Alan Keyes vs. Barack Obama?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by BLD, Aug 5, 2004.

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  1. BLD

    BLD New Member

    Here's the Story

    While I really like Alan Keyes, I don't like the idea of moving from your state of residence to run in another state. I was against it with Hillary, and I'd have to be against it with Keyes to be consistent.
     
  2. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    It doesn't matter; he'll lose. Obama has this locked up.

    Of course, it is just a coincidence that the only two people the Republicans could find to run against him are black. I'd believe that if either were even a bit credible. But a mid-level government appointee and an out-of-state Keyes, who's known for being a bit, uh, odd? That's it? That's the sum of what the party has to offer in a state as large and populous as Illinois?

    Obama's speech at the DNC might as well have been his acceptance speech to the U.S. Senate. He's a lock.
     
  3. BLD

    BLD New Member

    The sad thing is (and I'm saying this as a fairly partisan Republican) I think was the same seat they were trying to get Mike Ditka to run for. What is going on in Illinois?

    BLD
     
  4. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

    Carpetbaggers from any party disgust me. It was wrong when Hillary did it, and it's wrong for Dr. Keyes (who I respect very much otherwise) to do it.

    Unfortunately, the people of NY fell for it.
     
  5. GUNSMOKE

    GUNSMOKE New Member

    Illini Republicans

    failed in a gross way for not adequately vetting Mr. Ryan. In Party politics, there is a process called "Candidate Development."

    Neither the Democrats nor Republicans do it very well. They are victims of their own successes and collective egos.

    We can all lament how personal politics has become, but it is now a fact of life, and part of the ante. If you want to play, you just GOT to pay. If there is nothing embarassing in your past don't worry about it, SOMEONE will make SOMETHING up.

    Is this a good thing? After all, politics is increasingly a game of the survival of the most ruthless, uh, I mean fittest And don't we want the fittest taking care of our business?

    At the same time, this same reality makes the quality of a candidate's character all that more important.

    Dr. Keyes is going to take one for the team, that is admirable, because it is an act of loyalty.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 5, 2004
  6. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    Bright guy, stupid move, hapless state party.
    And, yeah, "duh, we couldn' get Ditka so we got you."
    The idiot brigade is out in farce.
     
  7. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    Even if Keyes were from Illinois instead of Maryland, and started early in the campaign instead of less than three months before the election, and didn't face a situation where Obama had already energized his base and established rapport with independent voters, I suspect he'd still be too far to the right for Illinois. Now, Mississippi he might have a good shot at.

    I was annoyed when Keyes was excluded from the Republican debates in '96. I don't think he would have been able to appeal to independent voters well enough to take the presidential election, but he was the top bona fide conservative in the race--and he's a pretty good speaker, to boot.


    Cheers,
     
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    As one who lived in Illinois for a number of years and still has ties to the state via in-laws, I can say the Illinois Republican Party is in a bit of disarray but is healthy.

    The Party suffered from the scandals of the Ryan administration and will need some time to recover. Many good leaders in the state, Jim Thompson, Jim Edgar, Judy Topinka, Corrinne Wood, et. al., turned down the opportunity to run against Obama.

    Scandals abound in Illinois and always have. The current Senator, Peter Fitzgerald (R) defeated incumbent Carol Braun (D) because of a scandal. The Democrats rebound and so will the GOP.

    I predict Obama, if he wins, will be a one-term Senator.
     
  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    And Obama might be too liberal for downstate.
     
  10. maranto

    maranto New Member

    Dr. Keys has a sharp mind and some great ideas (I voted for him in his last Maryland Senate race), but I too thoroughly detest the carpetbagger aspect of this situation. It is a disservice to the citizens that he would seek to serve. In fairness to the good Doctor, he hasn’t accepted yet. Hopefully, he’ll realize that this is a loose-loose situation and politely decline the offer. I personally don’t think that he has any hope of mounting an effective campaign in 3 months in a State that he is unfamiliar with.

    Cheers,
    Tony Maranto
     
  11. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    Well, yeah, but you also predict Bush will get 54% of the popular vote...

    I have very high hopes for Obama. If you didn't hear his keynote, you should; it was the best speech of this year's Democratic convention.


    Cheers,
     
  12. BLD

    BLD New Member

    Which certainly isn't saying much! I mean, Mrs. Heinz-Kerry was absolutely horrendous. As was the rest of the bunch. I'm really not saying this through partisan eyes -- I thought the whole thing was horrible, as did most voters seeing that there was no bounce in the polls.

    BLD
     
  13. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    This is going to sound funny, but I really don't mind carpetbaggers; my feeling is that if the voters are comfortable voting in somebody from out of state, that's their decision. We've got a borderline carpetbagger for governor--former RNC chair Haley Barbour, a Mississippi native who had nevertheless spent most of his political career in Washington--and, though I didn't vote for him (he's pretty far right, albeit well to the left of Fordice), that aspect of the situation didn't bother me a bit.


    Cheers,
     
  14. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    CBS News and Newsweek would disagree with you on the no-bounce issue, but CNN and some other sources would not. I would say the low bounce has more to do with the fact that nearly all voters had already committed to a candidate by then than anything else. As I said in a previous thread, I think Kerry's numbers are about as high as they're probably going to get; his main objective right now should be to turn anti-Bush votes into pro-Kerry votes so that Bush can't take back the undecideds. If Kerry can just sustain his lead until November 2nd, he will almost certainly be our next president.

    I thought Clinton's speech was astonishingly good (a close second to Obama), and Kerry's was as good as it had to be. I was mildly disappointed with Edwards', and I thought Heinz-Kerry's was well-written but the delivery was extremely stiff (though she is a delight to hear when she's not reading off a teleprompter--next time that Larry King Live interview with the Kerrys repeats, you should watch it). I'd say the Dean, Carter, Lieberman, and Kennedy speeches fell into the same category. Sharpton's, though, was anything but; he could read a grocery list and make it exciting. I didn't see Gore's, but I hear it was pretty clever (a nice departure from his red-faced angry liberal persona of late). I'd rate this year's convention as much better than 2000's, but not quite as good as 1992's.


    Cheers,
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 5, 2004
  15. BLD

    BLD New Member

    The fact that Sharpton was allowed to speak at all doesn't say much good about the Democrats (and no, not because he is black, but because he is eminently unqualififed).
     
  16. Tom Head

    Tom Head New Member

    You're certainly welcome to your opinion. I liked the man's delivery. Also enjoyed his participation in the debates, his guest stint on SNL, etc. I don't agree with his more extreme views, but I think he adds something, in much the same way that Pat Buchanan added something to the Republican Party.

    It must be kind of depressing to be so devoted to one party or the other that you can't even enjoy a good speech. I always enjoy listening to Pat Buchanan, even when he makes my blood boil, and Rush Limbaugh has always been an occasional guilty pleasure for me. I'm looking forward to watching Schwarzenegger and McCain at this year's RNC, even though I already know I won't be voting for Bush.


    Cheers,
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 5, 2004
  17. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    Actually, Sharpton and Buchanan add the same something: anti-Semitism.
     
  18. Guest

    Guest Guest

    And I stand by both predictions. I predicted Carter, Bush 41, and Moseley-Braun would all be first termers, and they were.

    Actually I did hear Obama's speech and thought it was quite good as were Kerry's and Edward's. The best speech I have ever heard at a Democratic convention was by Mario Cuomo with Jesse Jackson coming ina close second.
     
  19. BLD

    BLD New Member

    Tom,
    I can enjoy a good speech, even from a liberal, I just didn't hear any during the DNC.

    As far as Sharpton goes...the man is a blatant racist. He is a mockery of everything the civil rights movement accomplished.

    BLD
     
  20. DCross

    DCross New Member


    Actually, people love him here. We have a couple of towns here in the St. Louis Metro East (Illinois) that are VERY Democratish. This is where Congressman Jerry Costello is from. East St. Louis Loves Obama, but they always go for the black democrat over all others. Dr. Keyes has a legit shot if pundits make a big deal of the debates and decide to give them airtime. He will give Obama a run for his money in the debates. Regarding how liberal is....he doesn't talk very liberal. This one America thing is not in tune with the liberal playbook. It also challenges civil rights people.



    Darren
     

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