Holding The Coat

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by Laser200, Aug 2, 2006.

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  1. Laser200

    Laser200 Guest

    On the television program called "Meet the Press" it was said by one of the reporters that the United States is viewed as "Holding the Coat" of Israel as they conduct their attacks.

    This looks very negative to the rest of the world for the interest of our country. We may be at the dawn of World War III and our conduct, or lack of conduct, will be documented in the history books.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 2, 2006
  2. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Excellent..I think staking out a position that terrorist should be destroyed, and government that either aid, or turn a blind eye to their activity will face the consiquences is an rock solid position. Would you allow some drug cartels to launch missle attacks from Mexico and have those buttheads down there turn a blind eye to it? Dont think so, even for a Jimmy Carter Democrate.

    I mean really..Didnt they pull out of there once with the assurance that this crap wouldnt happen. Then the Lebonese govt wasnt able to get the job done ( not totally there fault, but a fact). Israel agreed to leave based on the assurance that attacks and kidnappings will stop..But this is traditionally what happens when you depend on on imputent organization such as the UN. Can anyone say League of Nations?


    I think one of the only faults of the Israelis is the fact that they engaged in trades before and put the thought in there mind that that is they way they do business. They set the precident, and now they have the break it.

    I think its terrible that civilians ever have to be caught in any conflict, but as long as they have totally irresponsible government, and TERRORIST hiding in civilian neighborhoods using them as human shields. That chivalry for you! O guess its "allahs will" for innocent goat herders to get blown up because they are hiding behind him..more BS...

    I dont put up with that BS out of Christians in this country...why would we put up with it out of Muslims in another? I cant figure out how Liberals hate the christian right so much, but warm up to even more crazy muslims. I thinks its fear, but I could be wrong.

    Lets not forget to mention all the crap coming out of how AP a reuters are publishing misleading and fraudulent photos. They shoud just ask people to sew a star on there shirt.....Thought journalist were neutral? (Please keep your laughter till the end of the rant)

    I think its admirable to be against war whenever possible, and for some that is always the case. BUT, its is arguable that millions of Pols, Slavs, Jews, and Russians would have lived had the appeasers in this country had stood up and said no. BUT, instead they decided to give Hitler everything he wanted till it was too late. O so simliar to Iran its scarey. But i personally think that most people on the polar opposite of me wouldnt fight if they were at their door..or they are prepared to dress their daughters and wives in sheets. Not sure which...


    Who really cares what everyone else thinks really? Didnt your folks ask you if everyone else jumped off a bridge would you? All this worry about what other people think looks like one thing and one thing only...weakness. Period.


    IMHO of course...

    PS. History is written by the victor in case nobody noticed. So as long as we dont have a bunch of cowards and appeasers in charge we will be writing the book.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 9, 2006
  3. thomaskolter

    thomaskolter New Member

    I don't care if the world likes us I just want the world to FEAR us. Really most nations don't like the United States and we have not fought a real war in over 50 years so why should they respect us. You wat to know my opinion we should support Israel 100% and fight Al Queda like they fight their terrorist enemy. They are not making war on a nation and not fighting a war at all its a police action. The terrorists are using human shields a war crime, they kidnapped Israeli soldier a clear act of war if a nation did it and are firing missles terrorizing Israeli citizens of all faiths. Not just Jews but Christians and peaceful Muslims.

    I think we could learn from them if rrght after 9/11 and getting proof Al Queda did the attack we NUKED (yes dropped a large NUKE) on Tora Bora we would have crushed the will of our enemy to get support from nation-states. If we went after their infrastructures like Israel is against their enemy we would have won by now. Not made any friends but we would be feared and respected for what we could do.

    When did the civilized world reward terrorists or negotiate with them if it was a matter of two civilized nations fighting one can negotiate a peace, this is not the same fight we cannot deal with these sorts of people. And Israels only peace can come from the sword look at their history they won peace or at least non-major wars after a war. Egypt came to the table, Syria won't risk a war, Jordan is cordial to them and Iran is not stupid enough to try and attack.

    Its time the United States makes a stand its us against the fanatical terrorists and help Israel and might I add the same group killed hundreds of our marines years ago. We should now help Israel and exact our revenge!
     
  4. Dave C.

    Dave C. New Member

    All the reasons why the world hates the US nicely wrapped up in two posts.

    Can any of the more intelligent posters restore my faith in your wonderful country?

    I am flying to the US on Sunday under the veil of real terrorist threat and yee-har jokers like you continue to spew forth.

    Pathetic.

    Dave C.
     
  5. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    And what exactly is the other plan Dave? The pathic thing is when people put blinders on refuse to see the truth? Remeber the flight over Scottland? Or terroirst throwing handicaped people off of ocean liners? You my friend are the reason they have stepped up. People without the backbone to say no. Its funny, people like you though that we could just leave ole' Adolf alone too...

    Hey, why are you coming here if you side with the rest of the "haters". I have to imagine its for the same reason everyone else wants us around...Money. So in summary, that means that you personal feelings about the US, or your "principles", can be simply sold out for the right amount of cash. Which pretty much summurizes all the rest of the haters who only call us when they need something. Reminds you of a worthless cousin doesnt it....O, that rights, MOST of you Euro-trash are just that...

    Have a safe flight....:D
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 11, 2006
  6. Dave C.

    Dave C. New Member

    Lou,

    Notice my first comment was made in the third person, it is not a view I share.

    My second comment was not ironic, it was sincere. I think there is much that is wonderful about your country and I have a lot of good American friends. The problem is I think the USA is let down by a right-wing minority who alienate the rest of the world with their 'we are the greatest, let's go and kick ass' attitude.
    It just gets my back up when I see a knee-jerk reaction with no real thought where the answer is to 'nuke 'em all'. The trouble is, history has shown, however many you nuke, more will come. And in the end there will be nothing left. Unfortunately there will always be such an extreme faction and we just have to minimise risk in the best way we can. The peace process has to be the line of first defence, war has to be a last resort. As somebody working in the oil industry I have a daily painful reminder of the real reason we invaded Iraq. But believe me I support a country going to war in defence of its soil.

    And yes...I am visiting your country on business, however much I like it (and I do) I have no plans to visit on vacation.

    If you look back through my posts you will see the level of my reaction was out of character. Truth be told it was out of frustration, watching representatives of the world's leading nation doing themselves no favours at all. I think I was a little strong, and I apologise for that...I do not however apologise for my sentiments - certain American people need to wind their neck in.

    Just think about it Lou, we could even have some civil discourse and learn something.

    Have a good weekend.

    Dave C.
     
  7. thomaskolter

    thomaskolter New Member

    Ok a nuke on Tora Bora ok overkill but we did have a bomb that generates fire and sucks up the oxygen for miles we could have dropped those there and had the same effect.

    That said i agree we can't win this killing the soldiers they don't care and are likely to be replaced fast. We are not talking the IRA in Ireland they cared about their survival and were willing to talk in the end. These terrorists don't care that is the trust. What I want our nation to do is target those that DO care te people and groups and nations supplying them with material aid and resources to fight. Instead of targeting the head target the body.

    It clear several Saudi ruling family members are likely aiding terrorists I say extradite them and if the government won't we should target them with either assassines or military targeted air strikes. Ever see CLEAR AND PRESENT DANGER that is the way to take out the head of the snake you target the ability of them to finance their operations. You hurt the ones that do care.

    Lets say Iran gave Al Queda resources I see no reason not to have a UN sanctions option or barring that attacking their infrastructure breaking them costing billions of dollars. Its just like WWII or other early wars you target the soldiers and the infrastructure of the war machine to win the war- you choke the enemy around then neck and stab them in the heart so to speak. That is the smart way to fight a war.
     
  8. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Dave,


    Hey, I apologize If i seemed unusually antgonized in my previous post. Its frustrating to watch people watch the same events unfold in a differnt time and come to the same conclusions. I personally have children I want to be able to go and get a pizza with friend when they are in High School in a few years, and not be blown up the way school children are blown up in Israel. Dont you understand that a moderate use of force now protects everyone in the world from an extreme use in the future, which is the crazy "nukem all" plan..which no one wins..

    As for invading Iraq...gas is $3.50+ here now, so that definatly didnt help. Oil make money based on volume, so this doesnt really compute, but I understand the thought. If Clinton had invaded the Netherland we would have known it was for the hookers and dope...:D


    You have to fight tough men from a tough stance. These guys are bullies, and if you try to reason with them they see that as weakness or fear. I wish they would sit down and talk like we did with the communist, but the Russian people have the same goals.. decent life, good health, raise children, grow old in peace, ect....but these people dont want that, they want us dead. That elimnates the ability to negotiate with them. Not to mention that they LIE like the dogs they are.....I mean the current Isreali conflict is a great example...Doctored pictures, the same old lady loosing two houses, the same blown up building over and over again.....


    I personally want peace...thats what any reasonable person wants, but I truely dont think that our current enemy will let us have that. As for the right wing here..Im a constitutional conservative, and dont really consider myself right wing, but Im definaltly right of you. But Bush won last time by the biggest victory since Reagan, with 51% of the vote (Clinton got 44%), so it not a minority, but is presented that way in the press.
     
  9. JR1

    JR1 New Member

    Interesting thread.
     
  10. Laser200

    Laser200 Guest

    Interesting Thread

    Reality may prove to be more interesting than anything we can imagine in this thread. Stay tuned to see if Middle East peace holds.
     
  11. lspahn

    lspahn New Member

    Re: Interesting Thread

    No doubt about it.


    If anyone thinks the Hezbos will keep the peace are nuts. They have consistantly violated agreement after agreement. They are buying time.

    The other scenerio is that idiot Olmeert is out, and a real hawk like Netanyaho(spell?) is back in. He would have gone after there sources which opens a much bigger can of worms.

    Either way, it amazes me that people thing that they have the power to stop something that has been going on for thousands of years. Maybe the solution is to over arm everyone and let them slug it out. My money is still on the Israelis.
     
  12. elyk1979

    elyk1979 New Member

    Dont you see that a "moderate" (1000+ civilians dead in Lebanon) will only lead to more hatred and more contempt? The "moderate" violence only serves the interests of the militants as it fuels fundamentalism.

    Regardless of what the right wing wants the general public to believe, diplomacy is the only way. People tend to have a memory that only lasts as long as when the conflict (current crisis) began. There are many reasons for the current conflict that dates back many, many years. Lets not oversimplify the situation!
     

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