Why Terrorists Hate You! Sayid Qtub says...

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Orson, Jul 5, 2004.

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  1. Orson

    Orson New Member

    The intellectual Godfather of today's Islamism, Sayyid Qtub, has fascinated me like Hitler. All the more so since he earned his masters in education in the cowtown of Greeley (where the annaul "Greeley Stampede" rodeo is just now winding down), in the early 1950s at the same time my father was doing his masters (in drama) about 70 miles away in Denver.

    How could this Arab intellectual have such sullen views rejecting the US in what is remembered today as a time of innocence? That's the compelling mystery.

    (The media's lack of curiostiy in tracing his life ranks up there with their stupid hyping of crop-circles.)

    Here's Dinesh D'souza's view ( andor another, see Paul Berman's book last year):

    "How in Qutb’s view did America reach its sorry state? One problem, Qutb said, is that American and indeed ***Western institutions are fundamentally atheist, based on a clear rejection of divine authority.***

    "Democracy and capitalism are in Qutb’s view atheistic ideas. When democrats say that sovereignty flows from the people, this means that the people, not God, are the rulers. ***So democracy is a form of idol worship.*** So, too, Qutb insisted that capitalism, which is based on the notion that the market and not God is the best arbitrator of value, is a form of idolatry.

    A second problem, Qutb wrote, is that the core principle of America is liberty — the right to determine one’s own destiny. This, he argued, is a highly defective principle because liberty can be used well or liberty can be used badly.

    Given what Immanuel Kant called “the warped timber of humanity,” given the human propensity for selfishness and vice, Qutb argued that freedom will often be used badly.

    For evidence of this, he said, just look at what goes on in America. ***Qutb pointed to divorce, family breakdown, homosexuality, promiscuity and the triviality and vulgarity of American popular culture [in the early 1950s!?!?!] as proof that human beings cannot be expected to use freedom except to gratify their basest impulses.*** Indeed, Qutb sternly charged that America is materially prosperous but morally rotten.

    Qutb’s alternative to America and the West is Islam, which in his book 'Social Justice in Islam' he terms 'an unparalleled revolution in human thinking' that provides the only solution to 'this unhappy, perplexed and weary world.'

    "Islam, Qutb emphasized, is not merely a moral code or set of beliefs. It is a way of life based upon the divine government of the universe. The very term 'Islam' means 'submission' to the authority of Allah. ***This worldview requires that religious, economic, political and civil society be based on the Koran, the teachings of the Prophet Muhammad and the Shariah or Islamic law.***

    "Qutb admits that notions of submission and obedience may sound alien to Western ears. In his view, this is because Western society is based on freedom, whereas Islamic society is based on virtue."
    http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/07/04/INGOT7CJF11.DTL
     
  2. Orson

    Orson New Member

    Fundamentally, the War on Jihadism is about essential, defining differences within our respective civilizations. This means there is an incompatibility that cannot be negotiated away.

    What is it?

    "In the Western view, freedom is the necessary precondition for virtue. Without freedom, there is no virtue."

    In the Christian (and Kantian) catechism, without choice between good and evil, there can be no good on earth - otherwise, they are just a slave. And through time, the West came to reject all slavery, not just certain forms. Of course, today on planet earth, only some Muslims practice slavery. But no other religion save communism practices their example.

    HOW CAN SO FEW LEFTISTS NOTICE THIS?!?!?

    --Orson
     
  3. leo

    leo Member

    What year was that? I seemed to have missed it. Slavery has many forms as any student of history and economics knows.
     
  4. Mr. Engineer

    Mr. Engineer member

    Orson

    Isn't this a distance learning discussion forum? I know that it is interesting to banter back and forth between the liberals, conservatives, and middle of the roaders, but do you think that every post should have the same theme?

    Just and observation.
     
  5. atraxler

    atraxler New Member

    This is the off-topic section. You can post about whatever you want, as long as it conforms to the TOS... I believe.
     
  6. jerryj

    jerryj Guest

    Qutb's view of the West vis-a-vis Islam

    The idea that "virtue" and "freedom" are somehow incompatible is a tremendous logical fallacy. The problem for Qutb is that there are many branches of Islam with many different interpretations of what the meaning of the statements in the Qur'an mean, and what their relative significances are. Unfortunately, Islam has never experienced an equivalent of a 30 Years War as the West experienced at the end of the 17th century. Some observers say that it may be happening now, because what is happening in the Islamic countries may end in a breakout that demonstrates how freedom and virtue are actually two sides of the same coin.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 14, 2018

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