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  1. #1
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Rep. Steve King: ‘We can’t restore our civilization with somebody else’s babies’

    XVI.8: Confucius said, "There are three things of which the superior man stand in awe. He stands in awe of the ordinances of Heaven. He stands in awe of great men. He stands in awe of the words of the sages. The mean man does not know the ordinances of Heaven, and consequently does not stand in awe of them. He is disrespectful to great men. He makes sport of the words of the sages."

  2. #2
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    What is even the...? I'm lost for words.

    Folks, this is kind of things Trump style of politics normalizes. This. is. not. normal. It just isn't. Rep. King is an older guy, and many of these hold views like this; in normal times, they're not comfortable sharing these.

    Before someone tries to educate me on the horrors of radical islam, a few notable facts.
    * In the seventies, the biggest terrorist threat was from white guys: nationalists like the IRA or the assorted left-wing crazies (some supported by the USSR).
    * Currently, the biggest threat I care about comes from Russia, and these guys, in racial terms, are identical to me, and supposedly share a lot of culture as well (I have close relatives who are not only Russian but virulently anti-Western and anti-Ukrainian as well, some despite being born, raised, and spending their whole life in Ukraine). In that conflict, you got to remember, both sides are supposed to be Orthodox Christian Eastern Slavs.
    * Every. single. group except Protestant Anglos was accused to be a "threat to our civilization". Irish children were depicted as monkeys in Punch (making fun of the signs of severe malnutrition, to boot). Polish are still the butt of many ethnic jokes (and hate crimes in England - thanks, Brexit!) - and stereotypical Pole is among the whitest folks on the planet. I'm not under any illusions anyone ever made a distinction between a Polish from Kresy and a Ukrainian from Galicia (the area known in Poland as "Kresy"). So if you assume Rep. King talks about your civilization - check your assumptions.
    * I increasingly find the term "deplorable" rather accurate.
    Last edited by Stanislav; 03-13-2017 at 09:08 AM.
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  3. #3
    Bruce is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    What is even the...? I'm lost for words.

    Folks, this is kind of things Trump style of politics normalizes. This. is. not. normal. It just isn't. Rep. King is an older guy, and many of these hold views like this; in normal times, they're not comfortable sharing these.

    Before someone tries to educate me on the horrors of radical islam, a few notable facts.
    * In the seventies, the biggest terrorist threat was from white guys: nationalists like the IRA or the assorted left-wing crazies (some supported by the USSR).
    * Currently, the biggest threat I care about comes from Russia, and these guys, in racial terms, are identical to me, and supposedly share a lot of culture as well (I have close relatives who are not only Russian but virulently anti-Western and anti-Ukrainian as well, some despite being born, raised, and spending their whole life in Ukraine). In that conflict, you got to remember, both sides are supposed to be Orthodox Christian Eastern Slavs.
    * Every. single. group except Protestant Anglos was accused to be a "threat to our civilization". Irish children were depicted as monkeys in Punch (making fun of the signs of severe malnutrition, to boot). Polish are still the butt of many ethnic jokes (and hate crimes in England - thanks, Brexit!) - and stereotypical Pole is among the whitest folks on the planet. I'm not under any illusions anyone ever made a distinction between a Polish from Kresy and a Ukrainian from Galicia (the area known in Poland as "Kresy"). So if you assume Rep. King talks about your civilization - check your assumptions.
    * I increasingly find the term "deplorable" rather accurate.
    Of course, there's absolutely no mention whatsoever of either Trump or Islam, except by you and the New York Times, which is on par with the National Enquirer for validity and being an unbiased news source. Complete and total straw man argument.

    Stanislav, do you see things that others don't in real life, also? Like, Republican boogeymen hiding behind trees as you walk down the street?
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  4. #4
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce View Post
    Of course, there's absolutely no mention whatsoever of either Trump or Islam, except by you and the New York Times, which is on par with the National Enquirer for validity and being an unbiased news source. Complete and total straw man argument.

    Stanislav, do you see things that others don't in real life, also? Like, Republican boogeymen hiding behind trees as you walk down the street?
    So it's not notable because it's just the garden variety, normal racism? Okey dokey.
    Steve King is a Tea Partier, the group Trump owes a lot in terms of campaigning themes. Don't pretend there's no link. "Threat of radical islam" is the latest excuse for bigotry. (Fun fact: the latest act of terror in North America is Quebec City mosque bombing. Could you point me to Trump's statement on the topic please?)
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  5. #5
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bruce View Post
    Of course, there's absolutely no mention whatsoever of either Trump or Islam, except by you and the New York Times, which is on par with the National Enquirer for validity and being an unbiased news source. Complete and total straw man argument.

    Stanislav, do you see things that others don't in real life, also? Like, Republican boogeymen hiding behind trees as you walk down the street?
    I don't see any boogeymen. What I currently see is good men being influenced by trash fake news outlets like Breitbart and Infowars. Many on the right have racist views, and those views have come to light now more than ever. Hell, some still believe that Obama is not American. Trump appoints the drunkard alt Reich Steve Bannon as his right hand man? That makes me vow right here in now to never, ever be a Republican. I will never forget, and most minority Americans will never forget either. There are still some good Republicans out there like McCain and Graham.

    As I have a propensity towards verbosity, I will come to a close briefly. Once again, I see some VERY educated men being influenced by fake conspiracy outlets, and I just don't understand. Didn't our teachers tell us to cite RELIABLE sources of information? Having said that, 2018 and 2020 is coming up quickly. And tables can be turned quickly. Those protesters out there (me included) have risen unlike anything I have seen in my lifetime, and they do not like what they see.

    One last thing. It is Monday, and Conway said she has no proof of Obama wiretapping. Typical. McCain said Trump should apologize if he has no evidence, but Trump will never apologize for anything, because is not capable of apologizing or asking for forgiveness.

    ***Please forgive any typos or grammatical errors. I do not do spell check, and I just write stuff down as I think it.***
    Last edited by Abner; 03-13-2017 at 09:39 AM.
    XVI.8: Confucius said, "There are three things of which the superior man stand in awe. He stands in awe of the ordinances of Heaven. He stands in awe of great men. He stands in awe of the words of the sages. The mean man does not know the ordinances of Heaven, and consequently does not stand in awe of them. He is disrespectful to great men. He makes sport of the words of the sages."

  6. #6
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    Folks, this is kind of things Trump style of politics normalizes. This. is. not. normal. It just isn't. Rep. King is an older guy, and many of these hold views like this; in normal times, they're not comfortable sharing these.
    I don't like Trump either, but Steve King has publicly made racist and sexist comments like this for years.
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  7. #7
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    I don't like Trump either, but Steve King has publicly made racist and sexist comments like this for years.
    Yes. And he was not alone. But in the pre-Trumpian world, all these people occupied an anachronistic fringe. Can you say the same, given some of Trump's rhetoric, Bannon, Miller, even Sessions?
    Just to remind: HRC won the popular vote, and would have been massively better President. There.
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  9. #8
    decimon is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    Many on the right have racist views...

    Many on the left have racist views. No matter how you group people, many have racist views.

  10. #9
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    Quote Originally Posted by decimon View Post
    Many on the left have racist views. No matter how you group people, many have racist views.
    I suppose. The alt-reich and the SJWs really are warped reflections of each other.
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  11. #10
    SteveFoerster is offline Resident Gadfly
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    Quote Originally Posted by decimon View Post
    Many on the left have racist views. No matter how you group people, many have racist views.
    I suppose. The alt-reich and the SJWs really are warped reflections of each other.
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  12. #11
    Maniac Craniac is offline Moderator
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    I don't know anything about Steve King other than that nobody seems to like him. (I've seen negative headline after negative headline about him over the years but never once was motivated to actually read anything about him.) I'd like to make the general observation that there are very few politicians that are actually anti-immigration. The most vocal on the subject are anti-illegal immigration. Not the same thing, and it's dishonest to deliberately conflate the two as I've seen happen time and time again in everything from debates, protests and bumper stickers.

    ------------------------

    Now, let's veer left and take the second rabbit hole on the right....

    My World Population text book (from when I took the ECE, now known as UExcel) made the argument that a constant supply of working-age immigrants were necessary for keeping our Social Security system afloat.

    Besides the fact that such an argument comes with the tacit admission that Social Security retirement benefits are, basically, a Ponzi scheme, there is a decent point hidden in there somewhere.

    China is currently reeling under the burden of their decades long one-child policy that has left them with an aging population with very few young people to take care of them. Similarly, although not due to state policy, the nationwide fertility rate in the US has trickled to below replacement level. This means that, without a steady flow of immigrants, we can run into the same problem here until the tail end of rectangulation (when the number of older people declines drastically due to simultaneously dying due to mostly natural causes). There needs to be a balance and a slow demographic transition to avoid crisis. LEGAL immigration could play an important role here.
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    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    I suppose. The alt-reich and the SJWs really are warped reflections of each other.
    Well, in theory, yeah, you can be a left-wing racist. But can you name a D counterpart for Rep. Steve King, or explain how Trump did so poorly among African-Americans? Postulating symmetry here is wronger than wrong.
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  14. #13
    Stanislav is offline Registered User
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    Ted Heiks is offline Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by SteveFoerster View Post
    I suppose. The alt-reich and the SJWs really are warped reflections of each other.
    And what are the SJWs?
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  17. #15
    Bruce is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stanislav View Post
    So it's not notable because it's just the garden variety, normal racism? Okey dokey.
    Steve King is a Tea Partier, the group Trump owes a lot in terms of campaigning themes. Don't pretend there's no link. "Threat of radical islam" is the latest excuse for bigotry. (Fun fact: the latest act of terror in North America is Quebec City mosque bombing. Could you point me to Trump's statement on the topic please?)
    Again, absolutely no one mentioned Trump or Islam except you and the pathetic New York Times.

    Keep propping up those straw men, they're awfully easy to knock down, right?
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  18. #16
    Bruce is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    I don't see any boogeymen. What I currently see is good men being influenced by trash fake news outlets like Breitbart and Infowars.
    As opposed to those guardians of journalistic integrity like CNN, which rigged the debate for Hillary Clinton, and the "fake but accurate" New York Times?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    Many on the right have racist views, and those views have come to light now more than ever.
    Many on the left have racist views. Kind of like how in 2008, Bill Clinton said of Obama "A few years ago, this guy would be getting us coffee".

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    Hell, some still believe that Obama is not American.
    You do know that the whole "birther" movement was started by Hillary Clinton during the 2008 primary, right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    Trump appoints the drunkard alt Reich Steve Bannon as his right hand man?
    One of my grandparent's neighbors was a concentration camp survivor, I remember seeing his tattoo and hearing the stories of horror perpetuated by Nazis upon him and his family. Abner, don't insult the memories of those people, and especially don't be intellectually lazy by branding everyone with whom you disagree a "Nazi", either directly or through clear innuendo ("alt Reich").

    You're much better than that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    That makes me vow right here in now to never, ever be a Republican.
    That's fine, I haven't been since the 1980's. I'm unenrolled, which is the new term for independent, since there is an Independent Party in Massachusetts.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    I will never forget, and most minority Americans will never forget either. There are still some good Republicans out there like McCain and Graham.
    McCain is a war hero, and a political loser. Lindsay Graham is the embodiment of what's wrong with Washington; a career politician who will do or say anything to stay in power.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    As I have a propensity towards verbosity, I will come to a close briefly. Once again, I see some VERY educated men being influenced by fake conspiracy outlets, and I just don't understand. Didn't our teachers tell us to cite RELIABLE sources of information? Having said that, 2018 and 2020 is coming up quickly. And tables can be turned quickly. Those protesters out there (me included) have risen unlike anything I have seen in my lifetime, and they do not like what they see.
    Mark my words; these pointless protests will backfire, and will further cement Trump's popularity with ordinary Americans, who have jobs to go to, and don't have time to protest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Abner View Post
    One last thing. It is Monday, and Conway said she has no proof of Obama wiretapping. Typical. McCain said Trump should apologize if he has no evidence, but Trump will never apologize for anything, because is not capable of apologizing or asking for forgiveness.
    You do know that there was a FISA wiretap warrant issued for Trump Tower in October of 2016, right?
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