PhD residency

I thought the intent of DL was to afford students the opportunity to pursue education outside the confines of the traditional classroom. Every time I get excited about an accredited DL program, I find out it isn't really DL, they want to meet face-to-face. Some want to see you once every semester, some for a week or so annually, etc. It costs time and money to travel to their locations, not to mention having to take time off from work.
Why are the accreditors so adamant about residency?

 

I think others accreditors should learn from Middle states (www.tourou.edu) and Northcental association (www.ncu.edu)... which does not require any face-to-face interaction.

 

Videoconferencing

With modern technology, any computer equipped with a webcam and a high-speed Internet connection can allow a student and supervisor to have DAILY face-to-face meetings anywhere in the world. Long distnace telephone charges are a thing of the past.

With whiteboards, one can easily write notes, transfer files, charts, graphs, and pictures instantaneously. One can even supervise an examination from any remote location. With modern technology, a student cannot even cheat on an exam.

There is no reason anymore to waste the students time and money by requiring them to come to the university for personal visits. It's just a complete waste of time and money.

These personal face-to-face visits can easily cost more than tuition.

 

With total isolation you become an "independent scholar". Nothing wrong with that.

I would think that upon acceptance within a program a representative could meet the student 1/2 way or at a convenient location to discuss what the student wants to get out of the endeavor and to see if you are really you (ID please). After that you is on your own. If you need consultation or some form of guidance you would schedule a meeting the next time a representative is near you. I think Norwich College of Vermont used to do that in their masters program years ago.

 

There are several reasons why residency is important. During my time at NSU, I spend some 76 days in residency - and if it were up to me, I'd spend more. I hope that the regional accreditors will require residency and stop allowing schools to avoid it.

Many folks that post here are looking for convenience in their eduation - seemingly to an extreme. Why DL can offer this, there are several compeling reasons why residency is beneficial.

Why? Personal contact with faculty is the key reason. Email, telephones and video links are great - but they all lose something in the translation. Face to face contact permits the maximum level of communications. In some fields, like clinical psychology or architecture, nothing short of face to face time works. Would you go to a clinical psychologist who never was evaluated face to face on his/her skills?

Contact with peers is a second key reason. I learned so much from my peers - whether in a formal class or during lunch, or in the hotel the night before class. Getting a group of students together can facilitate learning.

Integrity is a third reason. Comprehensive exams, for example, must be done with a high degree of assurance that the person taking the test is really the person who is earning the degree.

Access to facilities is a fourth concern. In some fields, like the sciences, students need access to labs. Even in fields like business, access to library resources (and librarians) is important. I've worked with many on-line library databases. There are times that I have to go to a physical library to find what I need.

I'm looking forward, for example, to taking classes face to face with live faculty in NSU's new business school facility - located directly next to the largest library in the state of Florida.

Regards - Andy

 

Andy

People learn in different ways. Something we researched rather than accepted conventional and anecdotal opinion. Many people require what you suggest - close faculty contact and inter-group interaction. Many do not, for their life, job styles prevent it (mobility of job location, inability to meet fixed schedules, family commitments, etc.).

You eloquently decribe your learning needs. Please do not ascribe them to all others. Plus, many campus oriented faculty, with prejudices from traditional delivery systems, cannot abide by the idea that some (not all by any means) do not need their services which, to be frank, are highly variable in quality. Having worked for 32 years on campus I am well aware of the difference -some students you see and interact with daily - many, many more you hardly see or speak with from one semester to the next.
As to visting libraries, I recall many times trying to shame students to go and visit university l-i-b-r-a-r-y ('yes, that buliding just across the drive way with the large black door') to consult some recommended texts.

You may not accept these points but DL, properly provided, does not require everything that you suggest worked for you is necessary for everybody else. From my vantage point, seeing many thousand examples of DL students using a different learning model to yours, I can safely assert that yours is not the only DL model that works. With 7,000 MBA graduates passing my vantage point, residency may be important to you (and there is nothing wrong with that for you) but for many of our students in our market segment it would mean no MBA at all.

DL can be the alternative no MBA (and nobody can ever accuse us of have a soft MBA programme).

 

Andy,
I agree with you that residencies are a critical part of the learning process especially at the Doctoral level. When deciding on where to apply for my PhD all of the programs I considered had a residency requirement and I don't think I would have seriously considered a program that didn't have the requirement.

All that being said, its still just a personal preference. Alot of people what the full convenience that DL program is intended to provide, and while I think most students would benefit greatly from a residency, its ultimately up to the individual learner to decide what's most important to them.

 

Anybody who isn't utterly in the back of beyond can get access to a college/university library for use in DL. Here's where I got borrowing privileges, all within 2 hours of where I live:
Andrews
Aquinas
Calvin
Hope
IU South Bend
St Mary's
Valparaiso.

Total cost p.a.: $55.

(Grand Valley, Lake Michigan, and Western Mich are also available, but I have not needed their resources so far.)

Now Notre Dame wanted $500 p.a. for a guest borrower card, so I told them to bugger off. Kalamazoo College told me I was white trash and couldn't touch their precious books. Other than that, the various college libraries have been quite ready to help and very kind in their assistance.

 

What about uofM and MooU?

 

There are at least two reasons:

1. The accrediting agency requires it (so there's no point in complaining about it).

2. Studies show that programs with at least some human contact have higher success rates (so it's done for your own benefit).

Dave A

 

Professor Kennedy - You make some good points here. I agree that not everyone learns the same way. Some folks can certainly work more independently than others. But just because a students can learn on his own - is this optimal? There is a lots of literature out on the benefits of collaborative learning. While some of this can be done on the Internet - face to face group interaction is a powerful way to teach.

There are some strong arguments for residency in PhD programs - the point of this thread (but seemingly not of your reply). While students may be able to complete masters level courses, as you point out, without close faculty contact, what about doctoral level research? The support faculty and peers provide is quite significant.

I teach in MS and MBA programs that are totally distance based, as you do. I'm not totally satisfied with the format, but I live with it. In courses like statistics, I find the limitations of electronic media to be especially troubling. Some students do fine - but many struggle. If only I could talk to them face to face, draw a picture on the board.....

Regards - Andy

 

residency

I realize some students need the traditional interaction, but I've had 20+ years of collaborative learning and peer/faculty support. After completing a M.S. online, I spent more time corresponding
with the instructor and peers than I ever did face-to-face. I managed to collaborate on an article my partner and I succeeded in having published, and formed a friendship that continues to this day-entirely online. I completed a thesis with ample supervision and critique by committee. The point is, there are some of us ready to complete the research and study requirements of a doctorate without needing the residency, and its a shame the accreditation agencies don't acknowledge this group. We should not be limited to a handful of institutes offering one or two programs-online learning has been proven
effective many times over. I don't want/need/care to spend a few thousand dollars giving up my vacation time to travel to a location for advisement that could be handled in a phone call or two, a videoconference, or even a basic email discussion. I work full time, have family obligations and endless extracurricular meetings and conferences to attend-and my best learning is done in my pajamas, at my computer, after dinner and laundry.

 

Can a doctorate be completed completely nonresidentially by independent study? Oh, I guess so. But that doesn't make it a good idea.

Too many times around here, residency gets portrayed as a jail sentence, just putting one's time in. This isn't fair at all. As Andy notes, there are many great benefits to residential periods. My wife (who's way smarter than I am) calls it "presence-ing." It is amazing what can happen when motivated learners get together, face-to-face. I will forever be indebted to my peers and faculty due to the residencies I experienced in my program. Those situations take you out of your narrow silo and bring you together with others who, while on the same basic path, are widely divergent in methods, thinking, progress, etc.

I wouldn't want to do a doctorate without some residency. A master's maybe.....

 

Do I prefer a doctoral program that requires residency? My answer is YES. If I have to do it all over again, I will choose a low-residency program. I will even prefer an increase in the number of days spent on residency. Aside from meeting face-to-face with faculty members and students, doctoral residency offers a unique opportunity to network with classmates. I am an adjunct faculty member at two universities in New Jersey partly because of doctoral residency. I met professors at these colleges during my doctoral residency.

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D. - (Nova Southeastern University)

 

Some prefer face to face meetings and others do not. I see an unnecessary divide forming here between DL with residency and those with no residency just like traditional BAM and DL education in general.

The point is it does not matter whether residency is required or not as long as quality work is produced. I take an exception to the notion that quality work cannot be produced without residency. Quality work is being produced on a dialy basis.

As for Dr. Okonkwo's question about Psychologists with no residency? I ask Dr. Okonkwo if he will see a PharmD (Pharmacist) with no residency? The fact is he won't even know it. You can develop friends online than you could in BAM. You can also produce team work online as you would face to face.

While some may have glowing tributes to short residencies, I have heard from some especially NSU how worthless it was for them. These are individual perceptions which does not necessarily reflect the quality of the program.

As for the issue of clinical, clinical are never done on campuses any way for the most part. Clinical can and are being achieved through arrangements with clinical providers. I have three students right now in my office - one DL meeting their clinical requirements. You know what? There is no difference in the level of performances in all three students as a result of the mode of delivery. I am in health care sector.

Accreditation does not necessarily require residencies otherwise, schools that do not require it won't be accredited. With very few limited exceptions there are no professional accreditation for research doctorates (please note that PharmD, DBA, PsyDs etc are not considered research doctorates).

Godwin

 

For me, the issue is simple. Does the program involve laboratory or hands-on practical work that can't be accomplished at a remote site? If so, then some amount of on-campus work will be necessary. That probably means more than a short residency and makes DL problematic.

But if the reasons for the residency can't be explained in words, if they are just some feeling of emotional "rightness" or something, then I think that the residencie can be made optional.

I remember arguing with Levicoff about this, and asking him precisely what the residency period that he felt was so critical actually accomplished that couldn't be done remotely. The best he could respond with was 'going out for a beer'.

I don't want to dismiss that. Emotional bonding and friendships are a big part of networking, and networking is a big part of finding opportunities. But are you really going to make a real lasting friendship in a few days of meetings with strangers that you couldn't make over several years of telecommunications contact with them? In other words, I'm not sure that any short residency could replace working closely with people over an extended period of time in an on-campus program, in terms of the personal relationships. People who really need this emotional aspect should perhaps rethink their choice of DL.

But it isn't written in stone that DL programs must be isolated "lone ranger" experiences, or that students can't contact one another and their professors, informally discuss what they are doing or even operate in teams. It seems to me that sometimes the problem isn't so much the lack of face-to-face meetings as it is the poor interactivity of some DL programs.

Bottom line: As I see it, the question to ask is, 'what does the residency accomplish?' If something critical is taking place, then is a short residency period even adaquate to get it done? But if nothing critical is being accomplished, aren't students justified in asking whether they really need to travel half-way around the world?

 

I do know that in Washington, DC area there is a strong Walden students support group that meet regularly. Those pursuing similar degree program do meet more often. Management and policy making these days are done remotely. It is not uncommon to video link across oceans and make policies that few years ago would have required jet travel.

I second the argument that if you think face to face meeting is important to you to rethink DL education. It does not take long to develop friends even online. I am a new member in this forum. In the short period I have been a member I have already developed a couple of relationships that are still evolving. I have been communicating on a very regular basis with two individuals across the country and have shared limited personal information.
I have also shared personal email addresses with a number of individuals as well that have not gone beyond exchange of email addresses.

Bottom line, it is possible to do online what you can do face to face except ofcourse drink beer. You can do that on graduation day or activities leading to it.

 

Andy

Reading my earlier contribution I see why you got the impression I was going "off thread". I spent sometime on my experiences on campus (which I never left since graduating) and then went onto discuss DL in the MBA, which does not need residence, and which you are quite right is not doctoral work and it may need some minimal residence, at least for discussions with the supervisor of the thesis.

I am not convinced however that the companionship, "bonding" bit, is necessary. Doctoral theses are the work of loners and occasional contact with supervisory faculty is necessary, perhaps done best face-to-face or in presentations of chapter themes in faculty groups.

Some people may not need even that contact. This was Bruingrad's original point. One size does not suit all. He/she asks why "accreditors" insist on residency, and the answer is probably they do not know. It's what the conventional wisdom requires.

I think, however, there is an assessment angle here and which only viva voce sessions can detect lack of indepth recall of why they did this or that. No contact at all exposes the attestors attesting to the fitness of somebody other than the person who wrote the thesis. Attestors are expected to be specialists in the area too, including in the literature survey, and this can detect fraud. This puts the onus onto the attestors to really grill the doctoral candidate, and not just indulge in a friendly chat. The candidate has to defend the thesis - make 'em sweat while they do so. An hypothesis cannot be proven but it can be disproven.

Airborne ranger: "The accrediting agency requires it (so there's no point in complaining about it)."

I disagree. Pedagogy and standards are not to be decided by "accreditors" and agencies. That is a faculty responsibility. There is every point in complaining about it and disregarding the views of people unqualified to pontificate on unresearched pedagogy.

 

I can't recall any PharD program than can be completed entirely through DL. At Nova, the first fours years of PharmD program requires on-campus instructions and labs. It is the last two years of the program that may be completed through a combination of online and short-residency formats.

 

The way I see it is such that everyone learn differently. Some would learn better with a face-to-face communication with an instructor, and some do not. I prefer total independence. I wish I knew about schools like NorthCentral University before I started my doctoral program at Texas.

Granted, my Ph.D was a typical residential program. I completed my BS in Mechanical Engineering, MS in Engineering Management (Industrial Safety), and Ph.D in Management (Strategic Management/Dissertation was on Safety Engineering/Education Approcahes...) from the University of Texas (Longhorn forever). If I have to do the doctoral program again, I would prefer total independence without face-to-face communication with any instructor. For all the required doctoral courseworks that I completed in the classrooms, I see no reasons why I could not have completed them independently.

With the exception of science related programs, Mr. Oko is correct that "Bottom line, it is possible to do online what you can do face to face except ofcourse drink beer." I will challenge him one day in the future, for the beer context. Thank you all.