Bethany Divinity College and bad "press"

It appears that the folks at Bethany do not like bad "press" and have been deleting less than positive posts regarding the utility of their degrees.
Go to http://www.bethanybc.edu/ and clikck on the lower right hand link to Forum. There you will notice a thread entitled, Utility of Bethany Degree

 

It appears Jimmy Clifton does the administration of the Bethany site (the removing of messages).

 

I see the admin. of this forum are still having trouble with the dating of messages, for this topic keeps coming up as started on the 24th, which I believe, was yesterday.

 

According to the Bethany site noted above, and an 'apparent' spokesperson for Bethany,

"In more than 20 years' involvement with Bethany, in one dimension or another, you are the first person (who attended Bethany) I have come across who has had some negative remarks regarding that school.'

That is quite an amazing statement. I wonder if there are others who could counter it?

 

I am taking care of the site for now. We have not deleted any posts except Mr. Easton's. He reposted it and we left it there. The only reason I deleted the initial post was that I couldn't believe it was legitimate due to the plethora of grammatical and spelling errors coming from someone who claimed accredited degrees. So, I thought the poster, who did not use his real name at first, was simply a spammer and trouble maker. We do not mind critical posts. We welcome them as they give us an opportunity to respond and clarify matters.

 

Jimmy said,
"The only reason I deleted the initial post was that I couldn't believe it was legitimate due to the plethora of grammatical and spelling errors coming from someone who claimed accredited degrees."

Interesting tactic, Jimmy!

 

Read some of the spam on Degree Info to see how much your writing style and grammar matches theirs. Be honest enough to admit you visit Bethany's site often. Also, be honest enough to admit you are a malcontent who had a bad experience with Bethany and cannot get beyond that. You choose Bethany, it didn't choose you. Take responsibility for your actions and choices, move on and grow up!

 

Jimmy's right, I have visited the site many times today, but very rarely any other time.
I am taking responsibility for my actions, I am trying to help warn others about Bethany, so they do not make such a mistake.

 

It appears, though it may be just me, that the Bethany site is "momentarily" not viewable for unregistered users. One gets this message:
"System Message
Unregistered Users Restricted from Viewing"
I wonder what is wrong?

 

I am sure there have been others. I just merely said "that I have come across." I am also quite positive many RA schools have had students who felt the choice they made was not efficacious.

 

I am sure there have been others. I just merely said "that I have come across." I am also quite positive many RA schools have had students who felt the choice they made was not efficacious. Further, the subject of Bethany has been beaten to death on Degree Info for years. I am finished with this discussion. Nothing else can be added to the debate, no minds will be changed and, when it comes to any future posts regarding Bethany, I quote Kohlat, Vanity of vanities...all is vanity .

 

I am sure there have been others. I just merely said "that I have come across." I am also quite positive many RA schools have had students who felt the choice they made was not efficacious. Further, the subject of Bethany has been beaten to death on Degree Info for years. I am finished with this discussion. Some will choose Bethany, others will not. Nothing else can be added to the debate, no minds will be changed and, when it comes to any future posts regarding Bethany, I quote Kohlat, Vanity of vanities...all is vanity.

 

Well, Jimmy, I have to congratulate you, at least you do not have to get in the last word!

 

Most illuminating.

 

If I am misreading the Bethany website, then I will apologize.

If some fantastic fortune of fate dropped me into a position of being able to suggest remediations for Bethany, then I would make four suggestions. I would say,

"Dear friends, if you wish to appear as respectable in your graduate theological programs, then look, your programs need to approximate that offered in other USA schools which are accredited. Doesn't that make sense? So:

1) Why don't you acquire a cadre of profs with accredited ThDs or PhDs in OT, NT, and Theology if you intend to go on awarding ThDs and PhDs in Theology and in Bible? I mean, my friends, right now you have NO ONE on the faculty with such a qualification, do you? So, don't you think it is a bit presumptuous of you to award these doctorates since you've no one there qualified to supervise such degrees? When you survey the faculty of accredited seminaries, don't you feel just a bit guilty for the pretense of giving docs in areas as Bible/Theology when you have not one member of the faculty on board with an accredited PhD or ThD in those areas?

2) My friends, how can you possibly justify granting doctoral degrees in Bible which require no usage of the original languages? Please, you know better than to say, 'Oh well, everything is translated into English now.' You know that is a very stupid remark. You know the better commentaries , lexicons, journal articles and what not make much use of those languages. You know one cannot possibly at the doctoral level do research in the NT or the OT without a working knowledge of these. Tell you what, why do you not name JUST ONE US RA evangelical school which grants docs in Bible to those who cannot even use the original languages. Please , just name one.

3) My friends, just at look at your description of the requirements for the ThM. Oh, please, no one is that dense..or is it pretense? The USA ThM, my friends, is one year of study AFTER the MDiv which first degree is 90+ units. My ThM was 121 semester units beyond the BA. Please show me JUST ONE accredited US seminary which gives a ThM for such a measly requirement. I mean, even parachurch organizations as the ETS, know a ThM is four years of grad study, not two.

4) And then, oh my, you grant a doctor of theology degree for 32 units after your insignificant ThM requisite. So My MDiv has about the same number of units as your ThD. Don't you see how wicked this is?

Please, if you desire respectability, then pattern, in these four areas, your faculty qualifications and degree requirements, after those US schools which are accredited. If you desire to be similar to these schools in reputation, then why are you so different from these schools in these areas? If you choose not to remediate, then why cry 'foul' when those discrepencies are made known for what they are: Disgusting Deceit! "

 

Bill,
Maybe they will take on some qualified and knowledgeable people like yourself to help them make the adjustments in their Bible/Theology department and get ready for their attempt at recognized accreditation that has been talked about in different quarters.

 

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I'd be happy to give advice, but I don't get the feeling any is desired. These things I write are common knowledge and the ones in charge there already know them.
This is obvious that they do since some claim is made about having profs with proper accredited doc "over" each "track." However, the one over the Theology Track has an accredited DMin not a PhD or ThD. Consequently a little fibbing is going on there. A DMin does not qualify one even South africa to teach ThD/PhD level Bible or Theology. As you know , SATS , itself, has more profs with accredited docs doing theology/Bible than the combined faculties of Golden State and Bethany ; that bit of info should speak volumes! Of course when the others have ZERO, there's no place for SATS to go but up

 

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DAVE, Hi, and help me.


What is the name of the UNACCREDITED seminary whose grads have successfully entered and completed the DTS program? Now there's an example of a genuine worthwhile, unaccredited school. What's that name??

Thanks

 

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Thanks, Ed

That is the one I had in mind, I think. I wanted it as an example of an unaccredited school which in several areas, as faculty , entrance, and program requirements, is not at variance with the way things are done among its accredited sister institutions . Consequently it enjoys a far greater utility and broader approbation than practically any other nonRA school, as your own good friend's present PhD placement well illustrates. Such fine results are possible and occur, though rarely, even in an unaccredited program. But these good effects are very unlikely to occur when a school insists on taking short cuts in those very areas which determine quality: rigor, requirements, and faculty. How sad that, "Give of your best to the Master," has become instead, "Give of your least to get a doc. ."

 

There are a few more examples of quality unaccredited seminaries among independant Baptists (the circle in which I tread), and their grads have no problem entering a school like Dallas. Here are some of them:
Detroit Baptist Theological Seminary
Calvary Baptist Theological Seminary, PA

My posting at Bethany's site was meant to show that if someone is wanting their credits accepted at quality and recognized schools (whether accredited, or like Central or Detroit or others), or wanting academic recognition by those in qualified academia, they should not go to Bethany.

Both Detroit and Central questioned (and rightly so) the credits I received from Bethany. Thankfully, I have learned much since my time of attending Bethany, and for my goals, Bethany just doesn't "make the grade".

Now, maybe they really will make the sizeable improvements needed to "make the grade", but I wonder.