Online vs On Campus Doctorate - What would you do?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by jam937, Nov 15, 2013.

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  1. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    What would you do? I know that's a loaded question but I have a decision to make regarding two possible options and I need some input.

    Background:
    I have a BS in Computer Science (RA)
    I am attending a public, state university online (RA)
    I have 30 days left to complete my MS in Computer Science
    I want to get a doctorate in IT/CS (50% personal reasons, 50% to teach)
    I have no debt and live frugally
    I have no spouse/children dependent on me
    I have 18 years exp. in IT (programming)
    I am middle aged (40+)

    Option 1
    Get online doctorate (DSU, Capella or Nova)
    Will cost approx. $40-60,000
    Keep my current salary
    Keep my current 40 hour per week job
    Spend 15-20 hours per week studying

    Option 2
    Go to public, state univ. as a full time campus student
    Will cost $0 (tuition waiver for PhD students)
    Received annual stipend of $17,000 for being a TA or RA
    Be a TA/RA requires 20 hours per week
    Spend 15-20 hours per week studying
    Less combined working/studying hours
    There is a huge loss of income


    Which option would you choose and why?


    On the one side I think if I'm going to invest the time to get a doctorate get the best one I can. Then I wonder if one really gets me anything the other can't and if I should just choose the fastest and easiest path.
     
  2. JBjunior

    JBjunior Active Member

    One costs a lot and may or may not have a ROI for what you want. The other has opportunity costs now but will probably pay off for a teaching gig.

    If you don't have a family to take care of and can afford to do a traditional doctorate, I think that is the way to go.
     
  3. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    Both options are costly. You should go for a win-win option.
    Keep your full-time job or even better go for higher paying job.
    Do a doctorate at a traditional university for between 20-30k, online. Maybe Edinburgh Napier.
    Do it for personal reasons - not for teaching, adjunct=low pay = low roi
    Leverage your experience, education, industry contacts, and position for something really big.
     
  4. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    You have no dependents and life is short. If one of these options pulls at you, go for it. If you can make ends meet on the stipend, and that's what you want to do, then don't be afraid of it.
     
  5. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

     
  6. TEKMAN

    TEKMAN Semper Fi!

    I agree with most replies, but you have to consider the competition as well as return on investment. If you look carefully, the program on campus might costs you more as you will sacrifice for several years without working. That means you lose income from a full-time job, and continue earning your professional experiences. Since you are in the 40's, will you able to adapt to the 30's and 20's cultures (folks on the campus).

    In my opinion, I would recommend the distance learning program at Nova Southeastern University. I am currently in the Ph.D in Computer Information System - Information Security program. I am only 30 years old, and I do not know if Doctorate is the right path for my career because my interests in teaching is 20%, and 80% is personal enrichment. Mostly the Ph.D students at Nova Southeastern University program are in the 40's and 50's. It is extremely easy when it comes to discussions as people bring in the professional experiences. While you are taking 2 semesters per year, your employer might chip in some of the tuition. So, you have 10 years to complete the program; therefore, after all you might not have to pay any tuition.

    I am only interesting in teaching with a Ph.D because my generation might not see any social security in the future. Therefore, I might utilize my Ph.D to teach when I retire from the professional workforce.
     
  7. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    My vote goes to Nova as well. A PhD from Nova will not be perceived as inferior to any of the typical no name state University. It can be completed part time.
    The cost might be high but I think it is lower in the long term than having to quit your job and go to University for 4 years just to end with the same job that you would with a PhD with Nova.

    In few words, if you can get into a top residential PhD then it might be worth it, otherwise a school like Nova is a better bet.
     
  8. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

  9. Ian Anderson

    Ian Anderson Active Member

    In all seriousnes I would exam your retirement plans carefully - that $40k could increase to $250k in 20 years.

    My DIL has a PhD and her hopes of finding a god full time academic position are fading now she is 40 years of age.
     
  10. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    This is true, we have few PhD graduates that cannot get full time academic employment and the go for low paid Post Doc positions that pay from 30 to 40K. Most BS graduates make more than this.

    The risk of making less than before is there. That is why you don't see many people lining up for full time residential PhD programs. Even if tuition is free, it is just not worth it.

    Part time distance programs seem to be more attractive but also there is the risk that you you will end with a PhD with no publications. A PhD with no publications is not an easy sell for a tenure track.
     
  11. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    Thanks for all the responses. It is helping me think things through.

    I understand which ever option I choose there will be no ROI, just personal satisfaction.

    According to the Computer Research Association undergrad enrollments in computing majors have risen for 5 straight years. Granted it's still down from its peak. I see a lot of open IT faculty positions right now.
    Undergrad Computer Science Enrollments Rise for Fifth Straight Year

    I have considered that it might become challenging for me to keep up with ever changing technology as I get older. This could be a factor whether teaching or staying in IT. This is a reason to get a doctorate to have some options when I get older.

    Loss of income and professional experiences is a disadvantage of the on campus option. I recently took off 2 years to be a full time student in which I did a BA and half my MS. I was concerned about being out of the work force so long so I decided to get a job. Plus I moved across the country and couldn't use my contacts to help get a job. It only took me 5 weeks from applying to interviewing to starting work. I had three offers. IT still has high demand.

    I also like having a PhD in case I need/want to work in retirement. That might be a reason to go with a better reputation school.

    I like Nova's program and academic reputation, but I am concerned with how often I would have to travel to Florida. I've also heard that once you reach ABD it's hard to finish due to their lack of faculty commitments to get you to the end.

    I don't feel a doctorate would hurt my professional career in IT. It probably won't help it, but it definitely won't hurt it.


    I am taking the GRE next week so that will factor into my decision.
     
  12. instant000

    instant000 Member

    Mathematically, continuing to work while going to school just seems to be the safer bet.

    Compare yourself against another 40+ who got the PhD in their 20s. Can you beat them out for the job at the research university? Probably not. However, there is more to higher education than tier 1 research universities. You could consider taking on a full-time teaching load at a community college. You could work at a technical school. These opportunities may be more appropriate for you, as you have a lot of work experience, and they might offer you the flexibility to continue to work in your field, and be an instructor. The main thing would be building up your teaching skills, since you already know the field, from working in it for years.

    I know a CPA who works at a community college. He makes 80K+ base, and he says that he works 4 days a week, and is off by noon, and is off almost every Friday. He knows that he could make a lot more if he went corporate, but he feels that he's basically unemployable now, as this gig is just too good for him. He has flexibility to make 100k+, if he takes on a few more classes. He gets lots of days off in the school schedule, and he can do side work if he feels like it. Of course, that is only a sample size of 1. It may not be premium IT money, but 80K is a pretty good deal for working half-days for 4-days a week, and getting tons of days off.

    Hope this helps give you some ideas.
     
  13. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    9.6% yearly return over the 20 years. Doable, but will need to take some risks, such as emerging market and small caps.
     
  14. distancedoc2007

    distancedoc2007 New Member

    I can relate to these arguments, which were fairly similar to my own for getting my doctorate. As you get older, it's always handy to have fresh education in case you want to work later in life. The research and writing experience you develop doing a doctorate can make it easier to write books and articles, do public speaking, teach part-time at a community college or university etc. - all ways to broaden your income streams in retirement. The personal satisfaction argument is one of the most compelling for me also. There's nothing quite like having gone the distance and tackled what is arguably the toughest challenge in education. If you keep your investment reasonable (South African universities for example), the ROI angle loses its importance in my view. Good luck with your decisions!
     
  15. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Not every decision should be able maximizing financial return. Dollars aren't points in the game of life, they're a tool that helps people reach their goals. If you would prefer to do a full time program on campus because you'd likely build better connections, learn more, or even just enjoy it more, then don't dismiss that route just for pecuniary reasons.
     
  16. warguns

    warguns Member

    In general, I believe a degree from a decent quality state university would be the better path. In the academic marketplace degrees from predominantly online schools are perceived as distinctly inferior.

    My reservation here is that you are old for the marketplace. Assuming it will take you 5 years minimum to earn a PhD, you will be entering the marketplace at a distinct disadvantage because younger candidates are preferred for tenure-track positions. With this consideration in mind, and accepting the fact that you will most likely never get a tenure-track position, I think continuing in your employment and working part-time toward a degree either online or otherwise would be the wiser course. Note that even though Nova is expensive, if you are already working in IT the cost should be tax-deductible. I assume you have already approached your employer for financial support?
     
  17. jam937

    jam937 New Member

    I have decided to go the online route and keep my job. My teaching opportunities will likely be limited to for-profit schools, community colleges and small public schools. Mostly due to my age, lack of research papers and lack of teaching credentials. I don't think a B&M PhD provides much advantage given my situation. I think any doctorate from any school will probably be adequate.

    Nova is about $64k for tuition and some fees plus $8k over 3 years for traveling once per quarter to Florida for the 3 day residencies. Figure another $3k per year beyond three for the residencies. So it is expensive as you say and my employer does not provide any support for education.
     
  18. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    I totally agree with you, if you are middle age, a B&M doctorate won't help you much unless is from a top school.

    To the OP, another cheaper option is a PhD by publication from British Schools. Most would cost around 15K total. A couple of trips might be required but still way cheaper than Nova, NCU, Walden, etc.

    Just publish 3 to 4 papers in good journals and apply for a doctorate. Most schools require a year registration that is about 10K british pounds.
    Most British schools have this option now.
     
  19. Shawn Ambrose

    Shawn Ambrose New Member

    Small private schools will also give you a good look if you have extensive work experience.

    Shawn
     
  20. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    You have just made a wise decision, especially if you are considering teaching business. The next thing is to find the cheapest accredited doctorate from a reputable country. A study done in Canada found that in recent years 35% of PhDs employed in academia were earned in foreign countries.
     

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