US, RA Degree worthless in the UK. BOOM!

For those of you who think that RA degrees are "not all that".
You will be interested to see this.


Professor must take GCSE to teach in his school
By Liz Lightfoot, Education Correspondent (Daily Telegraph UK)
(Filed: 12/10/2004)


A former professor of physics who has contributed experiments to the international space programme has been told he is not suitably qualified to teach the subject in a state school.

David Wolfe, who ran the physics department of a large American University, must go back to school to take a maths GCSE or leave the school where he has taught for three years.

David Wolfe with pupils at the Royal Grammar School
Sixth-formers at the Royal Grammar School, High Wycombe, Bucks, voted Mr Wolfe the most inspirational teacher last year and his subject is so popular that nearly a third of the 450-strong sixth form are studying it at A-level.

But the American professor who has retired to England has been told that his qualification - a PhD in physics from the University of Pennsylvania, one of the eight Ivy League schools - is not sufficient.

Mr Wolfe does not want to take exams and submit himself to assessment at the age of 65 and says he teaches because he loves the job and wants to give something back to society.

He is making a stand against the red tape and inflexible rules which also prevent the headmaster of Westminster, one of the leading independent schools, from teaching maths in the state system on his retirement from a distinguished career in education.

Tristam Jones-Parry, 57, has complained that he will either have to retrain or work as an unqualified teacher at a reduced salary before he can "give a bit back in a state school".

Boys at the Royal Grammar School have drawn up a petition which was sent to David Miliband, the school standards minister, complaining at the way Mr Wolfe was being treated.

Tim Dingle, the headmaster, says that if the rules are not changed he will be prepared to break them by continuing to employ Mr Wolfe.

"David Wolfe is the most inspirational and highly qualified teacher of physics I have ever seen," said Mr Dingle, who has taught in both independent and state schools.

"The country is desperately short of physics teachers and schools can't get them despite all the incentives handed out by the Government.

"I am incensed by the inflexibility of the rules and by the fact that David Miliband has refused to even consider making an exception for this extremely talented physicist and teacher.

"He was the head of the physics department of the University of New Mexico containing 80 physicists, including Nobel prize winners. He is an expert on nuclear and particle physics and has been involved in space research. But the General Teaching Council wants him to take a maths GCSE."

A report by the Institute of Physics this year said two thirds of secondary school physics teachers taking GCSE classes did not have a related degree and 29 per cent did not even have an A-level in the subject. Mr Wolfe says he is determined to have his qualifications recognised.

"It is quite ludicrous to expect me to take an exam for 16-year-olds. I love teaching and I don't want to give it up but it would be humiliating to have to submit myself to assessors much younger and less experienced."

Mr Wolfe came to England because he "loves the country". He is fluent in Russian and Swedish and teaches both in his spare time at the school.

Parents of pupils at the school have contacted Paul Goodman, the Conservative MP for Wycombe, who has urged Mr Miliband to make the teacher a special case or revise the rules.

Tim Collins, the shadow education spokesman, wants Charles Clarke, the Education Secretary, to order an urgent review of the requirements. "Red tape and inflexible restrictions must not be allowed to discourage men and women of talent and experience," he said.

The Teacher Training Agency said Mr Wolfe could use the fast-track route to qualified teacher status, which requires the submission of a portfolio of evidence. Assessors from a teacher-training college would then watch him teach. "GCSE maths is required but there is an equivalence test which he could use to prove that his US qualifications reach the same standard," a spokesman said.

BOOM!

 

And I thought the teaching bureaucracy was bad in this country.

What a bunch of horse shit.....

 

I agree

Just an example of the thin edge of a very stinky wedge of cheese that you americans can look forward to.

Of course, the obvious answer is. "I wouldn´t want to work in the UK"

Well we think the same about Oregon, we couldn't care less what the ODA or the USA think of our degrees.

Result!

 

The U.K. Department for Education and Skills has admitted that it provided incomplete information, and it has sent a personal apology to David Wolfe. There's a "fast track" teacher training scheme that allows people such as Wolfe to get approval to teach without taking the GCSE exam.

Yawn.

 

True.

That wasn't the point.

The point was that his RA degree wasn't taken on "face value".

Anybody with a degree is entitled to the "Fast Track" system.

Assessors from a teacher-training college would then watch him teach. "GCSE maths is required but there is an equivalence test which he could use to prove that his US qualifications reach the same standard".

I wonder if they will charge him, like the ludicrous ODA in Oregon do?

 

Mr. Wilkinson:
"Well we think the same about Oregon...."

Would that be the royal 'we' then, or have you been chosen to speak for 60 million countrymen (and women)?

Of less relevance, are you the "hypogonadism" Fred Wilkinson
(http://www.biospace.com/ccis/news_story.cfm?StoryID=15366920&full=1v)
or the anti-gun-control Fred Wilkinson
(http://www.hbsa.fsnet.co.uk/controls_on_firearms.htm),
or possibly both?

 

You are correct: Very few Americans would want to stay in Great Britain, albeit a visit would be very nice. You must remember that our forefathers got on boats and fled from that crappy little island and their antiquated fuedal class system.

Let's face it: Great Britain isn't even big enough to be an American state, nor is it a global power anymore. The sun set on the British empire two centuries ago.

I once had an interrorgation instructor who gave a class to a bunch of class-oriented Brits and they repeatedly asked him (with their noses in the air) what university he graduated from. Their insinuation was that his American university was clearly not up to par to their snobish British system.

Yes, our forefathers got on a boat and fled from that crappy little island. And look what we Americans have made of ourselves, ever since we revolted from our British government to create our own American government!!! We even had to go back to that crappy little island to resecue the British from the Germans in WWII. If it weren't for the Americans, the British would be speaking German today.

In conclusion, the little snots in Britain have no legitimate reason to be snobish, other than being conceited without a cause. They should at least wipe their noses first.

 

And your problem is?

If Dr. Wolfe had done the same in California, he would have had the same results. A PhD in Physics is not sufficient qualification to teach math to elementray school children. He would need teaching credentials, and recent coursework in the subject area.

Even if he wanted to teach high school physics, he would need the teaching credentia and recent coursework in physics.

 

I am neither. Why on earth would anybody want to google my name? Of equal pointless relevance, which Dr John Bear are you?

http://www.hlsamp.uh.edu/investigators.htm

or

http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?q=%2B%22Dr+John+Bear%22&hl=en&btnG=Google+Search

or possibly both?

 

The new "Empire"

Snobbish? What is Oregon then?

LOL

As for empires. Ours lasted hundreds of years. Your new empire is crumbling after only a year.

But hey, crack on. You have my full support.

 

It doesn't take a troll long to show his colors.

 

If you would look around a bit you would find that googling people is usually a good indication of who they are. Not always but sometimes.

The first google you did on Dr. Bear was not the right Dr. Bear. The other Google you showed is nothing but a bunch of links to AED on usenet. Where anything and everthing is said and its not usually correct.

 

Yes, and the same in Australia, and I would think in any reasonably organised eucation system.

Here teaching is regulated and to teach at Primary and Secondary require separate qualifications - usually a 4 year Bachelor of Education in a specific stream, and these are not interchangeable. Any who teach vocational education and training programs [VET] need a Certificate at AQF 4 level, and also any who teach in the Technical & Further Education [TAFE] area ... similar to US Colleges ... in most cases need an AQF5 teaching qualification.

However there is currently no teaching qualification requirement in Higher Education - yet.

Of course assessment of competency can include assessment of evidence, and therefore formal teacher training may not be necessary in all areas.

The competency of the 'content' is rarely the issue - the competency in teaching is usually the issue.

 

Re: The new "Empire"

Yes, our forefathers got on a boat and fled from the British Isles.

• Quote:
  Posted by Fred Wilkinson
  We never tried to stop you fleeing.

Would that explain why the British sent troops on boats to North America, to forcibly control the Americans? LOL

Our forefathers not only got on a boat to flee from Great Britain (and were chased by armed troops on British boats), but we also revolted against our British government. The British then called the Americans traitors. However, the revolt against the British government was successful and we made the British get back on their little boats and sent them back to their little island -- and there they stayed, even unto this very day. And we successfully created our own American government. Isn't Independance day grand?

• Quote:
  Posted by Fred Wilkinson
  Your new empire is crumbling after only a year.

What is your evidence that the United States is "crumbling"?

BTW, as a whole, I like the British people and view them as distant cousans, so to speak.

 

New Mexico would also demand a secondary teaching license and a PhD in any subject (except maybe education) by itself wouldn't be enough.

 

Re: Re: The new "Empire"

Originally posted by me again [/i]
Yes, our forefathers got on a boat and fled from the British Isles.

• Quote:
  Posted by Fred Wilkinson
  We never tried to stop you fleeing.

Would that explain why the British sent troops on boats to North America, to forcibly control the Americans? LOL

True, afterwards. We went to North America to pillage. We even burned down the first White House (it was made of wood) like the Pentagon ;-)

Our forefathers not only got on a boat to flee from Great Britain (and were chased by armed troops on British boats), but we also revolted against our British government. The British then called the Americans traitors. However, the revolt against the British government was successful and we made the British get back on their little boats and sent them back to their little island -- and there they stayed, even unto this very day. And we successfully created our own American government. Isn't Independance day grand?

FYI The British don't call it a war, it was a colonial skirmish. You never beat the British Army, you beat a colonial force. (That is what you have in Iraq presently).

The British ARMY had bigger fish to fry anyway, India, Africa for instance. (As usual) You seem to have forgot the help you had from your ALLIES at the time, the Germans and French.

Your new empire is crumbling after only a year. [/list]What is your evidence that the United States is "crumbling"?

Suggest you ask the people on the front line in Iraq about that.

BTW, as a whole, I like the British people and view them as distant cousans, so to speak.

I like the Americans (particularly Southerners), just don't like your Government. When George W Bush dons a uniform and heads for Fallujah, I will agree, you have the best nation on earth.

 

Cunning Brits have fried fish all over the world.

 

----------------------------------------------------------------------
I once had an interrorgation instructor who gave a class to a bunch of class-oriented Brits and they repeatedly asked him (with their noses in the air) what university he graduated from. Their insinuation was that his American university was clearly not up to par to their snobish British system.
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Be careful with sweeping generalisations. We have probably all met idiots from other countries. Yours is no exception.

 

• Quote:Posted by Morten
  Be careful with sweeping generalisations. We have probably all met idiots from other countries. Yours is no exception.

That is simply not true because we don't have any idiots in the United States. LOL

That is a joke folks!!!

 

Don't Laugh

This would happen in most states in this country as well. A doctorate in math is not sufficient to teach in an elementary school unless you alos have classes such as early childhood education...