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Thread: cheap EDd

  1. #1
    adelheid is offline Registered User
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    cheap EDd

    I am in the final stages of my MEd by DL, through coursework only. I enjoy this kind of learning experience, and am looking for a similar EdD by coursework only degree programme. I am only aware of Edith Cowan University (Australia) offering such kind of programme. However, their fees are a hefty US$9000 (roundabout) - which is far too much for my budget.

    Would anyone out there know of a similar programme for LESS fees?

    adelheid:)
    "Behave! - Only if I can't help it."

  2. #2
    tcnixon is offline Registered User
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    Re: cheap EDd

    Originally posted by adelheid
    I am in the final stages of my MEd by DL, through coursework only. I enjoy this kind of learning experience, and am looking for a similar EdD by coursework only degree programme. I am only aware of Edith Cowan University (Australia) offering such kind of programme. However, their fees are a hefty US$9000 (roundabout) - which is far too much for my budget.

    Would anyone out there know of a similar programme for LESS fees?

    adelheid:)
    The University of South Africa is always a good bet for inexpensive, but high quality, degrees. They do offer doctorates in education .

    UNISA Faculty of Education



    Tom Nixon
    Author, Complete Guide to Online High Schools (2012)
    http://BestOnlineHighSchools.com

  3. #3
    Jack Tracey is offline Registered User
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    Tom's correct in saying that UNISA is a good bet for an inexpensive doctorate. However, those degrees are research degrees, not coursework degrees. I could be wrong but I don't think you'll find a doctoral degree program anywhere that is done entirely by coursework. The whole idea behind a doctorate is to add to the existing knowledge base. This means doing a dissertation. As you're looking at programs you may want to check out the EdD program at the University of Nebraska - Lincoln . It is perhaps the cheapest RA EdD program in the USA.
    Jack

  4. #4
    Christopher Green is offline Registered User
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    just a thought

    it sounds like you are already pretty set on the EdD . I was investigating the degree when I started this thread.

    Essentially, what I learned from this thread is unless one is shooting for a kind of liscensure (eg., shooting for a PsyD), one should probably not shoot for a doctorate in a field when there is a comparable "PhD" to it.

    in other words, some degrees are created like the EdD that create confusion because there is also a PhD in Education . When choosing between them, keep in mind that schools are changing and some degrees are being forced into a more flexible mold. I think the EdD is becoming less credible in the culture today because people naturally gravitate to the "PhD" if there is one that is comparable. If you choose a degree in a field that is not the "PhD," and a PhD is actually offered also, the PhD will always outstrip your degree, and there is no control as to how much the "non-PhD" doctorate will be watered down in the future because it doesn't have the title that the culture deems necessary to protect.

    Fortunately for you, the U. of Nebraska-Lincoln has a PhD in Education that is available via DL and does include coursework.

    Chris

  5. #5
    obecve is offline Registered User
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    Frankly Chris, I am not sure what the heck you are talking about. I don't think there is a tinker's damn of a difference between an Ed.D. and a Ph.D. in Educaton and universities apparently don't think so either. I chose to earn an Ed.D. and have never regretted it! My experience has been that people simply ask if I have doctorate. When it is verfied that I do, I compete favorably. I am currently a director of a state division wih a $110 million budget, a member of the clinical medical faculty at the University of Washington School of medicine and a member of the adjunct graduate faculty of 3 other universities. I have been repeatedly offered fulltime graduate positions in major universities, but have chosen to remain in a leadership role in state government. Never...not once...has the fact that I have an Ed.D. rather than a Ph.D. come into question. The only question has been whether or not I had a doctorate. Unfortunately, I think your advise is misleading!
    Michael O'Brien, CRC, CVE
    BA, University of Missouri-Kansas City
    M.A.Ed. Chadron State College
    Ed.D. Oklahoma State University

  6. #6
    PaulC is offline Registered User
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    I have to agree with Michael O. Three of the four faculty members on my dissertation committee were EdD not PhD. One is currently the Dean of Graduate Studies at a school in Europe and one was the former Dean of the School of Education at UMass and currently Eminent Professor of Educational Reform at Old Dominion. I think EdD works just fine in academe.

  7. #7
    oxpecker is offline Registered User
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    FWIW, I also agree with Michael, even though my own doctorate is a PhD.

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    Rich Douglas is offline Registered User
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    While there are, in some situations, differences in the approach to the dissertation--the Ed.D. is sometimes more flexible and pragmatic--there doesn't seem to be any practical difference in terms of acceptance and utility between the Ed.D. and the Ph.D.

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    Christopher Green is offline Registered User
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    You may think I'm off my rocker, that's fine. I would encourage you to check out the experience I had with USC that I explained in this thread.

    Let me know what you think,

    Chris

  11. #10
    obecve is offline Registered User
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    I read your thread and do not see anything that would change the infromation I offered you.

    If you are going to work in the United Staes there is no meaningful difference between th Ed.D. and The Ph.D. in education . CHeck any university's list of professors, deans, even presidents and you will see a large number of both degrees listed. Additionally, check out Teachers College at Columbia University, probably the most prestegious education college in this country, they still offer an Ed.D. I would suspect this degree would be equally accepted in any setting.

    Much of the usefulness of a degree will depend somehwat on you. How well do you present yourself? What have you published or presented? What is the quality of your work history ? Finally the quality of your own dissertation and your ability to present you knowledge related to that will be very helpful.

    I think what is more important is finding a school you are comfortable with, that meets your specifc educational interests and that has professors who can support you research interests and needs. If these needs are met, you will be fine in any job search.
    Michael O'Brien, CRC, CVE
    BA, University of Missouri-Kansas City
    M.A.Ed. Chadron State College
    Ed.D. Oklahoma State University

  12. #11
    Christopher Green is offline Registered User
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    CHeck any university's list of professors, deans, even presidents and you will see a large number of both degrees listed. Additionally, check out Teachers College at Columbia University, probably the most prestegious education college in this country, they still offer an Ed.D. I would suspect this degree would be equally accepted in any setting.
    Arguing from the status quo will not satisfy the response that I think is needed by the argument that i have set up.

    Just because Ed.D.'s function equally as Ph.D.'s in Education now does not guarantee they will always. The value of a degree, furthermore, is how it will contribute to one's satisfaction/vocation over time. Thus, a doctoral degree investment needs to be done with great precision.

    My experience with USC boils down to one fact: the EdD is offered through multiple venues at the same school, while the main campus alone offers the PhD. That decision alone makes the PhD more difficult to obtain.

    I argue when there are two doctoral degrees that are in the same field, and one is a PhD, the other has the possibility of deterioration, especially given the context of our information explosion.

    Given that the PhD is always preferred as the "superior" degree in the public eye, and when a school chooses to make one more difficult to obtain, the EdD has more potential for deterioration than the PhD.

    Potential for deterioration is all that I'm after as an attribute of the EdD .

    One of my advisors in graduate school is in charge of a graduate education program at a regionally accredited university. He related to me recently that he had decided to change all of the doctoral programs in education to the "PhD." Reason being, according to him, the EdD could be more open to deteriorating in the future. That is all. That does not mean it has less value inherently.

    Also, when the accreditors came in to do an audit of the program, they needed to check the EdD program to make sure it would be the equivalent of a PhD in Education . That means that an EdD could be, or at times could not be considered as the equivalent of the PhD in Education .

    Chris

  13. #12
    drwetsch is offline Registered User
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    Chris,

    If I read you correctly you are stating that the Ed.D. will be less credible than the Ph.D. because it is more open to degrading or I would assume you mean less rigorous than the Ph.D. What hasn't been established is the basis for this claim other than you have pointed to some faculty who believe this to be true. My question is Why do they believe this?

    Thanks,

    John
    John R. Wetsch, Ph.D.

    B.S. '01 University of North Dakota
    B.S. '84 Excelsior College (USNY/Regents)
    M.A. '89 Antioch University, The McGregor School
    Master of Astronomy, '02, University of Western Sydney
    Ph.D. '94 Nova Southeastern University

  14. #13
    Christopher Green is offline Registered User
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    Thanks for your question, John.

    My advisor mentioned to me that the EdD was being "dumbed down" in places, so he changed the program to a PhD. His action was simple, though, because the EdD at Trinity was formerly a research degree. So he simply changed the title, and had the accreditors come "make sure" it was the equivalent.

    My argument is that the proof is in the practice. While there is little curricular difference between the EdD 's that USC offers and the PhD's, the PhD is only offered in one location, the "main campus." That means, in practice, as a degree, it requires more centralized supervision. The EdD , however, is somehow flexible enough in its curriculum that it can be offered in more ways, in more places. This says, "easier degree." However, no doctoral student would ever say anything in his/her program is "easy." We all know that.

    It may also be important to mention that, while one can earn an EdD with less research than a PhD in Edu., one (probably) can never earn a PhD in Edu. with less research than an EdD .

    On top of that, it simply creates confusion to have two doctorates in the same field with two different titles. If I had the option, I don't know why I would rather go with the degree that is "not the PhD." It's not like choosing between an MA in Education and an MEd . The "PhD" has a significant cultural prestige, and when the professional degree is added to it as a companion, it automatically loses with respect to degree of credibility. That, of course, is all a matter of general perception. But this is a problem, I think, that is unique to the EdD because the PsyD includes a lisence for practice in a way that the EdD does not. The EdD , perhaps more than any other professional doctorate, is intended to compete on the same level with the PhD. IMHO I think the creation of the EdD may be a mistake.

    Chris

  15. #14
    obecve is offline Registered User
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    It is reasonable for you to take whatever academic path you choose to take. I think my argument included choosing a degree that best matched your needs. Obviously perception is part of your needs. However, it is unreasonable to continue to push that perception when the current reality does not match. Functionally there is no difference. By the way it is possible to have a Ph.D. with less research than an Ed.D. In my own case, I had more research hours than many of the Ph.D. students, had a substantially longer dissertation than many of the Ph.D. students and completed more in depth and and complicated analysis than many of the Ph.D students. Again your perception was not precise. A final thought, arguing that he degree may some day diminish and therefore has less value is really not supported by your arguments. We could equally argue that it might grow in prestige. NO evidence exists in either direction. The only evidence that does exist is university hiring practices. At this point, both appear to be hired equally well. From a practitioner standpoint, take a look at how many superintendents and public school officials hold Ed.D. compared to Ph.D.

    When you get your Ph.D., I think you will find that those of us with Ed.D.'s will give you a good run for your money in the world of work! I sincerely wish you good luck in your Ph.D. search and hope you find the degree that best matches your future plans.
    Michael O'Brien, CRC, CVE
    BA, University of Missouri-Kansas City
    M.A.Ed. Chadron State College
    Ed.D. Oklahoma State University

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  17. #15
    Peter French is offline member
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    Re: cheap EDd

    Originally posted by adelheid
    I am in the final stages of my MEd by DL, through coursework only. I enjoy this kind of learning experience, and am looking for a similar EdD by coursework only degree programme. I am only aware of Edith Cowan University (Australia) offering such kind of programme. However, their fees are a hefty US$9000 (roundabout) - which is far too much for my budget.

    Would anyone out there know of a similar programme for LESS fees?

    adelheid:)
    The University of Southern Queensland have a 'thematic' EdD that one of my staff is completing. It is essentially a series of 15-20K word fully researched papers rather than a 75-85K thesis as for a PhD. It seems rigorous enough and it is making him sweat -and I like that!

    I also am aware from a commitee that I am a member of, [RA= ... sorry about that] that other EdD programs out here will follow this form, and there is already a coursework PhD from ANU but only the reduced size 'thesis' is formally assessed - the coursework is theoretically ignored - an interesting concept!

    As you may or may not be aware, we do not pay one single cent for doctoral degrees out here provided that there is a proven 67% research content - the current change is that it is realised that 'content' does not necessarily mean a 'thesis' as has been the case more or less to date. So keep signing up for our degrees as it helps fund our international travel costs as we get these paid also, and an office, and a secretary [fugly though] ...

    But this is Australia, and I am me, so why should anyone take any notice?

    And for those who do, we sent far more cavalry to Iraq per capita than US did, but then we also lost far more per capita in Bali than US did on September 11.

    Is this significant? To some of us, very much so ...

    P J French MEd
    Melbourne, Australia
    [keeping George Brown's wife happy while he is away - but don't tell him that!]
    Last edited by Peter French; 04-26-2003 at 02:00 AM.

  18. #16
    adelheid is offline Registered User
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    Re: Re: cheap EDd

    Originally posted by Peter French
    and there is already a coursework PhD from ANU but only the reduced size 'thesis' is formally assessed - the coursework is theoretically ignored - an interesting concept!
    Peter, could you please explain that? That sound very interesting! I accessed ANU's website, but couldn't find any info.

    adelheid:)
    "Behave! - Only if I can't help it."

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