Universidad central de nicaragua (again)

If you want to obtain an online PhD from a university I would counsel against attempting to obtain one from universities in Nicaragua if you're trying to use the education for immigration, employment or further education purposes. From what I understand the highest, legally recognized degree one can obtain in Nicaragua is a maestria, or the equivalent of a master's degree in the U.S.

The jointly issued PhD degrees referenced in previous posts from UCN and (insert university name here) should be treated with extreme caution as a result of this. Make absolutely sure that the PhD is a legally recognized credential within (insert university name here)'s country. Take, for example, the joint PhD offered with the Universidad Azteca. Since the PhD is not legally recognized within Nicaragua make certain that the PhD is a recognized program in Mexico.

 

Places like Mexico and India have world class institutions like IIT or UNAM but they have also thousands of mickey mouse schools that are just there to make a quick buck.
You don't need one million bucks to open a University in Mexico, there are hundreds of schools that look like the ones below:

http://www.poblanerias.com/wp-content/archivos/2012/09/upav-300x200.jpg

http://www.fuentesfidedignas.com.mx/portal2014/images/Notas/MAYO14/14/escuelas-patito.jpg

http://m.oem.com.mx/60e9b262-1f15-419e-9a41-57d72987f1e0.jpg

University Azteca's website is really badly designed, this is a warning sign as it might be a school like the ones above.

It is too risky to go with no name schools in Mexico, the school can close tomorrow and you are left with no degree and no money. Also, I would be surprised if a place like WES would recognize a school like Azteca as equivalent to a US RA school.

 

My point is that this is an option with high risk, too many risky variables. If cost is an issue, one can just go with UNISA that is an established institution that nobody will question and it will be most likely be there by the time you graduate.

I wonder why someone would even consider these options unless there is a substantial advantage (e.g. little work, lax standards, low cost, etc).

I also wonder who will be the dissertation adviser at a place like Azteca. Another PhD from Azteca? A PhD from UoP that is unable to find work in the US so joins Azteca?

There is no faculty listed in the Azteca site other than the few local faculty with no listed credentials. However, even if listed, we know that many online schools have used the trick of just enrolling in their faculty anyone that applies that has a prestigious doctorate but they never actually pay them nor hire them to supervise students.

You are right, one can have little resources and still offer a decent option but my opinion is that this type of outfit looks like a quick buck operation with little interest to actually provide PhD opportunities that will be respected.

 

I had a second look at Azteca and must accept that I was a bit harsh with them. Yes, it looks like a school with little resources but they seem to be running a legit operation. The official site below:

UNIVERSIDAD AZTECA

Azteca is not Harvard, not even UNISA but it seems to be the equivalent to your average for profit American school. They seem to have several campuses so they seem to be real.
Sometimes you have people that just needs an accredited doctorate that can pass the WES test for a promotion or a salary raise. It might be also useful for adjunct teaching so Azteca might do the trick.

My take on this one is to be cautious and check with WES and verify that the degree would be accepted as the equivalent to an RA school.

 

It looks like some people are using this degree to become adjuncts:
Faculty Directory - Lisa Shaffner
Of course her looks help too.

 

She lists an MA in Counseling Psychology from Immaculata University, an RA, Catholic B&M. She's listed as an adjunct in psychology and sociology at Goldey-Beacom College. Looking at the Goldey-Beacom College faculty directory:

• three other adjuncts in psychology, out of five adjuncts in psychology total, list a master's as their highest earned degree

• both adjuncts in sociology listed in the directory, list a master's as their highest earned degree.

Lisa Schaffner is listed as an adjunct in both Psychology and Sociology on her page, but under Psychology alone on the directory page.

A conclusion that the doctorate was determinative or even materially helpful in getting the position, when almost every adjunct in the same fields at the same school has a master's as their highest degree, doesn't seem supported.

Relatedly, as often seems to be the backstory for faculty with non-standard doctorates, she may have had the position before the doctorate.

Edited to add: That's exactly what appears to be the case here from her full CV. She's been employed with the Psychology Department at GBC since 2002. She received an unaccredited PhD in 2007 and an unaccredited "Dual PhD" in 2011. Btw, that's the background of the one other doctoral-level adjunct listed, Dr. Gary Wirt, who started teaching at GBC in 1974 and earned his EdD, from Sarasota, in 1996.

 

Clarification: These are both from international schools not holding recognized U.S. accreditation. I haven't researched their accreditation or recognition status beyond this; they may or may not be "GAAP."

 

Her CV actually backs up your assumption:
http://www.gbc.edu/faculty/shaffner/lscv.pdf

She has been an adjunct since 2002 while the Azteca PhD was earned in 2011. My guess is that she got her doctorate to either get more adjunct work or aim for a full time position. To probe or disprove the utility of her doctorate, one would need to follow her career and found out if she is able to get more adjunct work or a tenure track.

The issue is that she got the Mexican doctorate as a product of an agreement with Azteca and her previous non accredited phd granting institute (IOUF),

Intercultural Open University Foundation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

She transformed her non accredited PhD into an accredited PhD based on the agreement. The question is if this PhD would be taken seriously for academic career. I guess that time will tell.

 

But in 2011 you wrote: "I have a WES account, I just tried to pre evaluate Azteca and it is not in their list for Mexican Universities that are RA equivalent. This is a bad sign as normally all recognized schools are in their list."

Prior to that remark, you mentioned WES pre-evaluation for Azteca about four other times in this thread:

http://www.degreeinfo.com/general-distance-learning-discussions/37764-universidad-azteca-5.html

So - do you think a WES pre-evaluation is now possible -- or are we going round in circles? There are other readers' observations in that thread that (to me) indicate this school might not be such a great choice.

For example, Poster Lukeness wrote:

"Azteca, like Unem, will use 'life experience ' or 'resume evaluation' to grant you degrees.
I have this in writing, from two separate sources. Both market the universities and the referrals were made direcly from the universities.
Regardless of their apparent legal stature, I think it's clear that they are mills.

Johann

 

I have received written confirmation from one NACES member firm that they have evaluated PhDs from Universidad Central de Nicaragua (UCN) to be equivalent to Research PhDs from Regionally Accredited US institutions. Two other NACES member firms confirmed that UCN has the appropriate accreditation in Nicaragua to allow them to evaluate a PhD earned through their institution. Each reply stated that no final determination can be made until they have copies of the Diploma and Diploma Supplement in hand.

We had another poster, the one who initially created this thread, deliver details that UK NARIC would recognize and issue a statement of equivalency for a UCN PhD.

The World Higher Education Database lists UCN has being able to award the PhD degree (documented under an additional notation) and my reading of the Nicaraguan Higher Education Law allows UCN to award the degree of “Doctorado”.

Not sure why all the interest in UCN lately. Sure they are a small school but it seems they have designs on a better future. Having just opened a new campus and steadily increasing their enrollments, I have no reason to question their veracity.

 

My take:

UCN - 1.
U. Azteca - 0.

Johann

 

The WES evaluation system does not list the PhD - Doctorado as a credential for UCN. But I have seen with my own TWO eyeballs the degree in the World Higher Education Database for UCN's entry.

I suspect the WES tool does not recognize the entry in the "Notes" section or they did not load their database from that portion of the WHED database.

But bear in mind WES is not the say all and end all. They are just one of the NACES firms.

 

Johann,

I forgot about this one, you can screen the school by yourself below:
https://www.wes.org/preliminary/idp.asp

The school is still not listed. WES might still consider it but you might need to provide them with a lot of documentation at the risk that at the end is not recognized.

As I mentioned before, a risky option but many like Lisa Shaffner still got it because they were offered a deal that couldn't refuse.

 

Randall,

Please provide your basis for this statement.

Thanks!

 

Agreed - but it is the firm RFValve repeatedly mentioned in his posts about Azteca in 2011 and again, about the same school, in this thread. That's why I brought it up. Thanks for mentioning WES's apparent oversight regarding the Doctorado of UCN. I'm sure that's exactly what it is -an oversight.

I have no question as to the legitimacy of UCN. (I think that's the fifth time I've said that. :smile: )

Johann

 

I am going to attempt to lay down the basic facts about Universidad Central de Nicaragua as I understand them and have conducted extensive research to verify.

Some of these documents are a little big, so be patient.


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Education Laws of Nicaragua
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It all starts with the Education Laws of Nicaragua (if you use the Chrome browser it will automatically translate these into English or other languages if needed)

LEY DE AUTONOMÍA DE LAS INSTITUCIONES DE EDUCACION SUPERIOR (AUTONOMY LAW INSTITUTIONS OF HIGHER EDUCATION)
- Specifically Articles 7 and 9 give universities the ability to issue degrees and titles at all levels

http://legislacion.asamblea.gob.ni/Normaweb.nsf/($All)/26C0D292E6C3E19C062570A100577D60?OpenDocument


LEY GENERAL DE EDUCACIÓN (GENERAL EDUCATION LAW)
- Specifically Article 82 addresses the ability to issue Doctoral credentials. It mentions "Doctorado" by name.

http://legislacion.asamblea.gob.ni/Normaweb.nsf/($All)/B2FBC86E5FD975420625755B00765A99?OpenDocument

******************************************
Nicaraguan Higher Education Accreditation
******************************************

Consejo Nacional de Universidades is the national institutional accreditation agency of Nicaragua

The valid in-country Universities are listed here:

Universidades

UCN is a "Universidades Autorizadas" - Authorized University. Its page is here:

Universidad Central de Nicaragua (UCN)

******************************************
Doctoral Degrees do exist in Nicaragua
******************************************

To offer evidence that Doctoral degrees other than those in Medicine or Veterinary Medicine are offered examine the following sequence of documents

CNU has a Publications index for universities that are members of CNU, remember UCN is not a member but it is authorized by CNU to operate as a university (that is why its details are not in this document I will refer to below)

Publicaciones - Publicaciones

The following document lists programs offered by CNU member institutions.

http://www.cnu.edu.ni/index.php/publicaciones?download=79:estadisticas-2011

On PDF Page 130 (Document Page No 129) you will find a listing for 'PROGRAMA DE DOCTORADO "CUESTIONES ACTUALES DEL DERECHO" ' (DOCTORAL PROGRAM "CURRENT ISSUES OF LAW") offered by Universidad Centroamericana

The University's own webpage lists the details for this PhD in Law:
Doctorado Cuestiones Actuales del Derecho

A link to the World Higher Education Database (WHED) page for UCN is just below. Before you freak out about the number of Doctoral qualified faculty, look at the number of employees. Remember Nicaragua is much smaller country than the US or others in the world.
You will see the Note about PhD and Double degrees (which were discussed at length on this thread -- a common global practice - not nefarious).
Universidad Central de Nicaragua - WHED - IAU's World Higher Education Database

Here is the WHED page Universidad Centroamericana, notice it does not list the PhD referred to above but as you have seen it does in fact exist.
Universidad Centroamericana - WHED - IAU's World Higher Education Database

So, in summary Unviersidad Central de Nicaragua IS an accredited institution in Nicaragua and IS authorized to issue Doctoral degrees under the laws of Nicaragua consistent with the actions taken by other universities within the country.

I hope this is enough evidence for the stream of misinformation and false statements to stop about UCN.

This thread was started about UCN and not institutions with which it has affiliations. Please stop derailing it by talking about those institutions. There are threads for other schools or you may happily start a new thread.

 

Kudos to Novadar - big time! Here's someone who's really done the homework! I'm impressed! :smile:
And yes - I promise not to talk about the other schools in this UCN thread. Point taken. (I like UCN itself better, anyway!)

Johann

 

With regard to the Universidad Azteca de Chalco (which offers a co-PhD with UCN and is relevant to this thread), it is an accredited private institution in Mexico. It is only authorized to award a limited amount of degrees. See here for a list http://www.sirvoes.sep.gob.mx/sirvoes/reporteCNT?menu=1&item=4&operacion=20&cbo_tpo_rep=20&idInst=59602&mimeType=pdf. Any degree programs offered by this institution that aren't on this list would not be considered officially recognized and the diplomas received would, therefore, constitute a very expensive piece of paper.

novadar: UCN is certainly a recognized school. I don't think most people are questioning that at this point, or if they are they shouldn't be. It definitely has the equivalent of regional accreditation in the U.S. It awards officially recognized degrees up to the maestria level and no higher. My sources? AACRAO, the UNESCO IHU, IERF and NAFSA, among others. If you really want to obtain a PhD from this or any school in Nicaragua then, by all means, feel free. Don't be surprised if, when you subsequently have your degree evaluated by a NACES member for immigration, employment or education purposes you get a message back stating, "Sorry, but this credential is not equivalent to a PhD in the U.S." In other words, caveat emptor.

Further, I know it's fun to cherry pick legal statutes to back you up, but in the immortal words of Inigo Montoya, "I do not think it means what you think it means."

 

Funny, I have written confirmation from 3 NACES firms that UCN has the appropriate accreditation and ability to issue a PhD and that at least one firm says they have issued such equivalency statements in the past. So the link to the World Higher Education Database entry for UCN means nothing? Hmmm, last I heard the UNESCO and IAU worked almost lock step on this topic. So you are saying on one hand they say they have PhDs on the other they do not?

ALL credential evaluators issue their own professional opinions. That means they can be wrong. The law seems abundantly clear and institutions other than UCN are offering PhD programs Universidad Centroamericana included. Their own accrediting body, CNU, recognizes the UC PhD. I feel extremely confident that I am correct that PhDs do exist in Nicaragua and institutions are authorized to issue those degrees. It appears that at least some credential evaluators are willing to look at all the relevant and current facts before issuing opinions, others are not.

Funny you characterize my efforts as "cherry picking" when in fact I located the core of Nicaragua Education Law, the entire corpus, not a minuscule vestige. Ultimately the Law of Nicaragua prevails as would the Law in the United States and individual states. Since you are apparently an expert on Nicaraguan law please inform myself and others what those passages mean, por favor.

Go to the Universidad Azetca thread and post your comments about it and and I will be happy to reply to those. You might be surprise to learn that even their degrees without RVOE standing have a legal basis, not equivalent to US Regionally Accreditation, but still legal.

Later.