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  1. #1
    decimon is offline Registered User
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  2. #2
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    Anti-First Amendment are just as fascist as those they supposedly hate.
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  3. #3
    decimon is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    Anti-First Amendment are just as fascist as those they supposedly hate.

    And attempted murder is what Sherlock would call a clew. I loved how deftly that cop parried those strikes.

  4. #4
    me again is offline Registered User
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    Thumbs down Antifa = Facism & Communism Combined

    Antifa are facists. They are also paid subversives (not grassroots).

    Antifa uses Nazi and Communistic techniques to accomplish their objectives.

    Antifa incorrectly re-labels things in an effort to garner public support e.g. while Antifa are fascists, they conversely label all who oppose them as fascists. It's a communistic word game that is used to elicit public sympathy (but it's not working as they planned). Their methodologies are backfiring.

    Nazism and Communism have been studied for many years. As a result, their methodologies (to influence public opinion) will no longer have the same impact or public influence that it had in the 1930s in Germany. Antifa is using outdated methods for public manipulation. Patriotic United States citizens see right through the Antifa charade.
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  5. #5
    decimon is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Antifa are facists. They are also paid subversives (not grassroots).

    Antifa uses Nazi and Communistic techniques to accomplish their objectives.

    Antifa incorrectly re-labels things in an effort to garner public support e.g. while Antifa are fascists, they conversely label all who oppose them as fascists. It's a communistic word game that is used to elicit public sympathy (but it's not working as they planned). Their methodologies are backfiring.

    Nazism and Communism have been studied for many years. As a result, their methodologies (to influence public opinion) will no longer have the same impact or public influence that it had in the 1930s in Germany. Antifa is using outdated methods for public manipulation. Patriotic United States citizens see right through the Antifa charade.

    There was no internet in the 1930s. People saw B&W newspaper pictures, or newsreels at the movie house, of strutting marchers that could well have been Bolshevik, Fascist or Nazi. They would have been hard pressed to grasp what was going on in Europe.

  6. #6
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Antifa incorrectly re-labels things in an effort to garner public support e.g. while Antifa are fascists, they conversely label all who oppose them as fascists. It's a communistic word game that is used to elicit public sympathy (but it's not working as they planned). Their methodologies are backfiring.
    Oh? And who are these terrific individuals, on many sides? Do I take it that you support Antifa opponents?

    Again, I believe the Antifa ideology and tactics are misguided at best, or directly counterproductive. I believe some might be useful idiots for shady interests. Still, they explicitly define themselves as being in opposition to certain groups, so how about looking at these first? We saw some in Charleston.
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  7. #7
    me again is offline Registered User
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    Thumbs down Antifa's communistic reverse-psychology tactics not working

    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Antifa incorrectly re-labels things in an effort to garner public support e.g. while Antifa are fascists, they conversely label all who oppose them as fascists. It's a communistic word game that is used to elicit public sympathy (but it's not working as they planned). Their methodologies are backfiring.

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    I take it you support Antifa opponents?
    Stanislav, your scripted question demonstrates the exact reverse-psychology that Antifa facists/communists are desirous of achieving. Antifa's methodologies may work on clueless foreigners, but not on patriotic United States citizens, particularly with the advent of the internet, as decimon aptly noted.

    Quote Originally Posted by decimon View Post
    There was no internet in the 1930s. People saw B&W newspaper pictures, or newsreels at the movie house, of strutting marchers that could well have been Bolshevik, Fascist or Nazi. They would have been hard pressed to grasp what was going on in Europe.
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  9. #8
    Bruce is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    Do I take it that you support Antifa opponents?
    I oppose Antifa.

    Sorry for not falling into your attempted word trap, now you can't come back with "Oh, so you support WHITE SUPREMACISTS???
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  10. #9
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce View Post
    I oppose Antifa.

    Sorry for not falling into your attempted word trap, now you can't come back with "Oh, so you support WHITE SUPREMACISTS???
    You see, the thing is, "Antifa" is short for "Anti-Faschist Action". It's defined as a loose collective of individuals and groups seeking to emulate earlier European movements, that specifically were set up to oppose neo-Nazi groups with direct action. This is all that all these guys have in common. So it's rather hard to "oppose (all of) Antifa" without being either white supremacist or an "all sides, all sides" weasel, or just not thinking one's position through.

    Having said that, to "support" Antifa is well-meaning but unwise. Most of "Antifa" are silly teenagers that'll grow out of it; some are online SJWs with various degrees of effectiveness. Assuming that the country is not totally lawless (and it is not),about the only use for club-wielding pseudo-uniformed guys in legitimate protests is defence of non-violent protesters from the thugs from another side (and there were reports of anarchists and Antifa in Charleston doing just that). Anything beyond this is, at best, a misguided tactic.

    Then there are people with Antifa swag who get filmed beating up some randoms that are either Trump supporters or participated in stupid but non-violent "Free Speech" rallies. Or taking the bait and disrupting some third-rate ideologue's (Milo, Coulter) speaking gig. Members of this last group are criminals and should be arrested.
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  11. #10
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Stanislav, your scripted question demonstrates the exact reverse-psychology that Antifa facists/communists are desirous of achieving. Antifa's methodologies may work on clueless foreigners, but not on patriotic United States citizens, particularly with the advent of the internet, as decimon aptly noted.
    We're at this for a while, and your supposedly superior grasp of these thing don't impress me. Then again, I do not make a mistake of equating all "patriotic United States citizens" with you.

    From all I can grasp, "Antifa" tend to come from the Left's fringe; their tactics are obsolete and stupid. Which, nevertheless, does not make them "Fascists", except if you adopt the more primitive word usage and just use "fascist" as synonym to "bad" or "thing I do not approve of". Soviet propaganda did just that.
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  12. #11
    heirophant is offline Registered User
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    I'm proud to be an antifa opponent.

    As far as I'm concerned, antifa is the functional equivalent of Hitler's brownshirts, and the corresponding left-wing groups in 1920's Germany. All of them were political thugs, who sought to silence opponents by threats of violence or by actually physically injuring them.

    Trying to silence political opponents with violence is certainly undemocratic. I wouldn't say that it's specifically fascist though. Many others with different ideologies have used political violence too, notably radical parties of the left.

    The idea that one's opponents are just so evil that it doesn't matter ethically what one does to them, when it actually becomes a virtue to hurt them, is just another contemporary example of moral judgmentalism run amok. It's reminiscent of pogroms against heretics, Jews and witches centuries ago. (I expect the psychology was the same, the mixture of contempt for one's targets and insufferable self-righteousness. That same psychology fueled Hitler's 'final solution'.)

    'There's somebody in a red MAGA hat! Kill him!!'

    Of course we know that if the police officers, or the wearers of MAGA hats pull out firearms and defend their lives and persons, that would become the MSM headline. I suspect that those dark but wealthy forces who are funding the antifa are hoping for exactly that.
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  13. #12
    me again is offline Registered User
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    Thumbs down Antifi = Paid by Communists

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    "Antifa" is short for "Anti-Faschist Action". It seeks to oppose neo-Nazi groups with direct action.

    It's hard to oppose Antifa without being either:
    - white supremacist or
    - an "all sides, all sides" weasel or
    - not thinking one's position through.
    Stanislav, your script is typical of Soviet reverse-psychology methodologies. Antifi is not grassroots in the United States. Antifi is paid by alt.left communists, such as George Soros and others.
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  14. #13
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by heirophant View Post
    I'm proud to be an antifa opponent.

    As far as I'm concerned, antifa is the functional equivalent of Hitler's brownshirts, and the corresponding left-wing groups in 1920's Germany. All of them were political thugs, who sought to silence opponents by threats of violence or by actually physically injuring them.
    Allright, I have to ask: what about these tiki-torch-bearing, occasionally hooded, hate-spewing people? What are they an equivalent of?

    Quote Originally Posted by heirophant View Post
    Trying to silence political opponents with violence is certainly undemocratic. I wouldn't say that it's specifically fascist though. Many others with different ideologies have used political violence too, notably radical parties of the left.

    The idea that one's opponents are just so evil that it doesn't matter ethically what one does to them, when it actually becomes a virtue to hurt them, is just another contemporary example of moral judgmentalism run amok. It's reminiscent of pogroms against heretics, Jews and witches centuries ago. (I expect the psychology was the same, the mixture of contempt for one's targets and insufferable self-righteousness. That same psychology fueled Hitler's 'final solution'.)

    'There's somebody in a red MAGA hat! Kill him!!'
    Now that's just silly. They'll just take off MAGA hats.

    Seriously, all you wrote is bad, but it's wholly unclear how well does it describe any group. Even "Antifa".

    Quote Originally Posted by heirophant View Post
    Of course we know that if the police officers, or the wearers of MAGA hats pull out firearms and defend their lives and persons, that would become the MSM headline. I suspect that those dark but wealthy forces who are funding the antifa are hoping for exactly that.
    Oh, that is quite plausible, actually. I suspect we imagine those dark forces differently, though. You see, for groups in existence, supposedly, from the seventies, a suspiciously large fraction of Antifa coverage comes from this very year. Wikipedia page is brand new, and so are all the references; also, a few short years ago this role was filled by "New Black Panthers". Antifa appeared just as the Right needed a bogeyman, and was immediately picked up by both alt-Right and allied Russian fake news bots. Putin allies are undoubtedly dark, very wealthy, and are known to fund both far Right and far Left - so they would be my first guess.
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  15. #14
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Stanislav, your script is typical of Soviet reverse-psychology methodologies. Antifi is not grassroots in the United States. Antifi is paid by alt.left communists, such as George Soros and others.
    Proof please. Certainly Antifa tactics are not compatible to Open Society Foundation goals, so it's counterintuitive Soros would fund them.


    On the other hand, Putin might. Now, it would fit his goals 100% to fund both alt-Reicht and "Antifa". It's Lenin's strategy of "the worse, the better" (one the KGB agent would be trained in).
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  17. #15
    me again is offline Registered User
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    Thumbs down

    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    Putin might [fund Antifi]. It would fit his goals 100% to fund both alt-Reicht and "Antifa".
    Stanislav, rubbish.
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  18. #16
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    Stanislav, rubbish.
    Cute how a Trump supporter just instinctively jumps to protect Comrade Vlad. But try to elaborate. Why would his tactic here be any different from what he already does in Europe? I remember how Ukraine's own right wing party, Svoboda, had to cancel their talks about joining a union of like-minded groups in European Parliament - after each and every party in that group sided with Vlad on Crimea. They also had a big neo-Nazi forum in St. Petersburgh in 2015. At the same time, Germany's neo-Commie party, Die Linke, is the largest Putinversteher group. He certainly owns a couple "Antifa" groups in Europe, here and there. Why not here?
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