California allows college aid to illegal immigrants

For some reason I can not get past the fact that we are offering "benefits" to people that are in the country illegally when citizens (natural or naturalized) are struggling. What is your opinion?

California allows college aid to illegal immigrants
SACRAMENTO (Reuters) - California Governor Jerry Brown on Saturday signed a bill giving illegal immigrant college students access to state-funded financial aid, the second half of two-part legislation known as the "Dream Act."

The controversial measure, which passed the Democrat-controlled legislature on a party-line vote in September, represents a victory for immigrant-rights activists ahead of the 2012 presidential election. California is the nation's most populous state.

Only two other states, Texas and New Mexico, allow illegal immigrants to qualify for state financial aid for college, according to the National Conference of State Legislatures.

"Going to college is a dream that promises intellectual excitement and creative thinking," Brown said in a written statement issued by his office.

"The Dream Act benefits us all by giving top students a chance to improve their lives and the lives of all of us," he said.

Brown in July fulfilled a campaign promise by signing into law a companion bill to allow illegal immigrants to receive privately-funded college scholarships. Together the two bills have been dubbed the "California Dream Act."

A federal Dream Act that would have created a pathway to citizenship for illegal immigrants who attend college or serve in the military failed in Senate last year.

Opponents of the California Dream Act have argued that public funds should not be used to help illegal immigrants, especially as California faces deep budget woes that have prompted cuts in education and higher tuitions at the state's public colleges and universities.

"Citizens are having a hard enough time getting the classes they need now," Assemblyman Tim Donnelly, a Hesperia Republican, wrote in a September 9 letter to Brown urging him to veto the legislation.

"(California already offers) students in the country illegally in-state tuition; legally documented students from the next state over can only dream of such a benefit," Donnelly said.

California is one of about a dozen states that allows illegal immigrants to pay in-state tuition, based on attendance and graduation from a state high school.

Under the new law, written by Senator Gil Cedillo, a Los Angeles Democrat, those same illegal immigrants would be eligible for aid from the University of California, California State university system and the state's 112 community colleges.

They could also apply for Cal Grants, which are cash awards based on academic performance.

For the 2007-2008 academic year, the University of California reports that less than three-tenths of one percent of the system's 220,000 students were immigrants who qualified for in-state tuition.

More than 68 percent of those 1,941 students were U.S. citizens or "documented" immigrants, according to the University of California.

At the state universities, the new law would affect 3,633 students, or less than one percent of the 440,000 students enrolled in the current school year.

Of the nearly 2.9 million community college enrollees, 34,057 would be affected

(Writing by Dan Whitcomb; Editing by Greg McCune)

California allows college aid to illegal immigrants - Yahoo! News

 

I still believe in that bit about give me your tired and your poor and your huddled masses yearning to be free (how ever it goes).

 

Why do so many politicians want to reward people who break our laws?

 

Their parents broke the law, not them. Big difference.

 

It is something like that

 

How do other countries handle these situations?

 

I would assume it is so their families or people of the same origin will vote for them to show support for "you scratch my back I will scratch yours"

 

In my country if you got in before you were five years old you can become a citizen any time you want before 18 years old.

If you don't get the citizenship before 18, no problem. My country usually give amnesty to illegal immigrants every decade. The last one was in 2009.

Brazil is also a gigantic country of immigrants (something that most people in the USA don't know, but in the end of the 19th and beginning of 20th century Brazil received millions of German, Italian, Spanish, Ukrainian, Polish, Japanese, etc... immigrants) and almost every Brazilian can trace part of his/hers family origin to someplace else.

It just seems the right thing to do considering our historical roots.

Illegal immigration it's still against the law of course, but it's treated as a minor offense, as it should be.

 

Not my problem. Their law-breaking parents put them into that position, it's not up to me to bail them out.

Have an in-demand skill, apply and be accepted the proper way, and I welcome any immigrant to come to the United States for a better life. But if you break the law and come here illegally, any resulting negative consequences (such as paying for your children) are solely your responsibility and no one else's.

 

I'm not a lawyer but I'm pretty sure American law does not let you be punished by something that your family did, not yourself. There is no reason to punish this kids.

This kids are American in practical terms - most of them don't even remember the place they were born. The USA is their home.

And, by the way, of course it's your problem too - otherwise you wouldn't be talking about it.

Make the parent pay a fine, maybe make them even go back after the kids are in college...but THE PARENTS broke the law. Not the kids.

I really don't get this line of thinking. You'd like to punish people that didn't do anything wrong and are trying hard to be a productive part of American society.

 

Then the reasonable thing would be to send the parents (the law breakers) back to their country of origin and put the children in an orphanage? Just because they do not recall where they were born does not make them US Citizens.

 

No, the right thing would be to give this children the chance to become american citizens. Like my country does and I'm pretty sure some other countries do too.

Geez people, I'm not a crazy socialist dude and I don't believe in free lunch. But, for just a minute, put yourself in the position of this kids.

Did you know a lot of them didn't even know they weren't American citizens until they applied to college?

And, btw, not every illegal immigrant parent committed a crime. Most illegal immigrants in the USA didn't cross the border illegally (this is a crime) but overstayed their visas (this is a civil offense).

Your example of sending them to an orphanage is silly, that's not what were talking about here - we are not talking about little kids, we are talking about kids that ALREADY grew up in the USA. We are talking about 16-21 year old kids whose only home country they know is the USA.

This people won't ever "go back" to their country because there is no place for them to go back.

 

If I were arrested and sent to prison for robbing a bank (purely hypothetical, not going to happen obviously), my children would suffer greatly as the result of my voluntarily breaking the law. I would lose my very well-paying job, which would result in my wife being forced to sell our middle class home and move her and the kids to a much less desireable neighborhood, with the resulting stresses of a new school, finding new friends, etc.

This is no different. Their parents chose to break the law, and as I said, any negative consequences that result from that voluntary illegal act is totally the responsibility of the parents, not the American taxpayer.

No, they're not. If they want someone to blame, then blame it on their parents who voluntarily engaged in criminal behavior.

When I said it's not my problem, I was referring to the children "suffering" from being denied public aid for education because their parents came here illegally. That isn't my problem....as I said, have the kids take it up with their parents.

See above; whenever parents break the law, ANY law, there is the very real possibility that their children are going to suffer because of it.

Don't want your children to suffer because of your illegal acts?

THEN DON'T BREAK THE LAW!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's a concept so simple, a child could understand it.

Why should we reward the result of criminal behavior?

Becoming an American citizen is one of the greatest honors that can be bestowed on someone. It shouldn't be granted because someone decided to BREAK OUR LAWS.

 

Jeez Bruce...coming into this country is a misdemeanor for first time offenders, nothing at all like robbing a bank. Look I'm with on you the "do the crime do the time" mindset, one of the sore points I had in working as a LEO was how every political animal in the system from high ranking police brass to district attorneys to politicians handled it. Just before I gave it up we lost yet another police officer in Dallas who was killed by an illegal who had multiple arrests on record for violent crimes. Being from Fort Worth, Texas I can tell you we "import" as many criminals as we "home grow" with gangs, drugs, violent crime offenders and oddly enough a new spate of forcible rapists even. So I feel your frustration and completely understand how giving a pass to someone gaming the system just seems so wrong and how in state tuition seems so much like pandering (and in most cases it is). I also understand how this might be perceived as incentivizing illegal behavior, but honestly I think availability of jobs and medical care already do that, I don’t think discounted higher education really plays much of a factor.

From a humanitarian perspective we have kids who have gone through the public school ranks, grown up their entire lives (just about) in the United States, speak English, are productive and qualify for college and (from a financial perspective) who have parents who contributed through their own taxes (sales, property or otherwise) why not allow them to have the in state tuition their parents paid for, even if their parents were here illegally? What is the alternative? Deny them the opportunity? Make them apply for student visas? Maybe just round them up and bus them home after a 6 month stint in the pen?

What we have created or have “inherited” from our broken government’s failed system is a potential humanitarian disaster…or we have an opportunity. If we correct our immigration system so much better, but in the meantime the individual states are left holding the bag as to how best deal with the rampant illegal immigration taking place in this country. Apparently states cannot enforce this particular federal law (which doesn’t make a dang bit of sense), cannot have their “own” border patrol and immigration officers so they are left with one of two choices…either take a hard line on illegal immigration and create a self perpetuating second class citizen (which as history teaches us is fertile ground for a “criminal class”) or we could try and put the mechanisms in place to assimilate them and turn them into productive and contributing members of our society. I think the least destructive path is the latter even if the whole reasoning behind it is pandering.

 

How much money do illegal immigrants put into our system? Either through taxes, payroll taxes or real estate purchases? I don't think I'm opposed to giving kids in state tuition. Just wondering how much illegal immigrants actually contribute. Are they upset that they pay so much in taxes and they will not receieve any money back in the form of SS?

I worked for CIS back in 2004. I personally assisted in the running of the naturalization ceremonies in Spokane, WA. We did them every other week and they were packed. The pride, excitement and joy that most of these people showed when they were pronounced citizens of the US was amazing.

What a shame that 12 million people in this country value true immigration so little that they spit on the sacrifices that their fellow countrymen bore so deeply. Real immigrants follow the rules of the house they are living in and deserve to be here as much as you and I.

It's always about the children isn't it?

 

Cory, I do not disagree with your sentiment, cheating the system is in fact showing that those who follow the rules in good faith are essentially dopes for doing so. Our system is so broken it is a disgrace, that said it is a matter of the lesser of two evils (hint, you still end up with evil). I fully believe that fines for those who are found to be illegal is fully justified, the problem is that is a federal matter and they won't do anything about it. Tuition is a state matter. Now here's something to really debate, should illegals be allowed financial aid access?

As for paying taxes, I know in Texas it is done through property taxes...there's no avoiding it even if you rent, you pay. I suppose you could reside out of state and attend school in Texas but then you wouldn't get the discount