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  1. #1
    NorCal is offline Registered User
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    Buddy of mine is getting strunge along by a for-profit

    So my buddy attends a major for-profit, I won't name by name, and he was just informed he has 75 units remaining before he can graduate with a B.A. in Business Administration .

    His issue is that 18 months ago, he was told he had 75 units remaining and he has been taking 12 units a semester since his original assessment and he is frustrated. (Rightfully so IMO)

    My buddy sat down with the Dean of the college and pleaded his case, and he was told the undergraduate program in Business Administration requires 220 units in order to graduate. He told me he was originally told the program was around 120 units when he first started.

    Seems kind of strange, and now he is looking to transfer to a state university near his home, and he is extremely ticked off.
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  2. #2
    Randell1234 is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorCal View Post
    So my buddy attends a major for-profit, I won't name by name, and he was just informed he has 75 units remaining before he can graduate with a B.A. in Business Administration .

    His issue is that 18 months ago, he was told he had 75 units remaining and he has been taking 12 units a semester since his original assessment and he is frustrated. (Rightfully so IMO)

    My buddy sat down with the Dean of the college and pleaded his case, and he was told the undergraduate program in Business Administration requires 220 units in order to graduate. He told me he was originally told the program was around 120 units when he first started.

    Seems kind of strange, and now he is looking to transfer to a state university near his home, and he is extremely ticked off.
    Are they taking about quarter credits? 220 just seems off the chart. Does he has the original assessment in writing?

  3. #3
    truckie270 is offline Registered User
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    That does seem strange. I don't know your friend, but I have seen numerous students in programs where I have worked in the same situation. A common denominator I have seen (and I am not saying this is your friend's issue) is that these students do not spend a whole lot of time planning out their degrees and understanding exactly what is required of them.

    I cannot think of a time during any one of the numerous programs that I have been enrolled in where I did not know exactly how many credits I had transferred in and exactly how many credits/courses I had to go to complete the degree. While I feel bad for your friend, this is also a lesson that he/she probably had to learn the hard way.

    One of the things I believe that contributes to this is the fact that many for-profits are cost-prohibitive without the use of financial aid. Once the financial aid block is checked it becomes relatively easy for the student to go on autopilot when they have someone making sure the checks are coming into the school and ensuring that the student is registered for the next term.

    One thing that would eliminate many of these issues (although it would be fought by the FP schools) would be the restructuring of financial aid into a reimbursement program. If students had to physically pay for courses at the start of their first term and then pass those courses in order to get their money back you can be sure that many of these cost-prohibitive undergrad. programs would either adjust their rates or succumb to the market. These students would be more likely to be sure the courses they are paying for apply to their degree programs and would become advocates in their own education .
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  4. #4
    Ian Anderson is offline Registered User
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    Did he take a bunch of courses that cannot be applied to the business degree program?
    I've heard of this happening at state schools.

    I suggest your buddy look at one of the big-3 schools.

  5. #5
    b4cz28 is offline Registered User
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    You need to post the school so we see what the school says in their cat.
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  6. #6
    NorCal is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randell1234 View Post
    Are they taking about quarter credits? 220 just seems off the chart. Does he has the original assessment in writing?
    That is a great question that I neglected to ask him. He is active duty military and attending college in Ohio. I went to the website for his college and this is what is posted on their website:

    Degree: Bachelor of Science in Business Administration (In Ohio, degree is Bachelor of Business Administration ; in New York, degree is Bachelor of Professional Studies in Business Administration .)

    Graduation Requirements: 8 full-time semesters, 124 credit hours.
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  7. #7
    Maniac Craniac is offline Moderator
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    220 credits? That' translates to over 7 years of full time work for a bachelor's degree. Absolute insanity.
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  9. #8
    truckie270 is offline Registered User
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    I could see there being a large number of credits needed by someone who had been out of school for a while. For example - at my local state univ. there is a four course sequence in Math at 5 credits each (quarter hour) that serve as prerequisites to take the Intro. to Algebra course that is a general ed. requirement but does not count towards graduation credits. So theoretically, a student who placed very poorly on the Math entrance exam. could have to take 25 quarter credits of Math that do not count towards graduation in order to meet the prerequisites to take the next 10 credits in Math which do count. The same is true in English.

    The 96 credits your friend is shy between what is listed and what he was told sounds suspect, especially from a large FP targeting military students.

    I know a similar thing had happened at a very large FP with their own football stadium and was the subject of a law suit. Enrollment "counselors" (salespeople) would inform students that transfer class X met the prequisites or would be transfered in to fulfill class Y. Truth was, these salespeople had no authority or knowledge to make those claims and when the formal academic evalaution took place these courses were determined to not meet the requirements for whatever reason. The "counselors" conveniently forgot to tell said students about this denial of acceptance until the students applied for graduation and were informed that they needed numerous additional classes (usually general education courses).

    I know this for a fact because I witnessed it happen to almost an entire class. I taught an intro. to polisci course at the school and 80% of the class were taking the class and downright pissed because they had thought they were done. Several of them had an additional year of courses added to their plans when they had thought they had met all the requirements to graduate. I was looked at like I had a palm tree growing out of my forehead when I asked several of them in class why they tolerated that and did not transfer to another, cheaper school. Another year of classes to meet general ed. requirements at $2000 per class or another year at a state school to meet the residency requirement at $2000 semester seemed like a no brainer to me. Since most of them were on financial aid, the cost of the additional year never occured to them hence my post above.
    Last edited by truckie270; 02-12-2011 at 02:44 PM.
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  10. #9
    NorCal is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by truckie270 View Post
    For example - at my local state univ. there is a four course sequence in Math at 5 credits each (quarter hour) that serve as prerequisites to take the Intro. to Algebra course that is a general ed. requirement but does not count towards graduation credits.
    My junior college had these sames prerequisites, I was forced to complete 3 semesters of math before getting to the Algebra course I needed.

    Quote Originally Posted by truckie270 View Post
    The 96 credits your friend is shy between what is listed and what he was told sounds suspect, especially from a large FP targeting military students.
    My buddy said he had some type issue where they had him enrolled in two courses it turned out he didn't need to graduate. The mistake was caught only after he completed the course, and the check was cashed so to speak . . .
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  11. #10
    Bruce is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by Randell1234 View Post
    Are they taking about quarter credits? 220 just seems off the chart. Does he has the original assessment in writing?
    Even 220 quarter credits seems excessive....when I attended Northeastern University (see "Washout" thread) they had the quarter-credit system, and I believe it was something like 160 or so to graduate.
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  12. #11
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorCal View Post
    So my buddy attends a major for-profit, I won't name by name, and he was just informed he has 75 units remaining before he can graduate with a B.A. in Business Administration .

    His issue is that 18 months ago, he was told he had 75 units remaining and he has been taking 12 units a semester since his original assessment and he is frustrated. (Rightfully so IMO)

    My buddy sat down with the Dean of the college and pleaded his case, and he was told the undergraduate program in Business Administration requires 220 units in order to graduate. He told me he was originally told the program was around 120 units when he first started.

    Seems kind of strange, and now he is looking to transfer to a state university near his home, and he is extremely ticked off.

    Tell him to walk away and enroll in one of the big three . Who needs that shite?

    Abner
    XVI.8: Confucius said, "There are three things of which the superior man stand in awe. He stands in awe of the ordinances of Heaven. He stands in awe of great men. He stands in awe of the words of the sages. The mean man does not know the ordinances of Heaven, and consequently does not stand in awe of them. He is disrespectful to great men. He makes sport of the words of the sages."

  13. #12
    me again is online now Registered User
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    My Bachelors degree required 120 credits (semester system) to graduate, but I ended up with 220 credits because I had too many credits that wouldn't fit into the degree program.

    In reference to your buddy, normally a college or university will provide a student with paperwork that outlines exactly what kinds of credits need to be taken to obtain a degree. It's called a "degree plan" and the student must stick to it. Ask your buddy to look at the degree plan that was issued to him.

  14. #13
    ChiSquare is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by NorCal View Post
    Degree: Bachelor of Science in Business Administration (In Ohio, degree is Bachelor of Business Administration; in New York, degree is Bachelor of Professional Studies in Business Administration.)
    It is easy to find the name of the school by searching this text on Google

  15. #14
    Abner is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by me again View Post
    My Bachelors degree required 120 credits (semester system) to graduate, but I ended up with 220 credits because I had too many credits that wouldn't fit into the degree program.

    In reference to your buddy, normally a college or university will provide a student with paperwork that outlines exactly what kinds of credits need to be taken to obtain a degree. It's called a "degree plan" and the student must stick to it. Ask your buddy to look at the degree plan that was issued to him.
    That's true. People that are new to a cc or university so often forget to obtain a "degree plan". I tell new college students to make an appointment with their school counselor and he/she will make a degree plan based on what kind of degree they want to pursue. I was given a kind of check off list with all the classes required providing me with a roadmap. Others tried to figure things out themselves and messed things up by either taking the wrong classes, or taking way to many classes.

    Abner
    XVI.8: Confucius said, "There are three things of which the superior man stand in awe. He stands in awe of the ordinances of Heaven. He stands in awe of great men. He stands in awe of the words of the sages. The mean man does not know the ordinances of Heaven, and consequently does not stand in awe of them. He is disrespectful to great men. He makes sport of the words of the sages."

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  17. #15
    airtorn is offline Moderator
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChiSquare View Post
    It is easy to find the name of the school by searching this text on Google
    I'll take the Devry Educational Development Corporation for $500, Alex.

  18. #16
    NorCal is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by airtorn View Post
    I'll take the Devry Educational Development Corporation for $500, Alex.
    Winner, winner, chicken dinner, lol.

    I knew we had some resourceful mofo's here on this site !! Take into account that he is using the GI Bill, so I know for a fact he had an educational plan as that is required by the VA to get paid. I don't know what else to say to him, I told him jumping ship and transferring to Ohio University would be more adventitious then remaining at Devry and getting strung along. . .
    Last edited by NorCal; 02-13-2011 at 11:52 AM.
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