Janko, Gus, and Mark Win!

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Guest, Apr 10, 2004.

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  1. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Janko, Gus, Mark: You win! I will no longer post on here. To insure this I am now requesting the moderators disable my account.

    When I came back on here I wanted to be able to contribute, especially to the theological and political discussions. I enjoyed them and learned from them. I really wanted to participate in these and that’s one of the reasons I asked to come back on. But, I am, quite frankly, tired of being hounded.

    I conducted myself in a civilized manner, as promised, until Janko and Gus continued to hound me, insult me, and belittle me. Gus has not been so bad. Janko has been absolutely vicious.

    After being warned by Chip and Bruce several month’s ago, I returned to civility. However, Janko continued his attacks and they increased. I placed him on the Ignore List. I placed Gus there too, although he has not been so bad as Janko.

    Now, Mark has joined in on not letting my past, for which I have put behind me and for which I have apologized, remain in the past. The duo has become a trio. Will a quartet, quintet, etc., follow?

    But this forum is primarily to help those seeking educational opportunities and all the focus on me detracts from that. It puts this forum in a bad light and I don’t want that. Degree Info is a good source of information and has helped hundreds, perhaps thousands.

    I have been, to be honest, disappointed the moderators have not called Janko on his posts to and about me. If they have privately, I retract my statement. I was called on my responses in kind to Janko both privately and publicly.

    I wish everyone on here happiness and blessings. To those who have treated me with kindness and respect, “Thank you.”

    Good-bye and God bless!
     
  2. Police

    Police member

    Hello friends, sorry about my English.

    Jimmy, not go. Continue to post in the forum.

    Remember, in this forum they do not accept diverse opinions. In addition, the moderators do not do their job well.:mad:

    Please Jimmy, don’t go!:confused:

    PhD Pacific Western University (Criminal Justice)
    MA Caribbean University (Criminal Justice)
    BA American University of Puerto Rico (Criminal Justice)
    Certificate University College of Criminal Justice
    Certificate Universidad Metropolitana (Paralegal Investigator):mad:
     
  3. galanga

    galanga New Member

    if we stick to facts...

    There do seem to be road-rage-style exchanges from time to time which upset the combatants and don't end gracefully. I don't think this is the fault of the moderators-- I would think it's beter for them to stand back rather than quashing exchanges when the posters are behaving like lunatics.

    I also don't think there's intolerance of diverse opinions at DegreeInfo. But there can be a strong reaction to misrepresentation and untruth, and the responses to someone who is thought to be lying are pretty fierce.

    There's also considerable annoyance shown to some lines of argument. Examples include threads in which someone expresses an interest in discussing the "legality" of holding a particular degree. I suspect some posters feel that arguments are being made for the rough equivalence of "legality" (nobody ends up in court) with "acceptability" (an employer who understands accreditation says the degree is an acceptable credential for employment). So people get pounded sometimes. I think this could be avoided by posting a response which indicated that the opposing arguments had been understood and then contained a reply to those arguments.

    A good rule of thumb might be to post stuff we'd be willing to say to someone sitting across a desk from us.

    G
     
  4. StevenKing

    StevenKing Active Member

    Some of the posters cited above came very close with their "indirect" bashings. This lessens the overall quality of the information provided here.

    Steven King
     
  5. Bill Grover

    Bill Grover New Member

     
  6. tlamora

    tlamora New Member

    I will no longer post on here

    Jimmy, this is most unfortunate. I for one have enjoyed reading your postings, and although I often disagree politically with your comments I find them thoughtful and intelligent. You really should reconsider.

    Tom
     
  7. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    The history between Jimmy and some of the other posters go way back before I discovered this forum. Perhaps Jimmy had some exchanges with people that opened him him to justified attacks and critism. I don't know. That being said, I have noticed that Jimmy is slammed repeatedly for virtually anything he posts. Why can't people just let the past stay in the past? Geesh!

    I recently came across a thread where someone was asking about the quality of a particular UA seminary. Jimmy responded to the inquiry by suggesting that the UA school, while perhaps decent, was similar in cost to other accredited schools, and suggested that the individual might be better off enrolling in one of the accredited programs elsewhere. I then posted to the thread agreeing with Jimmy on the issue, and suggested the name of an accredited seminary that I thought might work. Uncle Janko then came in, guns blazing, bashing Jimmy for things he had apparently done and said in the past, that had nothing to do with the current thread. Jank also kind of cautioned me, in a hostile manner, about agreeing with Jimmy. This, I believe, is the type of thing Jimmy is complaining about. I can't say I blame him.

    I agree with Bill in that a poster should always be prepared to support any statement he/she makes on this forum. But do prior posts and prior conflicts give someone else the right to constantly attack an individual on new and unrelated issues? No. Stick around Jimmy. Keep it clean moving forward, as it appears you've done, but stick around.

    Pug
     
  8. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

    As I've said before, we (moderators) will always err on the side of vigorous debate when it comes to censoring. We're all adults here, so unless someone blatantly violates the TOS, we're not likely to get involved.

    As for Jimmy leaving, that beyond our control, but I'm not going to delete his account, should he change his mind later.
     
  9. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    <<As I've said before, we (moderators) will always err on the side of vigorous debate when it comes to censoring. We're all adults here, so unless someone blatantly violates the TOS, we're not likely to get involved.>>

    Paragraph 3 of the TOS: "By posting messages at Degreeinfo, You agree, through Your use of this service, that You will not use Degreeinfo to post any material which is knowingly false and/or defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise violative of any law."

    When someone jumps into a thread and levels attacks against a poster for something that has nothing to do with the topic of the thread, it is certainly abusive, hateful, and harassing.

    Pug
     
  10. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    One final post on all this.

    If the mills operated were in the distant past, maybe it wouldn't matter, but we're talking 2000,2001,2002. If the other mills defended weren't currently operating, maybe it wouldn't matter. If the phony degrees were vaunted only long ago, maybe it wouldn't matter. If the mail-order ordinations were decades old and unrepeated, maybe it wouldn't matter. If the recent misdeeds were not consistent with up-to-the minute evasions and abuse and with concerns raised as long as twenty years ago, it would not matter.

    But because this is a forum concerned with the integrity of education, the reality of credentials, the refutation of millists, and, one hopes, the protection of the innocent and the unwary against those who undermine integrity in education and reality in credentialing and thereby bring distance education into disrepute, at times it seemed necessary to call an inveterate flummerer to account, not for a distant past, but for a misleading present sadly consistent with a millist recent past despite bleary claims of repentance and change.

    I appreciate the patience of the moderators and of posters of goodwill with the repetitive posts from me. Unlike Henrik, who confined himself to matters concerning Knightsbridge, and who could be challenged and warned against as a millist on threads directly related to his own "school", this other person offered opinions, abuse, promotions, and unsubstantiated stuff all over the place. He had a right to do so. I also had a right to post a warning where needed. Both rights were, of course, at the discretion of the moderators of this website.

    If this problem has gone away, I will happily confine myself to helping DL inquirers where I can, helping to target mills when I can, indulging in vaguely off-color and out-of-kilter humor because I can, and thoroughly enjoying the free and responsible exchange of opinion, polemic, and intelligence that makes this board a thing of beauty and a joy forever, as long as I can.

    Best wishes to you all from your weary uncle.
     
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Wasn't this the same day Janko saw three reruns of the movie Gunfight at OK Corral? :cool:
     
  12. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member



    Jimmy - I once knew a guy, an acquaintance more than a friend, who was just a regular, average guy. He didn't drink much but he went out one Friday evening, after work, with some friends and after having a few he got into his car to drive home. There was an accident and the only one hurt was this guy. He was paralyzed from the waist down. When I went to see him one of the things he told me was, "There are some mistakes that we just keep paying for." This seems to be your situation.
    Personally, I tend to think of these things in terms of karma. I guess you haven't balanced the scales yet. As you exit I hope you'll accept one small piece of advice. Don't let yourself turn into one of those collegehints assholes. That would only drag you down into more bad karma. I believe in redemption but I believe it is a process, not a discrete event. It's what you do next that really matters.
    Jack
     
  13. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    Jimmy:

    I understand that you are angry and hurt. Perhaps you need to take a break from this place, cool down and put things in perspective. Perhaps others need to calm themselves as well.

    But please don't burn your bridges. I, for one, like you and I value your posts. It would be a shame to lose you.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 10, 2004
  14. Police

    Police member

    Hello friends, sorry about my English

    Good words Bill, I am with you.:)
     
  15. tcnixon

    tcnixon Active Member


    In my opinion, I think this board long ago crossed that line of vigorous debate. Many posts are solely about the person and have little or nothing to do with distance learning programs.

    I think we could all do better, but it appears that some occasional intervention from the moderators may be warranted. Certainly what I read when I come here most are attacks.



    Tom Nixon
     
  16. Craig Hargis

    Craig Hargis Member

    integrity served

    What were Jimmy's crimes that so offended the moral integrity of Uncle Janko? Doctoral degrees from two UA institutions that, in the very early 90's, when Jimmy enrolled, the Bear Guide spoke pretty well of--Bethany and Summit. Summit did not in the end pan out very well, but Bethany is well along in getting at least undergraduate national accreditation. Then Jimmy attempted to reestablish a couple of defunct denominations--both very small ones. This was done entirely legally. Perhaps ill-advised, he tried to open a denominational seminary; that effort was entirely legal, though the administration of degrees awarded was poorly executed. That turned out to be pretty much a fiasco. Jimmy quickly closed that venture. The involvement with the seminaries and revival denominations were probably his bigest mistake. He was man enough to admit, not once or twice, but many times, that he was personally responsible and was wrong. He enrolled in a California approved school in hopes that it might get DETC; it did not. He still finished the degree. Then he investigated a few SA schools but did not actually matriculate. He was excited by the prospect of a SA degree and mentioned his hopes, probably prematurely, of enrolling and his communications with SA professors. Here there was insulting responses from guess who. Then he entrolled in and has completed all but one course in a DETC MA, Now he has enrolled at Trinity an inexpensive option that is an RA candidate--he was frank about it being a risk but hoped for the best. He is looking forward to getting an RA doctorate, even though he has just finished two different Masters. He really wanted someone to say "good job and good luck" and to the credit of this board, many said exactly that. Uncle janko responded with insults, inuendo and the clear intent not to establish "truth" but to humiliate Jimmy. Everyone here knows that this is entirely true: Jimmy could not post that the sky is blue without a sarcastic, mean-spirited response from Unk. Uncle Janko was here to protect the (highly educated, middle aged, and experienced) degreeinfo readers from the misinformation of Dr. Clifton.I love the "I am defender of truth and protector of the innocent" pose that is Unk's specialty. He did this with snide, cruel little cutting remarks-never directly or with compassion. And this by a man who does not sign his name. Uncle Janko's personal crusade against evil consisted in him spending virtually all day every day on this board jumping on everthing Jimmy said. What a servant of goodness!

    Jimmy has done a lot of good in his life that many of us don't know about, and it is not my place to say. But I can tell you this, Jimmy is kind almost to a fault. It was and is my point that we don't all have to like Jimmy--though I do. His past actions have offended some--OK. If you don't like him, don't like him--but he was not given even foundational respect. Rather, the tone and quality of the posts against him were almost unique in their vitrolic nastiness. So Unk, here is one from me to you but with no clever double speak: No man of God speaks with regularity to another human being as you did to Jimmy--none, not one that I have ever known. I need not complete the equation.

    So, if Jimmy finishes what he has started, and has a liitle luck with Trinity, he will hold one RA BA, one DETC MA, two UA MA degrees, two UA doctorates, but one from a school that subsequently got NA, and one RA doctorate. What an ignorant no good bastard! Aren't we glad he is gone?

    I want to tell many people how much I have enjoyed DI, but some of the things that happen here just are not acceptable to me. This too is my last post.

    Craig K. Hargis
     
  17. tlamora

    tlamora New Member

    This simply needs to stop! It is almost surreal that this kind of bickering even occurs on a site supposedly dedicated to education! It is time for the moderators to step in!

    Tom
     
  18. pugbelly

    pugbelly New Member

    Again, this board is not about personality contests. Uncle Janko, let it go buddy! You HATE Jimmy....we all get it. Now let it go! If Jimmy makes a statement that you disagree with, ask him to support it, JUST AS YOU WOULD ANY OTHER POSTER. But I've watched you attack him even when he's right on target about something. That's not constructive criticism, that's not requiring support for a position, that's not spirited debate, that's hatred, and hatred should have no place here.

    Pug
     
  19. BobC

    BobC New Member

    Jimmy,

    Good luck in your future endeavors. I believe there were atleast 3 people on this board that did nothing but hound you, harrass you and follow you around on every post picking a fight, if not creating new ones to your attn: for that very matter. I don't think they fooled anyone but the moderators.

    All the best.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 11, 2004
  20. Police

    Police member

    Hello friends, sorry about my English.

    Jimmy, WE LOVE YOU!!!!!!
    Come back please!!!!:D
     
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