MFA = PhD?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Roscoe Barnes III, Apr 28, 2003.

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  1. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    From the website: The Master of Fine Arts program is a terminal degree in the arts and is recognized as the equivalent to a Ph.D.

    Umm, not really. The MFA is a terminal degree, but not the same as a doctorate. It is much more like an MBA, a credential expected in order to hold some teaching positions.

    You'll often see ads for teaching positions that require the MFA, but not requiring a Ph.D. is not the same as making the MFA equivalent to one.
     
  2. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    It depends on what "recognized as the equivalent to a Ph.D." means.

    MFAs are terminal degrees. They are the highest degrees that studio artists normally earn. They are the degree that is usually required of studio art faculty in colleges and universities. They involve putting on a gallery show of original work, a creative production that is somewhat similar to a dissertation. MFA degrees from top art schools carry prestige, at least among artists and those that associate with them.

    On the other hand, most Ph.D.s probably wouldn't recognize MFAs as their academic equals. In the eyes of a Ph.D., nothing in the world can possibly match a Ph.D.

    I do think that there may be some discrimination against MFAs in academic settings. MFAs may be paid less money. A few DFA (doctor of fine arts) programs have started to appear, but I don't see any real need for them, except as pay grade boosters for college faculty. (Are DFAs supposed to show better art works in their gallery shows, or what?) If he DFA degrees end up making it harder for MFAs to get jobs, and make college studio art teaching more the preserve of academic pedants than of practicing artists, the effect will only be damaging.

    Of course, academic settings aren't the primary venue for studio artists. Artists don't exist only to teach. Ph.D.s would be at a disadvanage out in the broader art world off-campus, so it all balances out, I guess.

    Actually, degrees aren't nearly as big a deal to artists as they are to academics. Artists, critics and gallery owners want to know what you've done, not what degrees you hold. Even in commercial art employment, portfolios speak louder than degrees. But a degree is necessary to get a teaching job, which is where an MFA becomes the functional equivalent of a Ph.D.

    There is at least one big exception to what I've written: art history. Art history is an academic subject, not an applied-practice subject as is studio art. In art history, the expected academic degree for university faculty is the Ph.D., not the MFA. In art history, MFA degrees are definitely not the equivalent of Ph.D.s.
     
  3. Dennis Ruhl

    Dennis Ruhl member

    I know a sculptor who quit after his 3rd year because he wasn't learning anything. No BFA.

    He's into large bronzes and can now actually make a living after about 20 years.

    Previously he could care less about a degree but recently he was wondering about teaching but is looking at 3 years full time for an MFA. Times change.
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    If the MFA is a terminal degree, equivalent to the Ph.D., how would one use the letters?

    Roscoe Barnes III, MFA-Ph.D.

    Roscoe Barnes III, MFA/Ph.D.

    Roscoe Barnes III, MFAPhD

    Or, if the MFA is equivalent to the Ph.D., then I would just drop the MFA and use only the Ph.D. ;)
     
  5. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    The M.F.A. is to the Ph.D. (more-or-less) what the M.Div. is to the Ph.D. It isn't exactly a doctorate, but it involves a comparable level of work--most of it applied rather than research-oriented. There is such a thing as a Doctor of Fine Arts (D.F.A.), but I've never seen one in writing (music seems to be the most common D.F.A. major).


    Cheers,
     

  6. Hehehe. Good question. I think it will depend on the audience I try to impress. For the most part, however, I'll just use Ph.D., which can stand on its own :)

    Roscoe

    P.S. C.S. Lewis once spoke of writing as an itch -- something that needs to be scratched. I'm starting to feel that way about DL degrees. Where's Stephen King (the medical guy) when you need him?
     
  7. StevenKing

    StevenKing Active Member

    Right here...buddy...

    Please put on this gown for me... :D

    Steven King
    One of the medical types who lurks on this board...
     
  8. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    I have known quite a few MFA's and some with Ph.D.s in Art (I do not know anyone personally with a D.F.A.). At universities the tendency is to have faculty in production aspects of art (illustration, painting, etc.) with the MFA as the terminal degree. Faculty teaching art history, art theory or research will often have the Ph.D.

    It appears that the MFA vs. Ph.D. does not make a critical difference in promotion (I see MFA's who are full professors while Ph.Ds are assistant or associate professors in the same department. Whether there is a pay differential between the MFA and Ph.D., I do not know. It likely depends upon the school.

    Tony Piña
    CSU San Bernardino
     
  9. Thanks, Tony.

    Very interesting.

    Roscoe
     

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