Academic recommendations

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Helpful2013, Dec 28, 2013.

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  1. Helpful2013

    Helpful2013 Active Member

    I’d like to start a constructive discussion of a frequently unacknowledged problem for distance learners in getting into the doctoral program of choice: academic recommendations. Not insurmountable, but something people should definitely be thinking of when selecting their programs.

    I’ve read a number of threads here of people unable to move just yet, but hoping to use an available DL master’s as leverage to get into a selective doctoral program (distance or residential). If you hope to do a master’s degree and get into a doctoral program, the kind that’s reasonably competitive for a major job or academic position, you will need some really solid recommendations out of your master’s program. That becomes very difficult to do if your contacts have only been with adjunct faculty facilitating courses written by others, who only know you as a student number from marking your papers. In short, distance learning just isn’t the optimum way for faculty to get to know you or your abilities, or to build the kind of relationship where they want to sing your praises.

    Solutions? I have known of some people who attempted to get academic recommendations from advisors/enrollment counselors who they had signed up for courses with, although I would imagine that kind of bland recommendation wouldn’t help much. A more drastic one is to move and finish at least the last semester of the degree residentially, as in Harvard’s ALM program. So what do you all think? Any other solutions?

    Of course, if your prospective doctoral program only cares that you have two recommendations from any responsible adult to “check the box,” then you should have no worries, but you might find it not to be as competitive for your needs, either.
     
  2. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    I completed my master's 100% by distance at a state university. I only had 5 different professors who were all tenured. They know me by name, and I still correspond with them occasionally.
     
  3. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Yes, it would be, if that were a useful description of distance learning. But it isn't. There are distance learning programs like you describe, and there are distance learning programs with significant interaction between students and full time faculty. And it's not like there aren't classroom-based programs that rely on adjuncts and packaged courses.
     
  4. John Bear

    John Bear Senior Member

    Many universities offer what is, in effect, a combined Master's/Doctoral program, whether they call it that or not. One enrolls for the Doctorate, with a Bachelor's. After (typically) two or three years of courses, the doctoral qualifying exams are taken. If passed, one gets the Master's, and begins doctoral work (often little more than dissertation planning, research, writing, and defence). My wife considered such approaches at Harvard, Yale, Pittsburgh, Wisconsin, Loyola Chicago, and Vanderbilt (in philosophy), chose the latter, and was very pleased with the outcome (although she did it at her own pace, and took nearly seven years)
     
  5. Helpful2013

    Helpful2013 Active Member

    Thanks for responding, Steve, and I think that’s a fair point. As you say, there are distance programs like it, but that doesn’t describe them all. I’ll rephrase it as “programs with limited interaction beyond evaluating assignments.” So this sounds like a useful first step for people planning to take on a competitive higher degree - asking around to find out if their bachelor’s/master’s program offers the kind of interaction needed to give the opportunity for a good recommendation. But for those whose program is only available at a university offering the rather impersonal end of the teaching spectrum (or who are already in such a program), what suggestion do you have for people to bridge that gap?
     
  6. cookderosa

    cookderosa Resident Chef

    A great example would be completing your masters at TESC or similar. They don't even use academic titles, they only use "mentors" which do no original lecture or instruction. I think it's a reasonable question, because not everyone is attending a distance program at a B&M school (thought that was my preference for reasons exactly like this).
     
  7. Helpful2013

    Helpful2013 Active Member

    Thanks for this point, John. That was certainly a tidy solution. Can I ask if the Vanderbilt program was advertised as available through distance learning, or if your wife had to negotiate that? Too often, I think people don’t consider digging beyond the off the shelf options.

    Anything that draws people’s attention to this issue in time for them to benefit will make me happy.
     
  8. Helpful2013

    Helpful2013 Active Member

    Steve, I replied to your post before John's, but that one is apparently being moderated.
     
  9. Helpful2013

    Helpful2013 Active Member

    I don't doubt there are some. Steve, for the sake of prospective students reading this, could you name some of the universities that are noted for offering this experience through distance learning?
     
  10. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    The online master's program I attended was at Angelo State University. As I said, all of my professors were tenured. There was no part-time faculty in the program. I'm sure there are many other traditional universities that don't heavily utilize adjuncts. Some of them will hire full-time lecturers; they just aren't tenure track.
     
  11. Tedium42

    Tedium42 New Member

    I am enrolled in a course through University of Idaho ISI and the professor seems to have done or be doing many of the things I have set for myself as goals. He explained all of the stuff he was doing in the syllabus/course guide. A cursory internet search, and I found his homepage where he goes on to say many times that he loves being a mentor and guide to his students. This was a big motivation for me to take this class. He wrote the lessons, seems to care about his students, and is pursuing a similar career/educational path to the one I would like to take. Add to that he sounds like an all around awesome guy from all the student reviews online and I'm really happy that I decided to take this course.

    I mention all of that to say that situations like these are perfect opportunities for students to reach out and try to connect with their instructor. In most of the classes I've ever taken online the instructor will at least give you some form of introduction or have some kind of web presence. Take the time to go through the courses offered and take a minute to look up the teacher. You have a better chance of finding a sympathetic ear and a possible recommendation that way.

    That's one way, anyway. It may not always work or be an option, but it's better than shooting in the dark. I'm very interested to hear some other ideas. I'm planning to go to grad. school, too.
     
  12. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I'm not sure this really does much for prospective students, but since you asked, I did my Master's online through GW, and still know a number of my instructors five years later, some of whom were adjuncts, and some of whom are tenured. I've also taken distance courses that offered faculty interaction at a number of other schools where I've worked or attended, including Marymount University and Northeastern University.

    I see this as not so different from the classroom. You can sit in the back of the class, never raise your hand, hand in your papers, and do nothing more, and your instructors will quickly forget you. Or you can be up front, helping to drive the conversation and taking an active role, and if you do so then your instructors will get to know you. As with most conversations about academic quality, what's missing from the equation is the largest variable of all, that what one gets out of an academic experience is most directly impacted not by mode of instruction or other external factors, but by what one puts into it.
     
  13. graymatter

    graymatter Member

    I get asked 10-12 times per year for a letter for a letter of recommendation. I always say yes (or have so far) but note the limits of what I can honestly say. I review the course they took and note whether or not they received full points for participation, avoided any late penalties (or charges of plagiarism) and if they finished in the top X% of the class. Can't really do much more than that.

    As to the post-course contact: I now post my Twitter info and LinkedIn info during the last week of class. Usually only 2-3 students respond - and that's fine. But before I did that, I would get bunches of Facebook friend requests and that just got annoying (once I actually accepted because I thought that they were someone else).
     

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