New to the board. I'll be graduating from an accredited state university in a year. MA in history (through their distant learning program). I live relatively close by (60 miles) and have a special assistantship with the school. I am also published (web and in popular, not academic magazines). I want to get a job as an instructor at a community college. What are my chances? Would a Phd from The Union Institute help or hurt? Are community colleges going to scoff? Thanks, Haz
Community college facilitators are usually comprised of those who've worked in industry for several years. True, a Masters degree does help, but you would be better off working for a couple of years for a publishing company or marketing firm. You can gain valuable experience by working before you apply for teaching positions at local community colleges. Also it doesn't hurt to go after that Union Institute PhD. It will give you extra clout when you apply. Just remember, college jobs are not advertised. You will need to network and market yourself in order to be noticed. How do I know all of this? I'm doing the exact same thing myself. My contract with the federal government ends in 2004. I've been in contact with three local community colleges in my area. I also expect to complete my doctoral studies in 2005. good hunting!
No PhD. better than accredited Ph.D.? If it's an accredited Ph.D., why would it "hurt"? Are there accredited Ph.D.s that hurt? Naive question perhaps, but I'd be interested in informed answers.
Re: No PhD. better than accredited Ph.D.? It doesn,t hurt. But many community colleges that offer certificates, diplomas and AA degrees feel that a doctorate is "over kill" and would be best suited for academia (universities and research organizations). Most community colleges hire facilitators who are experienced in a specific industry (IT, electronics, administration, insurance, finance, police sciences, etc.) and hold a Bachelor or Masters degree.
clarification OK, I should clarify some things. One, I'm 44 years old and have worked in industry for years as a trainer and course designer. However, my MA is in History, and what I'm looking for is a career as an instructor of History, the survey type American history courses, at the community college level. My publications are all at the magazine level (though I have a Pulitzer Prize nominated author/Professor recommending one of my book proposals to a big publishing house!) in commerical magazines. These are history magazines, commonly aimed at the history buff, as opposed to being peer reviewed. So, I have years of training//instructor experience, but not in the field I which to teach. I have numerous publication credits under my belt, but no peer review. The phd question, would it hurt? Is not a crack, I'm wondering if community collges would think that a DL degree is somehow worth less than a degree from brick & mortar colleges. I've seen enough posts to think it might. Thanks for the responses, eager for more. Haz
No, I don't think that a DL degree would hurt your chances for being hired because they won't know that you earned your degree via DL. Additionally, the basis for getting hired will be based upon several variables, to include: Your ability to sell yourself during the interview (and during informal meetings prior to and after the interview). This is crucial. Colleges want professors who can get along with the rest of the faculty and with the students. They look for people who can "fit in" to their academic enviroment without drawing ire or complaints. Your prior work history can also play a valuable role. In their minds, will your prior work history enable you to offer the community college something valuable? Like life experience? This can be very subjective. Your academic credentials are also a strong factor. The fact that your degree is DL is moot, unless you raise the issue (or unless they raise the issue, which is highly unlikely). Someone else recommended networking. If this is available to you, then it can give you a political advantage, but it is not a requirement for being hired. The question is: Which combination of variables is most important for your circumstance?
A Ph.D. from Union Institute & University will definitely give you a big leap and an edge over applicants that have MA. I sent applications to three community colleges in July and all three of them invited me for interviews and subsequently offered the positions to me. One of them even offered the chairmanship of Computer Science department to me. Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D. (Nova Southeastern University)
Haz: Some of what Roy is saying is accurate but that is not always the case. I work for a Comm. College now (none-teaching position) and I have seen how most teaching positions are handled. Some factors you will need to consider is the location of the community college and their current population of instructors. I work for a community college that has many other community colleges within a 30-60 min. driving distance but there is only one major university close by. Because of this, we pull a lot of our instructors from this university. Many of them just graduated and our young with no experience but they have 18 graduate hours in the field of teaching. That is the major thing that is considered. And trust me, there are few instructors that hold doctorate degrees and the college loves them. It looks good to SACS and most of those instructors hold the department head postitions. If you are talking about Automotive or a technical program then I would say they do want the work experience and 2 or 4 year degree but when you are talking about the Arts and Sciences (Math, History, Psychology, etc) then they want the Masters with 18 hours in the field and the doctorate will only help. And colleges do post their postions. You can go to www.academic360.com and go to any state and any college to see their postings. However, like Roy said, you can apply all you want but networking and how you present yourself is going to determine if you get in the door. Duff
Common sense advice Get hold of the catalogs for the schools where you would like to teach. See how many of the instructors have PHD's. That will give you some idea of the weight given to that level of education. A glance at the faculty list for the local community college in my area revealed the vast majority of them have masters degrees and the majority of them came from a local state university. Apparently, networking between those two schools is important to getting a job at that community college. However, there are hundreds of community colleges in the USA and almost as many opinions on hiring new instructors. You need to get the scoop on where you want to work. Try teaching as an adjunct, that will provide you networking opportunities as well as allowing you to get to know the college's administration and culture. You may find it is not a good fit for you and save you some heartache down the road. A rule of thumb I heard many years ago was to get on at a community college and then get your PHD. It usually got you a pay raise and the tuition should be tax deductible as it would then be job related. Just my two cents worth.
In response to "Which combination of variables is most important for your circumstance?", I think that all of the above factors are important.
Re: clarification Unless you are planning to apply to universities like UCLA, Yale, SUNY, MIT or USC, the hiring commitees may question your DL doctorate. If your DL doctorate is from a regionally accredited or GAAP university, their is no reason why your credentials should be questioned.
Re: clarification In some instances, having any PhD may actually hinder your chances of getting hired at a community college. And, ironically, the more prestigous the PhD, the more reluctant the school may be to hire you. There are several reasons for this: The first is that community college jobs are often seen as "consolation prizes" for people who couldn't get a tenure track university position. This tends to lead to bad attitudes and poor teaching. Along the same lines, many PhD's consider community colleges stopping off points while they are looking for "better" jobs. Another consideration is that community colleges focus on teaching. There are very few if any opportunities to do research. If a person has a PhD and is more interested in doing research than in teaching, a community college is probably not the place for them. However, as long as you can communicate that you are interested in teaching and that you actually want to do it at the community college level, any PhD will be very helpful. Also, as mentioned earlier, industry experience is important in some disciplines. In social sciences, teaching experience is usually more important. For the record, the SACS guidelines (those of other RA bodies are very similar) for minimum faculty credentials are: Faculty teaching associate's designed for transfer to a baccalaureate degree: a doctoral or master's degree in the teaching discipline or a master's degree with a concentration in the discipline (a minimum of 18 graduate semester hours in the teaching discipline.) Faculty teaching associate's not designed for transfer to a baccalaureate degree: a baccalaureate degree in the teaching discipline, or an associate degree and demonstrated competency in the teaching discipline. http://www.sacscoc.org/pdf/principles%20of%20accreditation1.pdf
Jeff Hampton wrote: "There are several reasons for this: The first is that community college jobs are often seen as "consolation prizes" for people who couldn't get a tenure track university position. This tends to lead to bad attitudes and poor teaching. Along the same lines, many PhD's consider community colleges stopping off points while they are looking for "better" jobs." At forty-four I'm trying to be realistic about my chances. What I want is to teach students history (which is my passion, my bliss) and write history -- which I do now. I think I could argue positively, and forcefully for a teaching position for those reasons without the phd. I have been assured by a college instructor who has a MA only that they do hire. I have a phd friend who was not offered tenure at a local college who says she too knows MAs working in community colleges and she feels that my publications will be the difference. So, I'll be applying for instructor positions for history at the Community college level (I'll actually be searching before I finish my degree since I can get an adjunct with 18 hours) and I'm hoping the publications, though non-peer reviewed, will make the difference. Also, my BA was in history with an emphasis on secondary ed. I have never taught in schools, having gone into training and training design after college. Years of adult education. Will this adult education (business oriented "soft skills.") translate into teaching experience? Networking is my weak point. Glad handing or hanging around was just not taught to me. You stand on your work not on who you know. Thanks so much for these replies, very useful Haz
Re: Re: Community College jobs This is an interesting statement. In Indiana and in Illinois adjunct and tenure positions are advertised all the time (St. Mary of the Woods, Indiana University, Indiana State University, Southern Illinois University, Eastern Illinois University, Oakland City University, etc.
Re: Re: Re: Community College jobs Yes, some colleges do advertise jobs on their websites. However, most positions are filled by networking and connections within each college department. I have been offered a job with Humber College as soon as I complete my contact with the feds. My position was not posted on any website or newspaper.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Community College jobs Hi, I understood you meant newspapers. The schools I listed do, in fact, advertise adjunct and tenure positions in the newspapers. I see them all the time.
Re: Re: No PhD. better than accredited Ph.D.? While quite possibly true for the fields you list, decidedly untrue for English, history, political science, ESL, sociology, math, psychology, etc., etc. ad infinitum. They are looking for very different experience from their instructors. The most common way that I have seen full-time positions at community colleges filled is with adunct instructors, people who have already been teaching for them. As for advertising positions, with public universities in the U.S., in most places they are required to advertise full-time positions (regardless of whether or not they already know who they want). Tom Nixon
