during her Air Force career. We have Turkish carpets in much of our house, and she takes great enjoyment thinking about her days there. (It was before she met me, so they were happy ones!)
     
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  15. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    My point. There is no way to know.
     
  16. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Nope, not the bottom. Down another $486 to just under $22,000. Let's see here...Bitcoin has lost 2/3 of its "value" from its peak last October. Nothing remotely resembling a hedge against inflation. It's certainly not a store of value and it's way too volatile for use as a medium of exchange.

    So will some HODLR please tell me again...what good is it?
     
  17. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I'm not a HODLer, but since it seems I'm the only one on this forum who doesn't have it in for crypto, I'll just say that everything I said on page one is still the case.

    That said, I'm surprised that in a time of historically high inflation that neither Bitcoin nor gold is up. Bitcoin's five year chart doesn't look all that different from the S&P 500's, even in the last few weeks, which I wouldn't have expected.
     
  18. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    True! As I said, I don't buy gold, either.
     
  19. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Bitcoin lost just a little less than $1,000 today. Sitting at around $21,500.
     
  20. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Why should Bitcoin rise when the stock market falls? Investors pursue return. That has always been gold's Achilles Heel too.
     

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